Pud

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Hey guys,
anyone here ever built a Phaeton 90?
I picked up one here on RCU not too long ago, wondered if anyone has any tips or recommendations ??
Will be a while before I get to it, but I am always thinking about these things, 'ya know!!! (Wife calls it "Plane on the brain"!)
Plan on putting a MDS 1.48 on it(Wahoo!!), will do a little beefing up here and there accordingly.
Like to hear some comments!

Pud

Rodney

I have one, now about 7 years old, and it started out with a 1.2 4 cycle but now sports a 72cc Quadra. I have also greatly enlarged the rudder and ailerons. Don't get me wrong, building it stock works great and is the recommended way to start out. Built to plan, it is a very easy to fly and nice performing plane. Do pay attention to the incidence angles on the wings, it is very important if you want a pleasant flyer. On mine, I have about 1.5 degrees less angle of attack on the upper wing than on the lower wing and it has about 3 degrees right thrust and about the same on downthrust. The smaller Phaeton is also a very nice flying plane. It was one of two bipes that I have built that required no elevator trim when you go inverted; i.e. do a half roll and fly hands off without changing altitude. The other one that does this is the smaller Lazy Ace with a 90 4 stroke on it.

G.F. Reid

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I had one for a few years and it was one of the best flying planes I've ever had. I lost it when it deadsticked while flying inverted and downwind. It really is a majestic plane that looks great doing barnstormer type maneuvers. I flew mine with a 28cc converted Maculloch weedwhacker and it flew just like a full sized Stearman. Very realistic sound and flying speed.
My advice is to put ailerons on top, just because it's so easy to do and beef up the landing gear because if they haven't changed it, it's too flimsy for the plane.
It's on my list of planes I'd build again someday.

FlyinBlind

I just bought a new Phaeton 90 kit, and in it was a flyer on a video from Stick Masters. It covers building, covering, modifacations, engines, radio installation and flying. The cost is only $19.95 with a 24 hour order line at 1-800-951-7172. I'm ordering mine to see what's it's all about. Seems like the concensus of option on the P90 is real good. The plans are very lean on information, so any info is useful to have.

Pud

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Hey FlyinBlind,
After 'ya get that video and watch it, how about posting here about it??
I might have to get one of those if the info it has is worth having.

Cool guys, looks like maybe the Phaeton 90 is a good one!!

Thanks!
Pud

G.F. Reid

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Actually, if you guys are really interested....I've got two old magazine articles about the Phaeton 90. One is a review and the other is an article on modifications to the stock kit. I already have them scanned so no problem to email them out.
Anyone who's interested, just drop me an email [email protected]

Pud

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Greg,
I would be very grateful to see those articles!
Will fire off an email also.
Thanks,
Pud

Edwin

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Same here. I have one in the bones I got for $35 at a swap meet. When I get to it I will need to get CG and incedences. Installing a gasser sounds interesting. I have a ryobi 31cc I just modified, but I dont see any way that beast would work on the P90. Currently have a saito 1.20 assigned to it.
Edwin

G.F. Reid

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Believe me Ed, it'll work. The 1.20 will be great but the Phaeton can easily handle the weight and power of the Ryobi and it will sound and look so realistic that people will stop and watch. You'll have to either shorten the nose a little or mount your radio gear rearward.
I put a hatch in the bottom of the fuse and installed everything near the tail. You're making me want to build another one.

Edwin

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Great articles. I may just move it up in the build que. Would be good having a nice easy going big bipe with lower pucker factor than the speeders and war birds.
Edwin

pmuscutt

G.F. Reid,
Doggone it, just when I finally decided to build the Hog bipe you talk about your beloved Phaeton again What did your Phaeton end up weighing with the Maculloch? Could you get some decent spirited performance with the weight?


Patrick

G.F. Reid

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Heh,heh... Sorry 'bout that Patrick.
You know the funny thing is that I was never a big fan of the Phaeton...before I had one. I always was a bigger fan of either the Pitts/EAA Bipe style or a more rounded, stringered fuse like the Fleet or PT-17. I bought it for the size. There aren't a whole lot of bipes in the 70" range. They're either 60" and under or 80" and over.
After I built it and started flying it, it was the flying qualities of the Phaeton that won me over. That plus the many possiblities it offers for kitbashing into something scale.
I didn't spend much time making mine look pretty, as you can see-but now that I know what a great plane it is, if I ever build another one....

Oh, almost forgot. No, I wouldn't call the performance spirited by any means but it was fairly fast in level flight. It looked slow due to the size but when running alongside faster looking 40 sized sport planes, the speeds were similar. It just didn't have much vertical. A shallow dive was required to loop. The Ryobi will probably be a little better. If you've ever seen a fullscale, stock Stearman do aerobatics, you'll know what I mean. It looked great doing slow rolls, stall turns, spins and that kind of stuff. Just a really fun plane.
I'd guesstimate that it weighed 14 pounds or less ready to fly.

pmuscutt

G.F. Reid,
Good to hear, I may just do that. I just completed a Balsa USA 1/4 cub with Ryobi @16lb, and from level flight it will just loop falling out at the top just a little bit. Might be interesting with a CH ignition to shave off a few ounces and hopefully shoot for something just under 14lb. I think the ryobi and Mculloch are about the same in the weight dept. Ryobi is a little longer though. I actually would like to make it a little more like a Stearman, reshape the tail feathers round out the fuse sides just a touch and slap on a round cowl.

Patrick

FlyinBlind

Hey Guys,
I had Greg Reid send me that information about modifacations to the Phaeton 90. It was insightful and all the changes made sense. I thought I'd put on a Homelite 25cc for the fuel savings, but have opted for an OS 1.20 FS 4C, with Pitts muffler. Dual ailerson's, rib profile change, rounded tail feathers, islation engine mount, etc. Really looking forwar to getting started. However, I'm right in the middle of building an Ultra Hots 1.20, so I'm vacillating between the two. This thread has been very helpful. Thanks for all the input!!

Loren
Walla Walla, WA
"Growing old is inevitable,
Growing up is OPTIONAL !!"

Edwin

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Well, I measured the ryobi with the jag coversion kit. Its 7 7/8" from firewall to back of prop. How much should I move the firewall back to put the prop hub at the designed position? Other than the articles I just got from Greg, I have no other documentation.
Edwin

pmuscutt

Edwin,
Oops After writing the following I noticed you have no plans? You could order a set of plans.

With my 1/4 scale cub what I did was I laid the engine on it's side with the motor mount attached on the plans so the prop hub was lined up with the prop hub on the plans, then I marked where the engine mount was for the placement of the firewall, which happened to be 2" back in my case.

Patrick

G.F. Reid

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Yeah, with the rear carb, the Ryobi gets kinda long.
Edwin, I've got a set of the plans somewhere. If you give me a while to dig them up, I'll measure it and see. If someone else has them handy, maybe they could do it before I can.

Edwin

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I just ordered a set of plans. That should tell me all I need to know, correct? Mainly CG, and incedences. Then I can compare with the article suggested incedences.
Never fails. Got all charged up for this project and I'm not even finished with my current. Just primer sanding and equipment detailing is all thats needed. The P90 shouldnt take too long to finish. Its basically all framed up with a few broken ribs in the wing, no control surfaces, and just a firewall glued to sides. The great thing about it is thats its built straight. Shouldnt take that long to modify the firewall and complete. Thanks for the info.
Edwin

Pud

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Guys,
anyone tried one of the after market cowls available for the Phaeton?
Any recommendations?(as far as looks and quality...IE: fits ok?)
Pud

FlyinBlind

Speaking of cowls....where would I pick up a round cowl for the P90. The stock one just doesn't do anything for me. I started framing mine up today. Now I've got two planes to work on. Maybe even and odd days would work out..

Loren

G.F. Reid

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Stan's Fiberglass is the only one I've ever ordered a glass cowl from and the quality is excellent. He also has some generic round cowls. Just figure out the size you want. http://www.stansfibertech.com/

FlyinBlind

Phaeton Modifications
I just got the fuselage framed up, and made some changes to the tail. I changed the tail to look more like a Pitts, with rounder edges to mimic the wing ends. I stick build all surfaces and then sheeted them with 1/16" balsa. Looks allot cleaner and goes along with the lines of the plane better IMHO. I'm going to add ailerons to the top wing. Has anyone run into problems putting in-wing servos (one for each side) in the lower wing? What about servo placement in the fuselage itself. Any suggestions? I also changed the 1/4" sq. longerons in the fuse to 1/4 x 5/16 to add more strength.What other mods have you builders done to this great plane?

Thanks,
Loren

Pud

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Man, you don't mess around do 'ya?
I haven't even looked the plans over in my kit yet, and you just about have the fuse framed up!!??

Well, keep good notes, (especially any "mods") you are 'gonna be getting some questions when I get around to building mine!!

Cool, glad to see your moving right along on that big bipe!

Pud

G.F. Reid

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I mounted the servos out in the wing bays with no problems encountered. That was driving upper and lower wing ailerons too. Becuase I was using a heavy engine, I mounted my radio equipment along with the rudder and elevator servos in the rear of the fuselage. I cut a hatch in the bottom for access. I mounted the servos inside, not with the tops sticking out. I also cut a hatch in the lower front of the fuse to for tank and engine bolt access.

FlyinBlind

I was just wondering about pushrods for the Phaeton 90. The plans call for Nyrods, with one control horn on the rudder and one on the eleveator. I was thinking of using split elevators with fiberglass pushrods, and for the rudder a pull-pull system . For ailersons I was thinking of putting two in the center, each driving one side for the top and bottom ailerons. Is this too much for this plane? or does this sound reasonable. Input appreciated from past builders of the P90.
Thanks,
Loren