Deadstik

My Feedback: (8)

William,

I have found that it is best to build the plane with the engine that it was designed for. I wish I had a quarter for everyone who takes a 70's .60 sized pattern ship and stuffs an OS .91 4 stroke in it and can't figure out why it doesn't fly correctly. The weight difference alone, not counting the distance to prop shaft /propellor tip clearance plus the width/size of the fuselage dictates what engine goes in it. Before all you loyal OS.91 fans start throwing rocks, I know that the conversion can be done.....but it just isn't worth it. Add to this the fact that you then are almost resigned to make a beautiful tricycle landing gear airplane into a tail dragger and you have a most unforgivable act!!! But, back to your original question about the OS .45 AX... sure.. it will fly a .60 sized plane....but....not as well, and not as designed. BTW.. haven't got the Bobcat plans yet, will let you know.


Deadstik

Capt. Bill

The Bridi link on Sheldons site is not longer valid and they are clearing out all the old Bridi kits on Ebay

Jim_Purcha

My Feedback: (8)

Yeah, and they are doing a very good job of selling those bridi kits on Ebay. I've been watching those for weeks now. No problem with sales.

Capt. Bill

I got a note saying they didn't want to saturate the local market with the kits. I have picked up an Escape, Vagabond, and Warlord 25 from them and they are great. I am a different type of collector. I built them, fly them, then collect the pieces off the field [&o]Of course they have experience with mail order and what they are selling are new in box and sealed. They are listed as SALERCS on Ebay. Communication is great with them.

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

-----------------


I'm really surprised that some enterprising Chinese folks haven't reproduced a Dirty Birdy 40 & 60 ARF. Just minor cosmetic changes (different style canopy) and a different name would keep them out of court. They would sell quite a few to we old farts that would rather fly than build from plans. Or perhaps fly while they are building from plans. <G>

If they built them light, straight, strong and in two-stroke and four-stroke versions, I'm sure they would get their money back, plus a good profit. Hopefully, they would offer them in red and yellow base colors. Dark blue is one of my hated colors on models, yet that is one of the most commonly seen on ARFs.

Frogman1195

My Feedback: (2)

Artisan,

I noticed you said you have a set of Kaos 60 plans. Is there anyway I could get a copy of them. Or could you tell me where I might get a set.


Thanks

Dave

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

-----------------


I bought my plans from the RCM Plans Service just before they closed their doors. I don't know where else you could buy some from, unless someone reads this that is willing to sell theirs. With the way my health is going lately, I might be offering mine up for sale in the not too distant future.

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

------------------


Many of us Seventies pattern flyers dropped out of flying pattern when Turnaround became official pattern dogma. I do not dislike Turnaround, I just disliked the advantage that was given four-stroke engines (twice the displacement) and the noise rules. If Europe had a noise problem, Europe should have dealt with it. It had nothing to do with the USA pattern scene.

The price for flying in pattern skyrocketed when the twice as large four-strokes became the norm. Larger engines means larger models. Larger models means larger/more powerful servos, landing gear, etc.

Then, much to my dismay, someone discovered that four-strokes benefitted more with higher nitro fuel han two-strokes. I quit. This wasn't the pattern that I enjoyed before.

I get interested in SPA. I collect a few two-stroke engines that I used to love, long, long ago. What? No one is flying two-strokes? They're all flying four-strokes with high nitro fuel? Isn't this where I got off before? Nothing has changed.

Ed Cregger

Jagdgeschwader 26

My Feedback: (4)

Amen, Ed.

I got into RC in the early 70's with a used Lanier Jester/Enya 60 III. Learned to fly with it. All we flew back then were 60 powered Kaos's, Dirty Birdy's, and Aeromasters. Now, it's a rare sight at any field when a vintage pattern ship shows up. The 3-D guys haven't got a clue as to what they are.

Give me a 60 pattern ship any day. Nothing like them. I have no argument with the 4 strokes, fly what you brought. But I hope the Kaos's, Kwik Fli's, etc. never go away.

I think the SPA is directionally correct in reviving pattern as we once knew it. But the 91 4-stroke/taildragger loophole is spoiling it. Just my opinion.

later,

8178

My Feedback: (17)

I highly commend what the SPA is doing to keep the classics alive and in the news so I don’t like to criticize their efforts. But shoehorning $250 91 four stroke into the front of a classic and deneutering it of its landing gear is something I cannot do. When I joined the SPA I was disappointed to discover that the leaders had not stayed true to Mickey Walker’s original SPA concept. This has all been discussed before and the 91s are here to stay. More information about Mickey can be found at http://www.seniorpattern.com/whythespa.asp and http://www.modelaircraft.org/museum/...ker-Mickey.pdf

Stripes

My Feedback: (19)

Additionally, several of the popular airplanes have been . . . re-engineered. . .

SteveW

My Feedback: (36)

The plans service is still in operation and the web site is back up as well. Give them a try. I just ordered a few more plans and received fast service.

fireman7875

My Feedback: (7)

I am brand new to pattern flying and I'm trying to decide on my first purpose-built pattern ship. I have been mostly interested in vintage airplanes for a couple of years now. Following suit, I find the classic pattern planes far more intersting than the modern widebody designs. The newer ones basically all look the same! I am leaning toward an Intruder or a T2A from Carolina Custom Aircraft. There are a few things that I am still unclear on though. I am familiar with the performance differences between two and four stroke engines but what I don't understand is why an organization (the SPA) whose sole purpose is to preserve and promote the historical integrity of pattern flying would make "less historical" powerplants the accepted norm. Two stroke engines have certainly been around for our models longer than four strokes. Further, it seems to me that, particularly for the purposes of competition, two stroke simplicity makes more sense than four strokes.

Another thing, do classic pattern flyers compete in totally different arenas from other, more contemporary planes? I don't really understand the differences between the different forms of pattern competition. Can anyone help a newcomer out a little with the differences?

Thanks,
Brian

Bruce Underwood

Brian: Mike Miller e-mailed me personally requesting I answer your' message here...I had changed ISP's since I posted on here and
like to have never gotten this list to let me LOGIN....had to change to my newer ISP, etc. Got it now tho. I am Bruce Underwood,
SPA # 15 in Guntersville, AL President of the Senior Pattern Association....thanks for showing an interest and perhaps becoming a
part of SPA. It's a GREAT outfit...lots of Precision Aerobatic competition and load of "fellowship", primarily in the SE. We have a
contest in Ashville, N.C. this season, probably closer to you than say, Atlanta, GA in June, Chattanooga, TN in August and back to
Hotlanta in September for our MASTERS contest.

The approval of 4 strokes came as a result of NOISE requisites at the Knox Co. TN field several years ago, 4S is much quieter and
readily available.

Let me urge you to visit the SPA website at:
www.seniorpattern.com
and browse its' many features, complete Competitors Guide, contest results with loads of photos, contest schedules, call sheets, score
sheets, approved models. I think our webmaster, Mr. Ed Hartley in Knoxville, TN has answers to most any question you can ask.
Also, you may join approximate 80 of us SPA pilots on the SPA Discussion or maillist by typing an E-Mail addressed to:
[email protected]
in the body of the e-mail just type:
join discussion "your name" <your e-mail address>
The website will automatically respond, if successful with confirmation of your becoming a receiver of the maillist.

In order to leave the list, just substitute the word "leave" in place of "join" in the above e-mail.

You may download from the SPA website our newsletters, the latest of which, the MAY/JUNE issue is posted with lots of great
info including an article on "precision aerobatics" by Marty King. (I am also the editor of the SPA Newsletter which is mailed
in hardcopy to our membership bi-monthly). The electronic issue is placed on the website shortly after publication and quite
often leads the "hard-copy" by 2 to 4 weeks.

If there's anything we officers and Directors of SPA can do to assist, just let us know. All our Directors E-Mail addresses are
on the SPA website. Again, my thanks to Mike Miller for informing me of your' queries here and to the RC Forum here for this
excellent facility.

Best Wishes,

Bruce Underwood SPA # 15 President
Guntersville, AL 35976
[email protected]

PS: Duane Wilson, SPA member in Ashville, N.C. authored a very nice feature on SPA in the May issue of Model Aviation.

Sport_Pilot

I don't think you understood his concept! It was less about flying original pattern airplanes, and more about inexpensive pattern airplanes. I observed a contest about 5 or 6 years ago when Mickey was flying a Chaos with OS .91 FS. I think was the tail dragger Killer Kaos. So apparently he is OK with the rule.

Deadstik

My Feedback: (8)

Inexpensive??? Priced an OS .91 lately???

That pretty much puts inexpensive out the window...


Deadstik

mdomokos

Just started reading these posts. I had a Dirty Birdy 60 glass for 35 years in my garage since I was 13 years old. It followed me (unbuilt) to 5 different houses. After a divorce and re-marriage, my step son kept asking if I was going to build it. I finally did. See the pictures. I noticed that the senior pattern flyers might be a place to fly it. Are there any chapters in So. Calif.? Also, this Birdy is powered by an OS .61 2 stroke, and flys great, even though it's a little heavy. I had to use lead not realizing until finished it was nose heavy. I also has the old Kraft retracts, also heavy.

[img][/img]

mdomokos

Oops, here are the pictures of the Dirty Birdy.