raptor-team

Hi all,

maiden flight tomorrow with my EF yak. DA50 with KS1060 and Vess 23B.

As the elevators as dismountable, just want to know if you put some "loctite" on the screw, each time you install the Stab at field ?

Mike

AirWizard

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Make sure we get a flight report...........watch out for the large grin on your face.

yarom

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Maiden flight tomorrow of my second EF Yak. DA50 with KS1060 and Mejzlik 23x8.

I also went with the new Spektrum AR9100 - 2 LiPos and 1 A123 on ignition.

Got rid of the Smartfly SuperReg and the Smartfly equalizer (elevator).

I am balanced on CG with the batteries in the motor box but have not checked full up weight yet. I should be below 17 for sure...

Yes, you need to loctite the screws holding the stabs (blue), or leave the stabs on.

SMALLFLY-

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Maidened mine last weekend. DA 50 on stock muffler, mejlick 23-8 single 2700 nimh on rx single 1650 on engine. Mine balanced with the battery under the wing tube. While not as balistic as my old 85" extreme flight yak it was still plenty, uplines take a bit longer, pullout is a bit slower but certainly not bad. Flew great as expected, did hovers and TR's on maiden at about 15 feet. Seems to need more aileron throw than I anticipated. My futaba 9350's are going to be replaced with 5955's pretty soon, that might help a bit there. Single 5955 on rudder will do KE loops at 1/2 throw on full rate rudder. Insane amount of rudder for a big fatty. Im sure a lot of you have heard and experienced this before, just my quick thoughts. As comment above I have never left my stabs on any of my giants, I cant for storage reasons. I use lockwashers and have even tried the bonded washers on the new one and have never had a stab screw come out. 2 and 1/2 years hundreds of flights on my old EF yak so If you tighten your bolts properly it is not a problem

AirWizard

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Welcome to the WoW Club

zoomer199

Well, Lost a wing bolt during landing (totaly my Fault). Yak 88 is history until I get a new fuse. In lue of a new fuse I promptly came home and orered me up New Extra. Should arrive monday.

FYI. Virtual Cockpits now has a kit for the 88yak and it looks great. It realy helps to fill up that huge void in the yaks canopy.

yarom

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Maidened my second Yak.

Not like the first one, this one did not fly out of the box and I nearly lost it.

It started uncontrolable, with severe nose pitch down and one wing dropping. It took 30 (thirty) clicks of up elevator and thirteen of right aileron to get this thing flying straight and my heart rate to go down.

I thought I had it properly balanced on the 6 3/4, but it turned out to be still a little be tail heavy. Since everything is in the motor box as it is, I'll be adding another 1/4' to the standoffs to get a bit better weight in the nose.

This still does not explain the trims required, so I trued the canopy deck with a long level and measured the incidence on the stabs and elevators with a robart incidence meter. Turns out I have 3/4 degree up on one side and 1 1/2 degree up on the other.

Several questions come to mind:

- Is this the right way to measure the incidence (level canopy deck)?
- What should the stab incidence be for perfect flying?
- How do I go about tilting them stabs properly?


Thanks.

Forgot to add - the rather new DA-50, still on 32:1 Ashless, was taching at 7K with Xoar 23x8 and pipe. Once broken in and moved to Amsoil, I will have to prop up to a 24x8 or this thing will spin above 7500. Never knew one could extract that much HP from a 50cc?

zoomer199

Yarom
look up post #2452 in this thead. About this time lots of posts about incedence. Your problem is not unique.

Incdence should be 0 for wing and 0 for stabs.

Incdence 0 level is based on the thrust line. The canopy deck seems to be level with the thrust. So yes you can use the deck for 0.

yarom

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Thanks. I went back there and started reading again the thread from the old times when we started this thing. Plenty of memories and a bunch of people that have come and gone with time...

I even found the original Maudib instructions for fixing stab incidence at #2064 and a whole debate on the topic with a final reply from Chris at #2388.

I sometimes wonder what happened to Dave Johnson (maudib). I know he was very sick at some point and I hope he is still hanging on...

Jason Arnold

G'day Yarom,

It's not uncommon to see incidence issues in ARF's. I actually use the incidence meter to build the model and check everything before flight. You also need to be very careful in how you use the incidence meter. With the Robart unit you can get different readings by simply turning the meter 180 degrees. Try it, you'll be surprised... This is why I make all measurements with the meter facing the same way which minimises any error. I also try to put the meter in the same position on either side of the plane to try to get consistency and repeatability in my measurements. When checking your stab etc you need to make sure your control surfaces are at the same level. Don't rely on the elevator counter balances being level with the stab either as they can be off! A fellow pattern flyer put me onto the two straight sticks method to set-up my elevators and it works a treat and gives a good base to check stab incidence. Even better is to check the incidence before fitting the control surfaces... Bit late for that in your case I know...

Anyway hope this helps.

Cheers
Jason.

diamondave

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i was thinking of maudib too, hope all is well with him, sucks to not here from someone who was a regular poster, especially since we knew he had health issues

diamondave

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well i almost lost my yak last weekend, using the fasst 2.4 system, all was well the 1st weekend, this last saturday was seconds away from disaster, literally, i had one flight in the morning, then the field was closed while they did maintenance( weeds, etc), so my plane sat for several hours in the sun, wasnt overly hot, maybe mid 80's ambient temp, then we were able to fly again, i fired up, did my little ritual, idle for a little, bring rpms up slow, go to full, then goose it a few times, i do that everytime before a flight just to make sure all runs well and transitions, duiring my "goosing" phase i lost signal to reciever, went into fail safe and i was locked out, servos still on and holding center, throttle back to a few clicks above idle and i had nothing, never came back until i turned the reciever off and on again, i tried again and same thing happened, did it three times before i packed up, went home and took the reciever out and pluged a few servos in it and ran it for 15 minutes or so and no problems, red light never came on, was confused, started a post on futabas support and someone emailed me a link to fg's thread about the same problem with the 14 channel 2.4, i had a 7 channel(617), turns out it cant take heat, someone did tests with a pyrometer and it would cut off when the case temp reached 164 or so, not overly hot imo, luckily for me i was still on the ground and in the plane stand when i had the problem, was way too close for me, so i called futaba they wanted to send it in, but the thread on the other site said all there stuff came back fine, cause when they bench test its fine, so after all that i gave up on 2.4 for now, i had a mudule for my 9c, and 3 recievers cause i wanted to put them in all my planes, but i sent it all back to tower asking for a refund(credit), 2 of the recievers were not used and i was within a months purchase, not sure about the stuff i used yet, i hope i get the full refund back cause in my mind its defective, we are just starting to get warm here, thats a big problem that needs to be fixed, and my thoughts were there may still be some unknowns to come up, so i am back to pcm and my plane is flying great, i want to be flying when there is sweat dripping off my forhead and burning my eyes, my hands will be slippery on the transmitter from sweat, but the plane should still fly.....so if anyone using that stuff hasnt heard of it, beware, the fg thread says futaba is aware of it now and coming up with a solution, but i dont want to be the one to loose a plane for something nobody has thought of, i will wait a few years maybe till all that stuff is figured out, btw, i went out sunday with my pcm and it was even warmer outside and flew all day with no issues, remember the mid 80's will effect everybody in the usa at some point, so be careful

diamondave

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spread the word to all your loved ones!!!!!
i am by no means bad mouthing futaba either, i like my 9c and have no plans to switch brands to get 2.4 stuff, i just want you guys to know there could be some failures soon

xtraflyr

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Thats y Im staying away from that 2.4 for awhile. I still dont trust it. My friend has the Spectrum 7ch,and has to shut the TX off and back on for it to reconize the rx..Pretty soon no one will be on my freq. cuz theyll all be on 2.4..Life is good!!

Plus I hate the people that say PCM covers over clitches and such compared to PPM. Well thats what 2.4 does too.SO were even,HMM!![)]
Cya,
Frank

yarom

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I can honestly say, I have not encountered these kind of problems on DSM and have moved all my gear to DSM or DSM2 quite a while ago. I cannot even contemplate going back to PCM and all that 72mhz high liability system.

I see 30% planes flying every day with Spektrum AR7000s without a problem (you do have to send them to JR for the update, which provides a shorter recovery after frame loss). We had a jet at our field yesterday, using Xtreme Link, and he said he has been using it for over a year on jets, with never an issue...

The higher range Spektrum receivers are even better than the 7000 with the AR9100 being particularly good in maintaining an excellent binding and providing great servo power. It also alerts me if there was a problem in flight by blinking. Never happened so far. I do a range check at the start of a flying day, with the engine on. I can walk as far as I want and I have never reached the limit where the failsafe shut down the engine.

I have never used the FASST stuff, or any Futaba gear for that matter, so can't comment on that.

Where I live, if the temperatures go above 80, we are all very happy about that. 164 Temps inside the plane is something I've never seen. When parking my planes in the sun, I use the reflective canopy cover to keep the greenhouse effect to minimum. When we have events in the summer, I use one of these folding canopies ($69 at Costco) and park the planes under it.This is more to protect the covering than anything else...

skrednik

What's this about the Spektrum AR7000s? I just bought the 9303 2.4 and got 2 AR7000s so I could get the 2 free receivers. Was this an issue when they first came out? Guess I need to check JR's site. Thanks. My 88 Yak54 is all done and just waiting for the DA50 to get back from DA for its post crash checkup. Can't wait to get this bird in the air! I miss My old 87 " bad!

AirWizard

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I have used Spektrum AR7000s for a year now with no problems.

jakubk

Hello Everybody,
I have too much wing rock in my EF 88' YAK when I go to elevator and harrier. What can I change in my setup ?
Jakub

EF Yak 88'- DA 50 with KS 1060 tuned pipe,prop 23x8 Biela,4xJR 8711,1xJR8911,Futaba 9405 throttle.

AirWizard

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Try moving the CG around

xtraflyr

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Get the nose up,increase the angle of attack,check the lateral balance,move the cg some. Once you catch the wingrock with aileron,it usually stays put..

Cya,
Frank

diamondave

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i found some planes need a bit more forward speed to help with wing rock, some go slower, it is a balancing act with throttle and ele to find the sweet spot

as far as temps go, thats not overly hot in my opinion, i remeber last year using a pyrometer on the covering fot the heck of it to check the black temp to the yellow, i think i was getting readings then in the 160's on the covering, so in the canopy i can see it getting warmer, but what bothered me is that its not even really hot here yet, thats whay i didnt even think to put the cover on or wheel it into the shade, which is almost imposible with the wings on here, the only shade is the pavilian and that has all the work tables under it, i know there is no way i could use that reciever anytime after 9 or 10 in the summer, so its pcm for me for a while for sure, that needs to be addressed by futaba asap imo, i dont have any issues with my channel at my regular club, i did have a problem at another club i went to as a guest, someone moved my card and put his in place and started flying, i didnt know until i was leaving and went to get my card, luckily we didnt turn on at the same time purley by chance, he said he went around and asked whom i was(my name is on card) and no one knew me so he thought it was left there from the day before, i had 5 people there between the 2 that belong to the club, my wife and a friend, so one of us would have heard him asking for me if he really did go up the flight line, anyway that was one reason i switched to 2.4, but i dont usually go to that club anyway, i like mine better, so pcm is just fine for me at the moment

wavy777

I have exactly the same setup as you Jakub, I found harriers a little tricky with the KS pipe as it makes the engine a little 'peaky'. That said, i stuck with it and checked the lateral balance which made it alot easier to harrier / elevator.

xtraflyr

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I havent tried it yet,Im having to much fun flying it..Try a throttle curve if your radio has that feature. Im kinda use to mine without it though. SOmeday Ill take the time to do it..

MustangAce

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What's the verdict with correcting the incidence problem??

RTK

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Flew mine a couple of days ago. Had to put mucho mucho up trim, it looks like the front counter balance is about 1/4 inch on the low side.

Since I haven't read this whole thread, what is the conscientious?? Leave it, or lower the front of the stab??

Oh, by the way.. If I weighed all the parts correctly, mine came in at 17.5lbs with a lightened G62 on abell muffler. I think I am going to pipe it because I would prefer a little more power, Swinging a Mejz 22x10 over 7000, but still not enough for me.