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F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

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Old 08-03-2007, 05:54 PM
  #501
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

tam popo
Sorry for the delay in my response. I got too Excited when I saw Buggy in here.
RCHubbub has the perfect solution, DUBRO makes the same parts. Make sure to use double sided servo tape under the servos. TO do the bend on the rod nicely you can use “Z” bend pliers from a hobby store or electronics store such as RADIO SHACK. I think they cost $12-$14 (few years ago).
Use same procedure as building any ARF. Make the top of Elevon flush with top of wing. No need to change stock control horns. Better to have all the holes a little snug so you can feel a little drag versus a loose hole. No play, then no slop. Practice making “Z” bend on the excess length of the rod which usually come in 12” min length.
tam popo,
Great to hear that many other people read this thread. I do my best to be factual and exact. I would hate to let people down with bad info. Or to propagate inaccurate info, or hearsay without my own verification using actual measurements that are quantifiable and repeatable.
Some of the guys that read this thread but don't post have invited me to post in some other threads, but I just don't have any extra time left after responding to posts, PMs, e-mails, phone calls and add to that Instant messenger (expanding my horizons in many ways).
I’ve had a lot of PMs and e-mails urging me to explore more….So the Eagle Tree systems will give us a good insight as to what goes on after the plane is launched.

Would be good to know how many watts are needed to go 60MPH, 70 MPH, and so on.
Like ordering a hotdog…I want the ketchup, mustard, relish, …this that…next thing you know, the Eagle Tree systems bill became 2 ½ big ones $.
_____________________
gditeam,
Batteries in series with your 2000KV….NO, not unless they are 2S and identical cell type. 6S is too much for your KV on that motor. If you are serious about trying 5S, then you better go out and get a wattmeter first, then we can talk.
Looks like by now, you might have bought a battery. If so let me know what it is and I’ll think about a prop. How hard do you want to push your motor,, enough to get it a little hot, or very hot or you really want it to stay cool? I’m trying to see if you should go try 6.5” diameter prop to increase your climb rate or not….Trying to see how much you care about this motor given some of your previous posts.
Feel free to send me your thoughts in a PM if you don’t want to post…no difference to me.
__________________________
I have an opportunity to go back to work to get some assembly done on the battery discharger with the main technician. But I want to drop the ball and go see family. Trying to make up my mind. I know what I’ll decide if I look at buggy’s video a couple of times. I have the original file on my hard drive from his e-mail way back. When I need inspiration I watch that video and I get back to work on Stryker again. Works for me EVERY TIME.

I hope you all have a great weekend.

Gryphon
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Old 08-03-2007, 06:22 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Ace Dude,

You asked about testing between the APC E 6X4 and APC Sport 6X4. No, I'm not aware of any particular testing.
That would be some great info.

What I believe is that the APC E 7" or 8" diameter props may draw more than the similar Sport props because they are so wide.

You should be able to run the 7" props on many motors.

Maybe I should run the APC E 7X5 on mine. That would give me a good indication by comparing the numbers to the APC Sport 7X6 or 7X7 (incase the E7X5 draws a lot).

The 6" electric props are not so wide(not that wide), so I don't want to guess without testing.

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Old 08-03-2007, 06:39 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I gotta run, be back later.

In the meantime anyone know of any good speed 400 mounts for these motors for bench testing?
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Old 08-03-2007, 06:51 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Ace Dude

How about your own Stryker and its F-27C motor mount?

That is what I use.

I put few books below it and a couple of real heavy objects(extra heavy) in front of wing. With big thrust I have caused small dents in the leading edge of wing in the past. So I now fold a rag in front of wing as cushion and I then tape it down.
Make sure there are no papers around. It'll make a mess of the room in a second. Voice of experience...or in-experience.

I do it this way because my fuse is strong, so is my motor mount area.

Do it safer than me if you can and tell me how to do it better. I like to find a better way. For now, I'm looking forward to Eagle Tree Systems in flight numbers.


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Old 08-03-2007, 07:07 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Hiya guys: Saw this and thought of you http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nQWE69ncok# Now thats wot I call a flight simulator!!
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Old 08-03-2007, 07:51 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

tam popo,


Good one bro.
The desk and monitor looked too close to mine........, oh yeah and the flight simulator Joystick that my brother bought for me.

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Old 08-03-2007, 09:17 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I am sure that this has been covered before, but I was wondering if someone could direct me, or share with me the optimum ESC settings for a Mega 16/25/2 with a CC Phoenix 80 and a TP 4500 extreem 3S Li-po.

Thanks,

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Old 08-03-2007, 09:36 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Gryphon

How about your own Stryker and its F-27C motor mount?

That is what I use.

I put few books below it and a couple of real heavy objects(extra heavy) in front of wing. With big thrust I have caused small dents in the leading edge of wing in the past. So I now fold a rag in front of wing as cushion and I then tape it down.
Make sure there are no papers around. It'll make a mess of the room in a second. Voice of experience...or in-experience.

I do it this way because my fuse is strong, so is my motor mount area.

Do it safer than me if you can and tell me how to do it better. I like to find a better way. For now, I'm looking forward to Eagle Tree Systems in flight numbers.

Gryphon
I'm just looking for a mount for bench testing, something that would be permanently attached to a rigid mounting structure. I could buy another Stryker mount, but was wondering if something better was available. I think testing multiple motor/prop combinations would be much easier on the bench than in the air. Also, using the PowerAnalyzer Pro you can generate your own ESC waveform which you can replicate for every test. With this you can record your measurements at 10%, 20%, etc. throttle positions.

I guest the best thing to do is order another Stryker mount and just mount it to a 2x6 or 2x8 and clamp it down.


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Old 08-03-2007, 09:45 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

LT-40 ,

someone ???.

Setting 1) Cut off voltage, leave it on Auto Lipo (option 1, default).......... unless you have castle link and are going to stay with same number of cells for a while.
In that case using castle link change the cutoff to a little higher than 3.0V, try 3.2V per cell (9.6V for 3S). For first 2-3 flights, change it to 3.5 or 3.6V per cell.

Setting 2) current limiting, no change, leave it on option 3 standard , default.

Setting 3) Brake type, leave it on option 1, soft delayed brake, default (unless you like no brake). Must have delay, Cannot have hard brake above 3S.

Setting 4)throttle type, option 1, Auto Calibrating throttle, default.

Setting 5) Electronic timing advance, option 2, standard timing. (adjust high or low timing only if you need to make more or less power using same prop).

setting 6) cutoff type, I prefer the default , Hard cutoff. Your call, I think cutoff happens too late at 3.0V and I rather not use any more juice unless it is an emergency.

Setting 7) Soft start, option 2, soft start, default. I think this may help the motor mount live longer. More of an issue with F-27B mount. Your call.

Setting 8) option 1, 13 KHZ, default. The CC techs want to see this option removed. I say but Castle Creations own papers say for MEGA higher setting, the guys say we tested no improvement but it makes the ESC work too hard, we want it gone, for now leave it on min of 13KHZ. ***Worth testing huh? If you have a tach and temp probe let us know....But stay safe and leave it on min.

***after you change the option that you want, no need to go to end, just exit.

***HUGE HINT: BUY CASTLE LINK FOR $22-$25. (free tip from me).

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Old 08-03-2007, 09:50 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I tested APC E 7X5. see pic
8/3/2007
APC E
7X5
12.30V no load before test
10.57V under load
84.7A
896W
19860RPM
94MPH Pitch speed
(150mAh used).

It was dark so I used flash light. Hyperion E-meter has a built in tach.

I have a guest, will discuss later

Gryphon


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Old 08-03-2007, 10:29 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Thanks Gryphon,

When I said "Someone", you were right, I was 99% sure that you would be the one with the answer, but I didn't want to exclude anybody.

Anyways, sounds good!

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Old 08-04-2007, 12:16 AM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

LT-40,

I was just teasing too. I know you didn't want to exclude anyone.

Good to have some fun at times right?

Well, this time I didn't need to watch buggy's video...just thinking about it got me to stay home and get ready to meet my co-worker on our day off and start the build of my battery discharger. Remember the pic on the bottom of page 19? Some assembly will be done and lots of planning.
Good night,

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Old 08-04-2007, 07:42 AM
  #513
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I recently received two of those Sierra Perfect Prop Adapters (3.2mm) and they look pretty nice. I plan to try them soon. I needed some new prop adapters for the new motors and heard some good things about these prop adapters.

http://www.sierrahobby.com/

I ordered from Bishop Power Products, currently they are offering free shipping on any order over $20. Two adapters and the wrench came to just over $20. The free shipping was supposed to ship Priority Mail, but came 1st class so I was a little disappointed, but still received my order in a reasonable amount of time.

http://www.b-p-p.com/products.php?cat=30

Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with BPP in any way.
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Old 08-04-2007, 08:14 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Gryphon

gditeam,

He wanted to go that fast.
"Gryphon what is needed to go 200"
I'm like...no way...but I have a recipe for 160-170 level flight...you'll need 3000W and a lot of battery with 60 O.Z. total weight.
That killed it right there, well at least for a non thinned wing.


Gryphon

Something that has been on my mind for a while. I used to build surfboards. Not professionally, but for personal use.

Have you ever seen photos of a surfer leaning at 50+ degrees from vertical at the bottom of a triple overhead wave?

Consider some rough math: A 75 kilogram man standing on board weighing about 4 kilograms with roughly two g's of force traveling at over 10 m/sec on a fluid that is about 1000 times denser then air.

So, anybody guide me/know of a glassed-over high speed foamy?

Just a thought.




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Old 08-05-2007, 10:10 AM
  #515
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

My stryker is Bullet proof except for 1 thing........it needs something done to the motor mount.....it keeps breaking right where the eye holes are where the screws to the engine screw in.....thanks
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Old 08-05-2007, 01:49 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Hello everyone... Finished a morning of "benchtesting" a new Mega 16/25/3....

Wanted to get opinions on how these numbers looked....

I calculated Approx Prop Speed as Pitch X RPM then divided by 1056... then "washed" it down by 11% ....

From the looks of it, the 6.5 X 6.5 looks best on 4S and the 6X6 looks best on 3S....

After GREAT help by Gryphon (tons of emails)... I wanted opinions and to share all the info....
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Old 08-05-2007, 03:43 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Kaw1000 - I had the same problem with stock mount but my LHS had a mount thats ideal. It has all the holes in right place plus a few other but it doesn't stand proud of the body, basically its moulded nylon/plastic and in side elevaton is a letter "L" thats fallen to the left (forgive that description!!) - the only problem is that it is flat on the bottom so you will have to remove the foam hump. The mount has built-in thrust ngle. Cost £3!!! They should be available over the pond, you've got everything else (good weather, music, burgers and big big women!!).
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Old 08-05-2007, 05:14 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Bonefisher,

If I were you I would edit the post and just give prop pitch speed.
The washing down of 11% really does not work to get approx speed of plane. It all depends on size of prop, thickness of wing and such. That column might turn out to be misleading to some.

If you can add to the same post the type of battery used, as in 3S-2100 15C or 4S-3500 25C etc...That could be added in the Post, doesn't have to be in chart.
Just an idea.


One more thing, it looks like you were down to 9V in the 2100-3S using 6.5X6.5 prop.
Watts/amps = voltage (while under load). Looks like the battery was not keeping up. Was it near empty or a 10C battery, or damaged?
EDIT: I wrote the above because in the e-mail to me you wrote 260W and 29A...I guess it was a type "O". At a quick glance, the numbers in the post above seem fine voltage wise (around 10V).

Just want you to know that the 4S info is worth gold to my brother and I . Thanks man way to go.
I owe you a big one. As soon as my bro gets back from vacation he is going to run his 16/25/3 on 80A ESC and 4S-3300 25C. Well I’m now on the other side of country and I can use your awesome numbers to help him choose a prop. I’ll start him on the APC Pylon 6.5X5.0 and gradually have him go up to 7X7 by changing 2 or 3 props in between over a couple of weeks.
____________________

Kaw1000,
If you are using F-27B mount then switch over to F-27C mount.
If using F-27C mount try using 4 screws and/or set ESC on soft start if it has that option.
For 4 screws slot 2 of the holes as needed.

Gryphon
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Old 08-05-2007, 07:57 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

Hey guys,

I have got all of my stuff monted, and my stryker is still quite nose heavy. I have the battery moved back pretty far, and the esc is sitting right at the base of the motor mount. I have heard that it is ok to have them be a little nose heavy, but how much?

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Old 08-05-2007, 08:04 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I took out my stryker today and was so damn happy with her results. I am going to be working on my "darkside" build that will be completed in a few months and odds are is the soonest I will be ready for that speed increase.

My setup I tried out today

6 series 2k e-flite motor
2100 3s 15c lipo
6x5.5 ac prop
40a e-flite esc
working air ducts

Right when I launched the plane I realized I just took a big leap from a stock b to a modded c setup BUT all I can say is holy cow.... Once I landed I put my hand up to see it shaking LOL. I think that means that this amount of speed is good enough for me for the next month or so. After one flight I am already selling my B stryker setup and not looking back.

I think this setup above gives more then enough power and the verticals were amazing. I still need to race her against a stock c setup and see how it does but after my friend flew his c and I chucked mine in the air he was amazed at the speed that mine was doing. This is by far the best damn hobby to get into and keeps you from doing that dumb stuff that can cause headaches in your life.

Stryker 4 Life.
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Old 08-05-2007, 08:48 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

I got to do some testing today. Here's what the graphs look like. I did two flights, each with a different battery, but of the same type, just a different prop. One flight on the APC 6x4E and the other using the 6x4 Sport Gas prop. You'll notice one flight was much shorter than the other. Let me know what you think.

How well do you think those packs are holding their voltage under load?
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Old 08-05-2007, 09:16 PM
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Ace Dude


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Gryphon

How about your own Stryker and its F-27C motor mount?

That is what I use.

I put few books below it and a couple of real heavy objects(extra heavy) in front of wing. With big thrust I have caused small dents in the leading edge of wing in the past. So I now fold a rag in front of wing as cushion and I then tape it down.
Make sure there are no papers around. It'll make a mess of the room in a second. Voice of experience...or in-experience.

I do it this way because my fuse is strong, so is my motor mount area.

Do it safer than me if you can and tell me how to do it better. I like to find a better way. For now, I'm looking forward to Eagle Tree Systems in flight numbers.

Gryphon
I'm just looking for a mount for bench testing, something that would be permanently attached to a rigid mounting structure. I could buy another Stryker mount, but was wondering if something better was available. I think testing multiple motor/prop combinations would be much easier on the bench than in the air. Also, using the PowerAnalyzer Pro you can generate your own ESC waveform which you can replicate for every test. With this you can record your measurements at 10%, 20%, etc. throttle positions.

I guest the best thing to do is order another Stryker mount and just mount it to a 2x6 or 2x8 and clamp it down.


If you are testing multiple sized motor cans you can go to home depot and get a pipe clamp called a minirilack or "mini" Its a semi-horse shoe looking clamp that gets screwed down from the bottom and clamps together with a nut and bolt at the top. I used to have a bunch set up for different sized clamps. Make sure they are for EMT and not Rigid. I'll post some pics of what they look like if i can find a few laying around.
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Old 08-05-2007, 09:29 PM
  #523
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Buggygovroom

If you are testing multiple sized motor cans you can go to home depot and get a pipe clamp called a minirilack or "mini" Its a semi-horse shoe looking clamp that gets screwed down from the bottom and clamps together with a nut and bolt at the top. I used to have a bunch set up for different sized clamps. Make sure they are for EMT and not Rigid. I'll post some pics of what they look like if i can find a few laying around.
A picture would be great. I'm in Home Depot all the time, but I'm drawing a blank here. When you say EMT/Rigid, I assume you're talking about electrical conduit? Would these clamps be in the electrical department? Does this look something like a "C" clamp?

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Old 08-05-2007, 09:31 PM
  #524
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Default RE: F27 STRYKER -Way Past the Limits Part 6 -Go deeper in to the Dark Side...

What size bullet connectors is everyone running between their ESC and motor?
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Old 08-05-2007, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: gditeam

I took out my stryker today and was so damn happy with her results. I am going to be working on my "darkside" build that will be completed in a few months and odds are is the soonest I will be ready for that speed increase.

My setup I tried out today

6 series 2k e-flite motor
2100 3s 15c lipo
6x5.5 ac prop
40a e-flite esc
working air ducts


Stryker 4 Life.
Baby steps into the dark zone.....


gdi, I have the same ESC and motor as you. But still running the stock 6x4 prop. Today I ran with my new ThunderPower 2070 3s 25c constant. I was NOT impressed. Maybe 5 - 10 mph increase. But because of this thread, I know how to move forward.

Prop upgrade time.

~Bub
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