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YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Old 03-29-2008, 09:18 PM
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insalacosm
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Default YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Hello Troy - I have the older version of the YS-63 and am trying to break it in but it is knocking as I advance the throttle above idle. I'm running Wildcat 20/20, an APC 13x6 prop, it was about 55 degrees out, the engine is mounted inverted, and I now have about two tanks through it. It idles great but as I advance the throttle it starts to knock, and will come to an abrubt stop if I continue advancing the throttle. An experienced gas engine builder throught the knocking sound meant it was firing like a two stroke and said it must be too lean. I tried richening the high speed valve but it made it worse, so I leaned it slightly (now about 1.5 turns out) and was able to advance to full throttle but the knocking problem continues even at this setting. I'm afraid to lean it any further since I'm trying to break it in, and was wondering if you had any ideas what may be causing the knocking. I'm getting about 9.9k RPMS at full throttle which seems about right.

I'll be switching to 30% nitro which may help, but I'm still concerned with the knocking.

Thanks for the help,
Steve
Old 03-29-2008, 09:20 PM
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wessco
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

I'm not Troy, but I had the same problem one time. Make sure your prop is tight.
Old 03-29-2008, 09:27 PM
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insalacosm
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

yeah, it's tight, the prop isn't budging. Thanks for the thought.
Old 03-29-2008, 10:13 PM
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Troy Newman
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

If its lean on the throttle up Detonating...then you need richen the regulator.

You are a little heavily loaded on the prop...I would try a slightly smaller prop to get your rpms up a little.
You need to be around 10.5K to 11K for best results.

The 30% heli will help the rpm issue...it will also make the engine run better...but you are still going to have to richen it a bit.


Down and dirty this is how to set the engine

Start it warm it up slowly...about 4000rpm for a say 30secs to a minute.

Then throttle it up Using a Tach set the Peak rpm and back it off about 200-300rpm. This rpm should be about 10.5 to 11k on the 53's and 63's A prop I know works is the 12-7 or 12-8 on 30% heli. Your 13-6 should be good too on the 30% heli Cool Power. I click at a time waiting a few seconds for the change to take affect. The fuel has a long way to go before your change will take affect.

Next go to 4000rpm with your tach. This will be a 1/4 throttle position or about. hit 4000 rpm and watch the tach. Surging up and down is lean. Loading up and slowing down over time at the 4000rpm is rich. Watch it for about 30-45secs....and see if its lean or rich. The regulator screw works the same as a HS needle valve. IN or CW is Lean. OUT or CCW is rich. Any changes you make to the regulator will affect the other settings so re-set them Do the HS again and then check the midrange or regulator adjustment again. 1/8th turns are good here.

Idle mixture is fine tuned by the air bleed screw in the throttle barrel. The rpm where you set this mixture adjustment is at 2000rpm. This screw does nothing above about 2200 rpm...and its all regulator above that. So the same test surging up and down or dropping to a high reving idle then cutting to the low 2000rpm is also lean. Hitting a 2000rpm solid then loading up and slowing down is rich. Now since this is an air bleed screw and not a Needle valve it controls air flow. More air (Opening it) will lean the mixture and Less air (Closing it) will richen....So CW is rich and CCW is Lean.



Now once you get this all set this way its really really close. If you get a slight detonation on throttle up...and the engine is warm and up to temp...then richen the regulator screw just a little...maybe 1/8th or less.


OK one more word of warning. Don't run the engine for long periods of time on the ground unless it is at low 4000rpm and below. It will get hot quickly and any changes you make will not be correct when its too hot. My rule of thumb is get it close and then let it completely cool off then check the mixture again...Fine tuning ti all along.

When the engine is cold and the tank pressure is not up to the proper number it will act a little lean on a thrown open throttle. The pressure in the tank is what delivers fuel. The engine SUCKS zero fuel unless it is at 2000rpm. Above 2000rpm the engine relies on the fuel to be pushed through the pressure regulator to feed it. So if you throttle it up too fast and the pressure is not built up it will detonate and go lean on you...

This should do it...Your HS needle it not far all they will vary a bunch depending on the fuel and the conditions you run. going from a 20-20 fuel to a 30% heli you will probably have to richen the needle about 1/4 to 3/8 of a turn. Take that same engine at sea level and take it to Denver at 5000ft you will have to lean the HS needle about 3/8th of turn to get the mixture set correctly.

So a needle setting is not magic and works for all the engines...it will vary a bunch with conditions.

Let us know how it comes out.

Troy Newman
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:12 AM
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Thanks for the quick reply and detailing the proceedures! I'll try to run it up later this week and will let you know how I make out.
Steve
Old 04-05-2008, 05:41 PM
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Troy, I had all but given up on ever getting my FZ 63 to run properly. It would stumble and nearly die when i flew anything but full throttle. I happened on your (Down and dirty) tuning for the engine. I adjusted the regulator to hold a constant 4000 rpm, repeaked the top end , and now the performance is flawless. Wish I had learned this adjustment sooner. Thank you...................antiuqefer.
Old 04-12-2008, 10:11 PM
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Troy - Just wanted to give you an update (good news story). I switched to 30% heli fuel and I'm never going back! I tuned as you said, still using my 13x6 prop, and now can idle for long periods all the way down to 1.7k RPMs and the top end hits 10.8k RPMs. I backed off the top end to about 10.4k RPMs and it transitions well and just runs so smoothly. The one thing that surprised me though is how sensitive the HS needle valve is at the top end - each click to richen lowers the RPMs by about 100. This was all done on the ground and I hope to get out flying tomorrow. Just curios, should I expect the engine run more lean when in flight because there is less of a load on the prop?

I broke in my new 110S last weekend and it performed flawlessly. With the 30% heli fuel I was able to run it very rich for break in and it still ran smoothly. The one thing that caught me off guard though is that the fuel rate was about double when running this rich. Looks like this will be a winner as well.

Thanks again!
Steve
Old 04-14-2008, 08:28 PM
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Troy Newman
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

When you back off the HS from the peak about 200-300rpm you are richening it up so that when it unloads it will not go lean. You backed off 400rpm from the peak and you are fine...a little rich which is OK

The Cool Power 30% heli is awesome stuff!

I just can''t stress enough how good that stuff is. I know lots of guys are happy with their fuel of choice. Brand loyalty is important in our modeling market. I understand that. But everybody I have ever known to run the 30% Heli is absolutely blown away. Its that good.

Troy Newman
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Old 04-27-2008, 06:04 PM
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Fat Mike LV.
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

I just found this thred, HOPE I can put it to use on my (older) ys63
Old 04-27-2008, 07:55 PM
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Troy Newman
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Default RE: YS63 FZ knocking as throttling up

Yep its the same stuff...

The older 63 makes a little less power. so the prop sizes will be slightly smaller. Also the starting point on the regulator for the older 63FZ is the regulator screw flush with the case. The newer 63S the regulator screw is usually just a little inside flush...This external regulator version.


Troy Newman
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