JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Be assured this is critical to your success and don,t be mislead by your combat days long ago. I to flew fast combat but this is here and now and that is in no way related to RC, Its a different challange.

You have made so many good decisions so far to screw it all up now with that dryed up old "I.am gonna do it alone" attitude that is only gonna end up with that nice trainer and/or Cub you labored over all winter screwed into the ground.

Ya sure sims do help but thats not gonna change anything unless you find that mentor now not later. These guys are your future flying buds and you wanna slam the door in their face before they can help. If you survive you will come to learn flying RC is not really a solitary sport. Sharing is so much better.

The PT 20 will serve just dandy and its an effective trainer. So go ahead and get built for next season and get involved with the club now. You won,t regrete it.

John

PS and I am still flying controlline (never stopped) in a wheelchair but sure not fast combat.

Scirocco14

Hi Jim,

I'm finishing up my 1st year of RC flying &building, I've put in over 125 flights in my first year of flying and maybe I can offer some insight.

I started with a Hobbico Nexstar trainer, a flight simulator, and joined the local field. BUT I tried to "do it myself". One of my other hobbies is racing sports cars, and I figured if I could drive cars at 130 mph, how hard can flying an RC plane be? ( The experienced guys reading this know exactly what happened next...) Iwent to the field a couple of times, watched and asked questions and then I went out to the field during a weekday and decided to give it a go. The Nexstar lasted about 5 seconds in the air. I went home with my tail between my legs... Next stop...hobby shop!

I then acquired another trainer (a Cox Tailwind 40 ARF as a matter of fact),built it, and asked a couple of the local flyers if they'd mentor me in between their weekend flights and they agreed to take-off &land my planes for me, and let me fly the planes once in the air. (No buddy box needed...turns out my hundreds of simulator flights help me master basic flight). After about 25 flights like this on a real trainer, I solo'd. 50 more solo flights on the trainer later and I was doing basic aerobatics, and very comfortable with flying.

In the meantime I had acquired a Carl Goldberg Anniversary Cub with an OS 48 Surpass 4 stroke. Let me tell you, it may LOOKa lot like a trainer but it is NOT. There were many ground loops and hairy take-offs until I got the hang of the Cub's tendencies. The "peanut gallery" at the field was very entertained with my antics this fall as I learned to master the seemingly docile Cub. Thus, my recommendation would be to finish the Cub, but don't fly it right away. Get a proper trainer and learn on that.

I recently sold my trainer and now use the Cub as my "regular" go-to plane at the field and probably have 50 solo flights on it to date. They are a blast to fly, and they will teach you the tail-dragger skills you'll need later on. I now am starting to fly a SIG 4-Star w/ an OS 40FP 2-stroke that I build from a kit, and it's a breeze to take-off now that I've mastered the Cub take-offs. If you are not familiar with the 4-Star, it is a low wing sport "trainer" and a good third plane.

So as a graduating "newbie" to RC flying, I'd recommend a "real" trainer, JOINthe club and ASK someone to mentor you as you learn to fly. Finish the Cub and once you're competent with the trainer, fly the Cub!

If I were to recommend a trainer, I'd suggest a SIGKadet Senior. I am just finishing up one now; I bought it the day I crashed my Nexstar in the late spring and am just now finishing the paint on it. BUT I decided to cover it with fabric and paint it with a dope finish and once I had my Tailwind ARF trainer i wasn't in a hurry to finish it anymore. It is a BIG plane, easy to see (a couple of guys at the field have them and I love how they just float across the sky). The only drawback to the Kadet Senior kit is that is a three-channel airplane (no ailerons) and some folks think that it's better to learn right away with the 4-channel setup w/ ailerons. So ask around your club.

Good luck and have fun whatever you decide to do!!

Mark

huntingdad

My Feedback: (2)

Lots of good advice here. For what it's worth, I'll add mine. I'm nearing my 1st year as a r/c pilot. I started with a falcon 56 trainer, an instructor at our local club, and a simulator. The sim really helped, but doesn't replace the pucker facter when flying the real thing. The instructor with a buddy box takes care of that. Getting impatient and not waiting for help cost me my trainer. I did learn what a tip stall was. Now, a year later, I have 9 planes and a love of flying I can't avoid.  I have so much to learn and the members of our club provide a wealth of experience as well as a safe place to fly. I have a cub also, and without help, I couldn't get it off the runway in one piece. Now I love flying it. Welcome, and good luck. Look forward to hearing about your prgress.

wazzbat

On the club thing - I was a bit apprehensive about joining a club too. I get a bit nervous meeting new people and it can be a bit overwhelming when you first walk into the a club on your own but like others have said, I found all of the members very friendly and accommodating. After all, they want as many new members to their clubs as possible to maintain or expand their memberships, facilities etc. Also, I have found that the type of guys that are likely to join an RC club are pretty laid back, relaxed sort of people. After one visit, I felt very comfortable at the club. I haven't started training yet but I have enjoyed just walking around and looking what everyone has and having a chat. There is a lot to be learnt for a begginer! I highly recommend joining a local club! I promise it won't be as daunting as you think!

jester_s1

I'll too advise you to join a club. The learning you can do by asking questions and listening to people talk is worth the dues alone, and add to that a well-maintained airstrip and facility and it's a no-brainer. It's great to have an engine problem and be able to turn around and ask a guy with experience what to do and he not only has it running right in about 2 minutes time, but has also taught you how to do it. Same thing with odd things happening in flight. You can ask why the plane did what it did and most of the time there is someone there who can tell you. The internet is handy and sims are helpful, but there is nothing like real in person help when you're new to the hobby.

Mikecam

All great advice with not a whole lot more that I can add. I will say, find the club in your area and head out on a nice day (sunny low wind) and just watch. Don't feel you even have to talk to anybody, just watch. I think you will be surprised how long the members of the field will allow you to just sit there without coming over just to say hello. You don't need to join the club to just go watch. Have a look at the planes and hear them, smell them then decide if you want to get out one day and say hello. Good luck and remember, your never, ever, too old to enjoy the many aspects of this hobby. Good luck to you sir.

RealFly

Dear Jim, as to the club thing and not being social... I think you will actually be in a postion where you will meet club members anyway, if you find a nearby club field, unless you have some private property to fly at.  With that being said, the club is not a one way street.  In other words while some may be mentoring you to fly, you may decide to mentor someone else at building - which you are proficient at - reading your posts.

There are not many true builders out there anymore and sharing your experience you may find feeds that workaholic in you.....Teaching some new guy how to do it and perhaps helping them build a kit, while they teach you to fly.  I have been flying two years solid and have so many hours on the Sim its crazy, but I learned the most from guys at our club field. 

Actually I am seeking out a member now who can teach me to do nice covering....I want to build my first kit over the winter and I am confident putting the sticks together, but would like to be taught how to cover well.....Look at it as you are imparting your knowlege in a new venue besides work.....

cessnaflyer54

My Feedback: (68)

Jim, I lived in ABQ. and if you go out to Maloof field there are more people from
the hobby shops that can help you. It used to be that if you bought a plane from
Hobbies-n-Stuff, they would teach you how to fly it. I can think of at least 15 guys
out there that can teach you to fly. Talk to them, they will put you in the right direction
on the aircraft to start with.

Rick

EJJK

I've read the many suggestions on this subject and agree with most. The one thing I haven't seen mentioned is safety. DON'T FLY ALONE. In the event something should happen to you while at the field, your safety would be dependent on you alone. I know the general thinking, "this couldn't happen to me", but it does. Hand, finger, forearm injuries are not uncommon, and heaven forbid losing an eye is not worth being a loner. Seek the camaraderie, friendship, knowledge and safety this hobby has to offer and you'll never regret making the move.

A larger type trainer would expedite your training curve as it would be easier to see, less twitchy, and definitely would provide you with more acceptable flying hours. Why, because the wind would less likely ground you on any given day. A Telemaster (6 ft. wingapan) would be an excellent trainer. I've often said, if you can't fly a Telemaster, you need to consider a different hobby.

Best of luck.

Ed

greengoose

jmedley I wish I could be there to help at least with the flight training part, I am in Roswell 3 hours from Albuquerque. You for sure know about Big Boys Toys on Juan Tabo street, Tom usually has some good used trainers for a good price for sale ready to go sometimes or have him save you one, I have a feeling once you solo that your building zeal might diminish as the sky is the limit and too much fun.

DGrant

My Feedback: (4)

well realfly, that is a very good point too.. a club has resources.. I'd help you with the covering if you were in my club or even in my area..for sure. It reminded of a club friend I have that needed some "covering 101", and I got him going on the basics, covered a few wing panels and he was on his way with film covering from there... THEN.. when I needed some master welding/fabrication which is what he does for a living, I merely asked for some help, and we took care of that.. he's got great covering jobs.. and I have things that aren't going to fall apart.

With all the people in the club, theres also people that have never been in the club that we run into at various flying sites in this valley.. pretty much either was we look at it.. the hobby comes with friends...we even know all the hobby shop kids... theres some that I've watched grow up, get married, and build families.. it really can be a social hobby for many individuals, even if its never intended to be.

lt-40 flier

My Feedback: (1)

As a club instructor I would like to point out one thing missed by the posts here. You would stand a chance of flying with your experience on control line and simulator time if the plane were balanced and trimmed properly. That is where the club and an instructor will save your plane for the first time. Even if you decide to try it on your own-go to a club and ask for assistance in getting your equipment in balance and trim and range checked. We don't bite and really want to see you succeed. Then have fun..................

on_your_six

My Feedback: (11)

Who builds a trainer any more? Waste of time... just buy an RTF or an ARF..

I just finished my first year of training people... I like the Alpha 40&60 over the Nextstar... I think it is easier to fly.

I agree with the comments about the cub... put it on the shelf and finish at least your first year of flying before you try that. You are starting pretty late, so everything is going to take you longer... the kids soak this stuff up like sponges. They can fly in no time, but learning the intricacies of the equipment and precision aerobatics slow them down. Before you finish training with me, I would have you doing loops and aileron rolls.

jmedley

My Feedback: (2)

I think maybe you guys have convinced me...............I think I will try the instructor route, but I don't intend to do anything until probably February. I have another hobby that will keep me on the road and out of town most of January. We will be out of town just about ever weekend. There are several clubs here in town that I have found. One of them had their christmas party at the church accross the street from my house. I will contact someone after the holdiays and January settles down. In the mean time I will keep building my planes and playing with the simulator. For those interested, I am a lot more into building the planes than flying them. I have always enjoyed building planes more that flying them. Before college when I flew combat, it bothered me the least when I crashed............I got to rebuild them when I tore them up!

Jim

wazzbat

Sounds like we're in a similar boat Jim.  Although I am new to building and flying.  But I recently bought a trainer kit (Sig LT-40) and started it a couple of weeks ago.  I'm doing a bit of a build thread on it which reminds me, I will have to update it soon.  I really wanted to build my own planes but I have now convinced myself to buy a cheap ARF trainer to learn on.  I am still keen to finish my LT-40 though and I can't wait until I finally get it in the air.  That won't be happening though until I get at least a bit of experience on the ARF. 

By going the ARF route now, I can get in the air quicker and will be a lot less dissapointed if I crash and burn.  When everyone first tried to talk me into an ARF, I was dead set against it but I have come to my senses.  It might be worth looking at for yourself.  It's actually cheaper than a kit too. 

I also have Real Flight 4.5 which I play about with and am hoping it has given me a bit of a head start in RC flying?  I am hoping to find out early in the new year when I get down to the club for some first time training.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Congratulations Jim it sounds as though you just gotton over the hump and made the most important decision of all. Man how sweet is that you get to walk to the meetings. Most all clubs have some sort of show and tell, where members are encouraged to bring in their new Stuff be it a just completed airplanes or new ones still in a box, Engines or anything new even a new tool widget.

These are great ice breakers at meeting and think of the pride when you bring in your new completion or maybe completley in the bones.

John[8D]

DGrant

My Feedback: (4)

Happy landings Jim!

JollyPopper

My Feedback: (6)

on_your_six, I would like to ask you a question. Is all building a waste of time or is only building a trainer a waste of time?

Augie11

If you enjoy building, build. I don't think it's a 'waste of time' for either a trainer or a 1/4 scale, fully detailed Fokker D. VII. It probably is less expensive and certainly is faster if you go the ARF route. I don't knock ARF folks......they should let builders do their own thing.

Clay Walters

With the build; patch & fly experience Jim already has from back in the Ambroid days he'll have little trouble now. Bet he will find UltraCote an absolute revelation!

As to the emotional attachement to a stick built plane....nonsense. I hate to crash any of them but know its just part of the game. At least if you built it you'll know best how to salvage it when possible. Besides, after you crash it opens the opportunity to start a new build!

Augie11

My kinda man! A crash is just an opportunity to free up space in the hangar!

jmedley

My Feedback: (2)

I use to rebuild the combat planes after a crash. It was almost as much fun as starting from scratch. I always stick built them  Heck I even design a couple. This is probably more fun to me that flying. That gentleman that is trying to talk me out of building is talking to the wind as far as I am concerned. At my age, I don't intend to start something new.............completely. You mention the Ambroid days.........I still use it. I can't stand the smell of CA nor do I look forward to gluing my fingers together. I use CA when I am in an extreme hurry, but not very much.

Tell me more about the UltraCote vs. MonoCote. I already have Monocote for the cub and ordered for the trainer. I am not so tight for money or time  that I can't send the MonoCote back and get UltraCote. This is one thing that I am not the least bit familiar with. We always used silk and areo dope in my old combat days. I think it will be fun to lean something new though. We'll find out in a few days. All I like besides finish on the Cub is hooking up the pushrods and electronics plus some final sanding.

Jim

Clay Walters

Jim,

I muddle thru covering as best I can but I'm not an artsy/crafty type and still marvel at the artistry evident in many posts on this site. Monocote seemed just fine to me until I bought a roll of orange this year. It just wouldn't shrink until split second before burn thru. Oh, it did a slight shrink at first and then just "sat there".

Had a buddy come over and play around with it. Basically wasted a half roll before dedicating it to the trim sheet status.

Tried UltraCote for the first time. What a difference!

While I prefer the backing of MonoCote to UltraCote the stick/shrink quality of UltraCoat were much more forgiving and predictable.

Perhaps it was just that batch of Monocote or perhaps not. Its too expensive to monkey around with everytime. But for trim the Windex application using Monocote is Wonderful and worth using it for that as it will stick not only to itself but UltraCote too.

Regards,

Clay

lt-40 flier

My Feedback: (1)

Jim

I have used both Ultracoat and Monocoat:
Monocoat is tuffer, needs more heat to shrink and you will need more help wourking it around corners. I think it sets less wrinkles in the sun.
Ultracoat is nicer to work with, requires lower temperature to shrink and in more predictable.

Have fun with the projects. They should look great no matter which you use.

DGrant

My Feedback: (4)

Yeah... what he said... I personlly like Monokote, probably because at this point in time, theres an abundance of colors...I like the selection I think. Ultracoat does go on a bit easeir, and smoother if you're less experienced... but Monokote has the edge of durability I think, either film is very worthy though... just know also there isn't one color brand to brand that match exactly.. or even close.. a bright yellpw Monokote, and bright yellow Ultra are very different colors... but I can also tell you, they are decently compatible as far as laying one brand on top of another seems to work fine. It will be a personal preference on brand though, and you'll find what works best for you very quickly.

The tool(s) that will help most are the 21st Century brand. Thier iron is the best on the planet, its got a very consistent thermostat, and is shaped to be useful in many different areas... same for thier trim iron(smallish iron, is just what it sounds like)... these 2 things alone can create professional results.. a heat gun is also a very viable tool.. and used for alot of bigger areas, and shrinking the material..with that said though.. you could use your wifes clothes iron... I actually did that for years with very good results too.. I think its all in the heat though.. and Monokote does need some heat to shrink... and that comes straight from the iron.