Rapid13

I've got my engine. Now I need a prop and a spinner. The prop is supposed to be an 11-6 but I'm not sure of what to get for a spinner. I'm hoping the local hobby shop can help me out.

TomCrump

The build instructions, or plans, usually suggest a spinner, and it's size.

Keep in mind that the spinner size is relevant to the airframe, and not the engine.

I believe that my Goldberg Eagles used 3" spinners. Your will most likely be the same.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXE158&P=7

Do yourself a favor and save lost time at the field don,t use cheap plastic full spinners of any size instead use a spinner nut and this is the one you need. Ten bucks and you will not be sorry. Also virtually all trainers actually look better with these machined spinner nuts.

John

OzMo

My Feedback: (3)

I really like this advice, because I REALLY hate plastic or any multi-part spinners. They loosen and break and slip on the starter cone.

Also most new engines will backfire when or as being first set up and the spinner ( all of em) will instantly loosen. The solid ones can be easier to retighten AND they can be put on tighter in the first place. A LOT less hassle and frustration. They come in aluminum and brass and many shapes. Brass ones can be quite helpful with balancing issues.
Going to a club is REALLY a good idea. The help in setting up this plane for it s first flight is worth it alone. I have heard it said that a trainer cord is worth five airplanes. I didn't argue the point at all.
The process of setting an airplane up to fly correctly is rather complex and not optional. It is nearly impossible to fly a plane that is not stable. The "setting up" is balance, trim, direction of controls, amount of travel of controls, engine dial in( also a multiple item process) and a few other checks for safe function.
This is a lot for any new pilot. However after a few trips to the flying field it all becomes routine.
So the optimal situation is that on your first flight all this stuff is taken care of so you can concentrate on flying.
Whew My fingers are tired of typing!

OzMo

My Feedback: (3)

Tip: Save a small container such as a film can of balsa sanding dust to make you own putty.

Propworn is right the spackle or Model Magic Filler is a plastic based dust that can melt under higher temps. It is great in some applications though. Red Devil spackle lite is the same stuff.
Dry wall filler is NOT a good idea as it is WAY to heavy and tends to crack.

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

You have an OS FP engine do you not? It has no bearing but a bushing in the nose. Do not use the brass nut use only the aluminium one. The brass one is harder on the nose bushing. Also if you are using bushing engines you need to consider using a castor/synthetic fuel mix rather than pure synthetic.

Dennis

Rapid13

Thanks for the tips guys. I will get one of those prop nuts on my next tower order. The manual for the PT40 calls for a 2 1/4 spinner. I am going to get one of those too because to set the engine on the mount it says to measure from the spinner back plate to the firewall 4 1/2 inches. The engine calls for an 11-6 prop. Any suggestions on props or are they all pretty much the same?

OzMo

My Feedback: (3)

IMHO bushed motors last longer with well balanced propellers.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Rapid you need to inform exactly what type of power you are using Maybe in another thread you said something but not this one if you want good reliable advice especially when you start in on prop sizes, you need to disclose exacty what type and manufacturer, size and model.

So Rapid exactly how and what are you going to power this Goldberg Eagle (a grand old glow trainer) with?

John

Rapid13

I am using an OS .46 LA to power a PT40. The manual for the plane calls for a 2 1/4 spinner and the engine manual calls for a 11-6 prop.

brockettman

Rapid, There a bunch prop choices out there and propellers are not created equally. You should be fine using an 11x5 or 11x6 propeller. Stay away from the wooden ones for now and get a Master Airscrew or an APC, something made from a composite. After your engine is broken in a bit you might be able to throw a 10x6 on and gain a few more rpm. Depending on the engine/airframe characteristics of your PT40 you might find one type or size gives you better performance than another. Good Luck!

OzMo

My Feedback: (3)

I was taught 10-6 for my Goldberg Eagle. But I agree to break in the motor with an 11-5 or 11-6.
The LA are a bit less stout than some of the bearing motors. My old LA 46 was happy behind a 10-6.
Here is an old Model Airplane News article on the care and feeding of 2 cycle rc engines.
http://www.modelairplanenews.com/blo...4/carb-basics/


I keep a copy or two in my flight box.

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Prop testing!! The instructions give a wide range of props and by testing will be the only way to locate the prop that will fly the plane the way you like. I did find the APC 11X6 was my prop of choice with all my la.46 engines in the little Up-Roar plane. I also used the engine in a small Extra and the 11X6 worked best for me. Just read the instructions and you will be fine. The la series is idiot proof, they worked for me for a lot of years so I'm proof of that.
I used, still use the spinner nut/cone that John showed you. The instructions for the plane are just telling you what size spinner looks the best. Looks on a trainer don't count for a lot.
Stay away from those nasty plastic spinners!! I don't even pit next to anyone using them.

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

In regard to plastic spinners if installed and taken care of properly there is nothing wrong with them. I have had more aluminium spinners from others give me the fits than any of the plastic ones. Most times the plastic spinner and prop spin off and if they head anywhere they go straight out . You should not be standing in front of any plane for any longer than it takes to get it started. Then you situate yourself behind the arc of the prop in case something happens. You should see what happens when guys do not balance their big wooden props and the centre bolt shears off when they throttle it up. It doesn't fly forward because in most cases the prop is cranking at full rpm so the spinner will get sucked back into the prop and all hell can break loose. Its not the equipment guys its poor installation and less than safe habits that cause 99 percent of the incidences.

Dennis

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Sure there are plenty of things wrong with them (here goes that opinion thing agine). Plastic and metal full spinners both require proper installations but this is the beginners forum and in many cases we are no longer going to be there with them to see the frequent poor installation and the prop hard aginst the blade cutout or to instruct them to stay behind the tip path plane (very good advice and something I preach often) but exploding cheezy cheap plastic spinners is a very, very common and very unsafe. I have never seen a metal full spinner explode into shrapnel.

Now just forget the safety aspect for an instant. New folks constantly loose precious field time because of those spinners, a simple prop change can take a far more time with most folks and to the point of loosing valuble flight time. This does not happen with a spinner nut. So when I agree to take on a new fellow to mentor if his airplane (At least the glow planes) has a full plastic) he will replace it with a spinner nut or we do not fly.

John

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Rapid excellent now that we know what the engine is here is my imput on that question. At first glance 11/6 seems a bit much however you got me thinking so I went to the shop and pulled the prop (the only prop that's ever been on this rather tired old LA-46. Its on a rather overweight old all plastic ARF that I fly at the field several times a year when I do not feel like going down to the river. That airplane flys better than it has any right to so was I surprised to see that Master prop is an 11'/6.

I still think brokettman suggestion of an 11/5 might be a better choice for your airplane thought. Propellor choice is all about experimentation as there are no absolutes, Most flyer eventually develop what I call a prop wall for choices.

John

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Propwall

carddfann

One of the guys here suggested learning to fly with a cheap arf or used trainer. That's good advice these days because they are so cheap compared to what kit building was and is today. Full kit costs have soared these days because so few build anymore. There's set up costs and economies of scale that are passed along in modern kit prices because of lower annual volume. However, I find kit building fun and something to do when the weather is bad or long cold winter nights/weekends. I'll go hide in my basement shop with a cup of hot chocolate and let the balsa dust fly. But to me, it's good to know how to build so you can make repairs yourself and there will come days when you'll have to decide to scrap or repair. I'm old school so its a shame to see so many who struggle to even glue a piece of wood together or can't cover a wing. I've seen many ARF planes go into the trash can at the field over what I call minor to moderate damage. Repairing saves money over the crazy cost of replacement ARF parts. The initial ARF cost may be cheap, but they'll get it back if you have to buy another fuse or wing. A lot of what appears to be bad damage or hopeless to some can be fixed with scrap balsa and scrap covering around your shop and a little glue. You'll be surprised, which is why I keep my balsa and covering scraps. They are good for repairs and quick patches. Good luck and ask us if you need any help.

Rapid13

Thanks for the input Cardfann. I've gotten to engine mounting and discovered it is a PITA! One of the mount holes on the firewall was a little off so I had to shave the mount a little. Now I am having trouble getting the engine where I want it and having is stay there so I can mark the mounting holes. I've heard you can use a little CA to hold the engine in place but I'm afraid it will dry before I get the engine set. I want to make sure everything is perfectly straight before I start drilling.

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

Your assumption that it’s unsafe for beginners is ridiculous where better to install safe habits and proper techniques for installing a spinner of any kind. We have an average of 80 to 100 members in our club. The second club I belong to is capped at 50 members. In the many years I have been flying and instructing I can say I have seen a spinner leave the plane but a handful of times. Of those there were just as many aluminum as plastic. Of those there were an equal amount of experienced modelers as beginners. I have seen those lovely prop nuts you are so fond of go sailing off into the long grass never to be seen again.

The instructions in any spinner I have opened up explicitly explain proper installation. Believe it or not beginners are more apt to read instructions in their entirety than some who assume their experience gives them all seeing knowledge and they are not required to read instructions until all else fails.

Dennis

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Well sir my opinion is no more ridiculous than your obvious failure to read and comprehend what I actutally wrote before you choose to go on the attack.

Let me explain in a simple way. By beginner what I was trying to point out were the ones who are attempting the self taught route and yes my friend Those folks are very often do poor installations and an exploding spinner is not that uncommon. I have been hit by shrapnel and its not all that uncommon. This particularly so at some of the countrys most active fields those where no AMA is required and the self taught thing is common.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Hey Rapid 13, The spot tacking technique you are talking about will certainly work but if you plan to be around awhile I highly recommend this tool and at eight bucks its a steal:

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXK378&P=ML

One method I use often simply because its so quick and easy is to measure how far out you want the engine then bolt up or screw up to the beams now the fuselage is just held between your knees while you are sitting and hold the engine with mounts in position then use the locator tool to make the four marks. Then just drill through.


John

Rapid13

I got a lot done this weekend. The main landing gear is in. The hatch is on. And the engine is in. Getting the engine on the mounts was difficult but I used extra thick CA to hold the engine in place and the dead center tool that John mentioned. That made it much easier. I have checked the position of the engine twenty times and it seems as straight as it can be. There is supposed to be 4 1/2 inches between the firewall and the spinner. It looked like the engine was too far forward at first but once I put the hatch on it looked right. I shaved the fuse to clear the muffler and gave it about an 1/8 of and inch clearance. Right now I have a plastic spinner on it because I needed something to measure off of but will probably try an aluminum one once I'm ready to fly.

Gray Beard

My Feedback: (-1)

Over on page three in kit building is a thread for the Tower Up-Roar. Rick just posted a big bunch of the Roars that were posted sense he started the thread. There is a photo of two of my old Roars I used to compete with and they both had the la.46 in them, that's all I used. If you go there you can look at the different planes and engines, you will notice most of us used the spinner nut for them and not any type of true spinner. There is a photo of my latest Roar there too, it's the first time I have used anything else but the nut. Reason, this is an old FOX engine, a little .40. Fox included there own special spinner with the engine. It's also a bit different design then any other I have used, I really like it. I still have a box full of the nuts and even use them on some of my big four strokes. It's hard to argue with something that works so well and costs so little. I have them in brass and aluminum for help in setting the CG. It's just a great product.
By the way, this build is really turning out great, nice to see people building there own.
All of the trainers I have had in the last 10 years were ARFs, however, I have never bought one. new pilots want to get away from the trainer as soon as they can and I have been lucky enough to be there when they were giving it away. KEEP your trainer!! Not only will you use it to teach others but they are really a lot of fun, I love flying them in really high wind and if you don't care about the plane you can go a little nuts with it.

clarkj

My Feedback: (26)

you sound exactly like me 20 years ago. I wanted to fly so bad and everyone told me to build so when I crashed I would know how to fix it. I gave up before I ordered a plane. looking back I can definitely see that I would have never built the kit with all the work involved not to mention learning to cover. I decided to buy a superstar trainer rtf 8 years ago and have been going wild ever since. I'm now flying 100cc planes and love it. I have built a couple kits but i'll tell you, unless you have help and lots of time you will burn out building if you're like me. if I had to start over I would buy a rtf trainer and learn to fly with some help then if you want to build have at it. I have an alpha 450 for my son and it flies pretty darn good for its size.