Pete1burn

Greetings. I've been flying an Easystar for about a year, and I'd like to move onto a 4-channel plane. I have never flown a fuel plane, but it appeals to me because there is no need to upgrade the engine right away, and no downtime waiting for batteries to recharge. However, I had a bad experience with a ful car where the engine blew up one month after I bought it. Anyway, I was wondering what you all think is a good plane for my second.

I like the Nexstar, but a lot of people are telling me I would be much better off with the ARF Avistar, buying a .46 AX and a 6 channel radio. Also, the Avistar RTF is $100 cheaper than the Nexstar, I'm assuming because of the AFS, which I don't want. And buying the ARF will leave some money aside to get a nice 6 channel radio and engine.

I am also a bit nervous about going to balsawood right after the foamie I have now, which is why I listed the Magister. It's much bigger than my EZstar, and is 4-channel, but is made out of the same foam, so if I crash, it's no big deal. So some have said to go with the Magister RTF until I'm comfortable with 4 channels, then move on to a bigger and more aerobatic plane.

So what do you all think? Everyone keeps telling me something different. I mean, I was all set on buying the Nexstar after 2 weeks of research, and then 2 days ago, someone mentioned the Avistar, which started a slew of replies popping up about how the Avistar is superior. And to be honest, the ARF Avistar with a .46AX and 6 channel radio sounds kinda good.

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks
Pete

TideFlyer

I`ve not flown either of the other two, but I can tell you that an Avistar with a 46 is tough to beat IMHO. Good for basic aerobatics but watch it the first few times you fly it. It can be a real hot rod with a 46. Will also land somewhat hot, but nothing bad. Just a great all-around flyer.

bruce88123

The first question has to be: Are you going to have a qualified instructor? A Nitro plane of ANY kind is going to be a different world when it comes to performance and operation. MUCH to learn. With that said, I also wouldn't waste any more money on something like the Magister, IMO just another toy.

You can but a Nexstar ARF too and avoid buying unwanted "gadgets" and equip it the way YOU wish. Assembly will take a bit longer but worth the time.


BTW - I have flown/instructed on both.

Pete1burn

So you think if I have little experience with 4 channel planes and NO experience with fast planes, it might make more sense to go with a .40 first, and perhaps upgrade to a .46?

In that case, it makes sense to get the RTF Avistar.

Edit: Bruce, IO just joined the AMA and am currently searching for a flying club. So I probably will have an instructor.

As an instructor, would you recommend the Nexstar or the Avistar? Plenty of people have told me the Avistar is superior to the Nexstar.

Thanks again!

bruce88123

"Superior" is a relative term. Each plane has it's advantages and both are well built. In stock configuration the Avistar will fly faster and is more agile but IMO is a bit more tricky as a first plane. Since you do have SOME flying experience AND if you have an instructor you should be able to handle it OK. I don't like to see a "RAW" beginner with one. It has good handling qualities up beyond basic aerobatics. The Nexstar is good for "First flight" thru basic aerobatics. It could be modified slightly to improve performance at a later date.

Go ahead with a .46 engine, that's why the throttle is adjustable. You'll like it better when you move it on to future airplanes. OS 46AX is a great engine for either plane for example.

You may also want to delay your purchases until you see what your instructor wishes to instruct you with. It is important that HE be comfortable with your choice also and that your radios be compatible with his buddy box system. I personally prefer Futaba but have buddy boxes to accommodate most of the major brands. Not Airtronics but I did say "MAJOR". That last little dig was for RCKen's benefit.

Pete1burn

Thanks for the reply Bruce. I think the Avistar with a .46 AX and a 4- or 6-channel Futaba is the winner. I was looking into either:

Futaba 4EXA with 4 S3004 servos - http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...I=LXKJD8**&P=0
OR
Futaba 6EXAS with 4 S3004 servos - http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...I=LXHYK7**&P=0

These servos will fit the Avistar, correct? They also both have a trainer port.

Are there any other things I will need besides fuel? I know the AX needs at least 16% lube 5-20% nitro. (Go with 10%?) Anything else like after run oil, etc I don't know about. Will I need a starter box for it? My only experience with nitro is limited to a one-month stint on a 1/8th scale nitro buggy.

Thanks again!

bruce88123

Sounds good. I vote for the 6E as it will give you some room to grow in the near future. Servos are fine.
10% Nitro Oil should be 18% or higher and NOT plane blend, not car. Different additives. Pick this up at the local shop as shipping costs are very high on fuel.
Minimum equipment:
Spare prop 11x5 or 11x6 in size NOT WOOD - they break way too easy for beginners. APC or Master Air Screw (MAS)
Glow ignitor for the plug http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXD702&P=7 or similar
spare glow plug
chicken stick http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXL405&P=7 for flipping prop
fuel pump http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXFAW2&P=ML or similar
fuel as discussed
spray cleaner - windex for cleaning slime off plane
rubber bands for attaching wing http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXYR49&P=7 can also be bought at local office supply store cheaper
paper towels - for the slime
BIG TRASH BAG - TO CARRY PLANE HOME IF YOU DON'T GET THAT INSTRUCTOR WE TALKED ABOUT. [:@]
cardboard box to carry this stuff in.
You can buy electric starters and pumps later on (or now) if you wish but this is the minimum.

Pete1burn

Eh? I'm sure that was a typo. You mean plane blend, NOT car, correct?

Also, I was looking at those muffler pipe extenders for like $4 that extend the exhaust pipe so you don't get as much oil on the plane. Is this a good idea?

What's the difference between an 11x5 and 11x6? I know it's the pitch. I think 11x5 gives it a little less thrust, correct? Maybe that would be good for beginning on the plane.

Thanks very much for all your help.

PS, is this the right prop to get? http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXZ970&P=ML

Pete

bruce88123

It was indeed a typo, sorry for confusion [sm=bananahead.gif]. If you are talking about one of these http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXL378&P=ML or similar, it is OK. If you get much longer you begin to add too much back pressure.

11x5 will give you a little less top end speed but you may find that you will actually accelerate better because the engine will spin up faster. Kind of like putting lower gear ratio in rear end of your car. This flatter pitch will also allow the plane to slow down quicker when coming in to land so it will make that easier too. You can always add a touch of power if needed but the air brakes are lousy.

Ya snuck that prop in on me. Should be fine.

Pete1burn

Awesome. That's exactly the deflector I was looking at. I will order a couple of MAS 11x5 props as well.

Another question (Sorry for so many!) but on the Tower's page for the .46 AX (http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXFMD5&P=ML) it says to use a 10x6 prop for break-in. Does that mean I need to purchase a separate prop just to break-in the engine?

bruce88123

http://www.osengines.com/manuals/46ax-manual.pdf
Here is the manual for the engine. It doesn't call for a break in prop. On pg 15 it does show the 11x6 as being the lowest pitch 11 inch that it recommends so I will amend my recommendation to that.

bruce88123

Don't worry about the questions either , glad to help.

Pete1burn

This fuel doesn't say if it's designed for a plane or a car, but it does say it meets all O.S. specifications. 10% nitro, 18% lube. Good? http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXJC48&P=ML

I'll change the prop to the 11x6. I'll review the manual. Thanks again.

bigtim

My Feedback: (13)

exhaust deflectors are definitely a good idea I have them on almost all of my planes helps keep the slime away .
secondly the master airscrew props are fine the APC props I think are a little better , as for pitch the 5 pitch in theory is supposed to propel the plan 5 inches per revolution , the 6 then 6" in theory , the pitch is the amount of "bite " a prop has through the air .
as for cost comparison the avistar has a 40 LA engine the nextar a 46 fxi a slight upgrade the AFS= junk it IMHO I did, and a very basic simulator .
good advice given ask your instructor what he/she thinks is a good choice , not a bad idea if you want some upgrade possibilities get the avistar arf, the 6 ch ( I also have this radio great first computer set up) or even the 7ch. wish I had gotten that one instead, and a OS 46 AX awesome engine and a upgrade from the 40 LA will also work great for future planes as well. good luck on your choices you will have fun no matter what you end up with I would think.

bruce88123

That fuel will be fine but don't you have a shop in your area? A quart won't last long and that's a high price if you figure it out at a per/gallon rate plus shipping. You should be able to get a gallon at the LHS for @ $15 or maybe less?

bruce88123

BTW - there appears to be lots of clubs near you
http://www.modelaircraft.org/ClubZip...x?z=02148&d=25
Can I ask your approximate age and transportation situation? Driving age and with car will be close enough?

donhef

If I may add my .02 cents here.

You'll have lots of fun on the Avistar, and as was said before the .46 is a great choice for the power plant (I've got a .46 FX in mine) You'll learn that this plane does everything a little faster and crisper with the 46 and the semi-semetrical (sp?) wings, so mind your Instructor as he talks you through your first few flights. Once you get used to it, you'll be grinning from ear to ear every time you get up.

For break in, I didn't use the 10X6 on my 46, but went right to the 11X6 and have been there since. I was running Cool Power (15%) fuel, but switched to Omega (15%) and the engine seemes to run much better. I think this is because of the extra castor oil. I asked my Instructor about using the break in prop, but his opinion was that an OS engine is so good, that it shouldn't need a break in prop. I started off with wood props though, since my Instructor thought it was a good idea that WHEN I crashed, I wouldn't damage the crankshaft on the engine if it hit first. I've gone through at least 15 props in the last three seasons and have now switched to the APC which hasn't touched the ground yet.

When you get hooked up with a Club, ask the guys what they think. And get ready to soak up knowledge like a sponge. I'm one of the youngest guys in my Club and every time we have a meeting, I learn something else, and you can't beat the company!

And also, look up other threads here on RCU about the Avistar. You'll learn how to do modifications and other things to make this one of the best planes in your hanger. Have a great time learning and welcome to the obsession......errr.....hobby!

Don

Pete1burn

Shops in my area, there are a few, but none that is close enough to be convenient. A lot of the hobby shops near me are just for trains and landscape models, etc. I'll have to look around some more.

As for my age I'm almost 29, and since you asked, I picked up a 2006 Acura TSX last month. hehe

I have contacted a few of the clubs on AMA's club list. Most of these guys seem to be VERY intense, and don't seem really interested in having a newb in their midst. I am waiting to hear from a few of them before I plop down $70 to join a club I'll never go back to. Most of them require you to be a member of the club before they'll help you. I emailed the Burlington RC Flyers club and what I got was:

"We do have people who can help you if you decide to join our club.
President
Burlington RC Flyers"

Not the nicest response. My email to him was like 3 paragraphs.

As I said, I don't want to throw down $70 to them if I'm not sure I like them, but then again, I don't know how else to get help.

carrellh

Try to visit the club's flying site. Introduce yourself and tell them you're a beginner and are thinking about joining. I'd bet the reception you get in person will be much warmer. Ask if any of the instructors are around and try to meet them.

bruce88123

I only asked about your age because we do get inquiries from young people who depend upon bicycles to get around but forget to mention things like that. Makes it hard to give good advice.
I suggest that you actually visit a couple of the fields and talk to the regular flyers. The club "contact persons" may also be the club "A-holes"[:@]. Get some maps from the websites and do a little visiting/talking. Find some people that you like. Maybe even drop by a club meeting if allowed. Check em out before you invest. Remember, EVERY club will have it's A-hole and it's good guys. The point is to find one with more of one than the other.

Oh yeah, they'll know the good shops too.

piper_chuck

My Feedback: (12)

I've found that some people in R/C are terrible with email. There could be a variety of reasons for this, but it just seems to be the case. Some of the people I communicate with regularly never type more than a couple lines, but will end up on the phone with me for a half hour or hour a couple times a month. And in all fairness, the club president probably gets lots of inquiries for every person who actually buys a plane and shows up at the field. After receiving a few hundred of these, it's not unreasonable for him to respond with a fairly short reply that says yes, they can help you. So, don't judge him or the club by one email.

To get a better idea of the club, go visit them on a busy weekend. Askto meet one of the instructors and see if you can talk to them for a little while. Try to time this when they aren't in the middle of prepping their plane or helping someone else. Many people spend a few minutes actually flying and then lots of time in between chatting and watching or helping others fly. If they all seem too busy, entirely possible, ask if they'd be willing to talk sometime when they're not at the field. You'll get a much better feel for the club by meeting them in person than via emails to the president.

N429EM

Just to amplify bruce88123's comments,

Here's my NexSTAR, eventually, she's gonna get a different wing (my design), and floats...

Pete1burn

Good idea, all. I'm going to try to stop by their field on Sunday morning and see what's up. Hopefully the weather holds out.

Bruce and all else, I'd just like to again say thanks for the responses. I've posted on a few RC forums, and gotten maybe 4 responses in 2 weeks. I've had more information posted to me here in one day than at the other sites combined. I think I've found a new R/C home.

Thanks again!

bruce88123

We're glad to have you. Welcome aboard. Send the check to .............................

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)