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Cap 232 options
Our Cap 232 design has been a long time in the works. We've been through several design iterations to get a plane that flies well and is strong, light, and looks nice. I think we've done this.
But as we all know every airplane is a compromise of strength, weight and cost. The more one leans on one or two factors the more the third one gets out of hand. Making a great effort to build a plane both light and strong will certainly result in one that is expensive. If we concentrate on strengh and cost I guarantee it will be heavy. Anyway, this new plane flies great at 18 pounds with a MVVS 58, should be just about the same as one of our 28% planes in the 17 lb. range with a DA-50. But the fuse is much larger than our 28% planes, leaving us some options. Many people have asked if it's OK to use a larger engine on the 28% Edge/Extras. I've heard of people using a ZDZ-80 and other huge engines. I always advise against this, but they do it anyway. With the Cap I want to make the plane as versatile as possible. My plan is to make the plane available in two versions. The first will be the 17lb plane with wing area similar to our 28% planes, 85" span. This is what we have been designing and testing. We also will be making the Cap available with a larger, stronger set of wings to expand its ability to fly with a larger engine. I hope to offer wings that will expand it to 89" span and a little over 1500 sq. inches of area. They will be sheeted foam and have the CG moved forward on the fuse about 1" allowing use of a larger engine like a ZDZ-80, 3w75, etc. The cowl is huge, wide enough to support small twins like a Brison/Fox 4.8, ZDZ-80b2, or the Roto 70 twin. Some reinforcing to the firewall will be needed, adding a little more weight. With a ZDZ-80, the 89" wings and some firewall strengthening, the Cap should weigh about 19 pounds, certainly no more than 20. Anybody out there ever flown a ZDZ-80 at 19 pounds? It's exciting. Will this make it look weird? With the larger wings the cap will have exactly the same proportions as the H9 33% Cap, just at the 30% size. With the smaller wings it's lighter and the slightly smaller wings are not really noticeable. Fly it with a DA-50 or for outrageous performance the Evo 58. Comments? TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
Sounds like a plan Tom. You were talking about a 19 lbs. plane with a ZDZ 80, and I'm sure you already have one to offer. In fact the composite Sukhoi might even weigh a little less with an engine that big. But check this out. A guy at my new flying field has one of those 2.3M Comp ARF Extras and he said a BME 110 would fit in the cowl without cutting it. A BME 110 on a 18-19 lbs. plane...now that's insane vertical....
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RE: Cap 232 options
I agree, that's pretty crazy, but that may be what's needed to do good 3d at 5000' altitude.
TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
Id say whichever combination would give you the greatest abilities with the plane overall. Sure 28% is really a great way to go for a 50cc plane that you can really knock around, but the closer you get to 1/3rd scale the better it flies. The ZDZ 80 in a light plane would be very cost effective, and probably would fly much better than its 28% cousin.
The downfall of the original BME Edge was the lack of wing area. The new release is almost identical, with a few minor exceptions; the most noted is the larger wings (both in span and chord). Looking at the GP Cap 580 I cant help but wonder how the heck it got so heavy. I would imagine a WH Cap around the same size but lighter would open a lot of options. Im sure where the ZDZ 80 would work, someone could also get away with a BME 110. Very interested though. One thing Caps do really well is tumbles :) |
RE: Cap 232 options
I will say that at 18 lbs it does not NEED bigger wings, and at 17 lbs it will be awesome. It flies much like the 28% Extra 300L except it flies like a Cap, but it has that much wing area.
The bigger wings are just for weights abouve 19 lbs. I don't want to give anybody the impression that it needs bigger wings, it doesn't. This plan is just to get 2 planes out of 1 design. Aeroworks did the same thing. They used the same fuse on the 31% and 33% Extras, just different wings for different classes of engines. And their 31% Extra is/was a great flying airplane. TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
Put a removable engine pod in it so we can swap engines with the wings & the consumer will get two for the orice of one as well! I fly at 3 different clubs, one of which a 33% plane has a difficult time landing do to short approaches from the ends of the runway. 28-30% planes do all right there. The other two fields are large enough to fly anything at. I could see a market for a plane that you could set up for a 50, then later on set up for a 80-100 just by changing the wings & engine.
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RE: Cap 232 options
The man has a point there :) More or less what Tom said bout the Aeroworks plane. Only had experience with one Aeroworks plane, the 35% Extra 300L. Seemed to fly very well after I totally re-built the plane for someone. With big planes dont ever cheap out on servos or depend on older questionable servos.
Any pictures of the prototype Caps? The whole scheme thing would be neat to see and be able to give input on. |
RE: Cap 232 options
I could see a market for a plane that you could set up for a 50, then later on set up for a 80-100 just by changing the wings & engine. Making it hot-swappable is not really practical, but if someone buys it for a 50, they can later get the bigger wings and put a bigger engine on it without starting over. TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
Sounds like a plan to me. To bad I already have a couple of Caps.
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RE: Cap 232 options
Tom, good thinking.
I think I will get on the list for the bigger wings version, I just happen to have a ZDZ 80 b2 lying around. |
RE: Cap 232 options
How is this cap in inverted harriers, seems to be one area some caps are weak in?
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RE: Cap 232 options
Good question, I have no answer yet. We haven't flown this one enough for me to have a good knowledge of every maneuver. I'll try to get back to you soon on that.
TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
1 Attachment(s)
How about the new ZDZ-80RV-J Black?
A little more weight than the old 80 but about 20% more power! Swinging a 26" to 28" 2 blade or 24" to 25" 3 blade prop! Talk about a rocket, looking to get one soon, should give MVVS something to shoot for! Link on Info below http://www.zdz-motor.de/index.html?l...d=38608.742014 |
RE: Cap 232 options
The bigger wings should be a good plane for the brison/sachs/fox 4.2s out there that are to heavy for a 50 cc plane but wont cut it on a 33%
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RE: Cap 232 options
Tom
I am already in line for the 28% CAP. I would have to see the larger version before commiting to one. I am a HUGE fan of the Hangar 9 CAP as it was a beut and flew very well imho Do you think that with CF wing and stab tube along with lipo's you could get the weight in the low 17's, high 16's? Not to get too off topic but has color schemes been finalized? I am a fan of the 'WH" shcemes as its something different. matt |
RE: Cap 232 options
ORIGINAL: DiabloKid Tom Not to get too off topic but has color schemes been finalized? I am a fan of the 'WH" shcemes as its something different. matt Might just have to add another Hare! |
RE: Cap 232 options
Dang I wish it wasn't so expensive to ship those big boxes up here to Canada!
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RE: Cap 232 options
Dang I wish it wasn't so expensive to ship those big boxes up here to Canada!
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RE: Cap 232 options
Do you think that with CF wing and stab tube along with lipo's you could get the weight in the low 17's, high 16's? Not to get too off topic but has color schemes been finalized? I am a fan of the 'WH" shcemes as its something different. matt Color schemes have not been finalized. Ideas are welcome. Maybe I should have another design contest. What do you think? TF |
RE: Cap 232 options
ORIGINAL: rctom Maybe I should have another design contest. What do you think? TF go for it :) matt |
RE: Cap 232 options
The ole Cap 21 was a pretty color scheme, clean but nice..............
I have seen that scheme around in awhile. |
RE: Cap 232 options
David,
I got the 58 and it looks great, thanks. How much is it to ship those boxes to Canada? Tom, Yea, go for the design contest! |
RE: Cap 232 options
stalled and damaged my Extra LX yesterday! OH NO!!! [:@] Damage was not bad and a friend is going to repair the damage. I will fly it until winter and plan on replacing it with the CAP. I am soooooo excited about this airplane now!
Any updates Tom? Have you thought about the light teal design thats on he YAK for the CAP? Would look smooth matt |
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