combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Way to go...!
All things being equal, this size and weight of plane is probably twice as crash resistant than it's larger cousins.
The launch went too easy, so apparently the model isn't small enough yet.

Pond Skipper

Thank you Chuck, lucky for me my eyes have been trained on the 17in span Lil Speedy this one is tougher to see on the back end. For sure not a one to fly at dusk. I kept putting my thumb on the throttle by habit, no slowing this one down lol none stop full on will take some getting use to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmRPcHR1AOc

Use link as you will need full screen to see this one..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmRPcHR1AOc

Pond Skipper

I think a 12in delta is possible if you can keep up with it.
Would for sure need a rich setting for slower flying till you get use to it.

For the NANO I plan to run the engine richer till I sort out if the
ailerons need more reduction, today was a wake up call..

aspeed

Nice thing about the little guys is their toughness. Could not see much in the video because it is the size of a sparrow? Kewl. Makes me want to make one. Maybe a bit slower/bigger because of my age limit.

Pond Skipper

Should be able to fly much closer to the camera after I have the throws dialed in.
It covers ground fast the whole test flight was big sky flying. For best viewing you need to set preferences
to 720P or 1080P HD and big monitor if possible. I am able track the entire flight on a 24" monitor / 1080P.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

So how much throw was too much? I'm thinking that about 1/16" deflection / 7-8 degrees should be lots.

Pond Skipper

Yea looks like from the vid I had too much here is a pic of the surface defection both directions.
Preflight footage cut from the posted vid. I have around 1/8th inch now will try that next, starting flush
with the center sections trialing edge. Knowing the small ones take very little throw I flew at 40%
now at 20%.

I do want a nice roll rate but my thumbs where use to flying the larger plane it's a
learning curve to not over throw the stick. 1/16th should motivate for sure to be safe I will set up
dual rates an have 1/8th as my high rate and 10% / 1/16th as low rates.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

That was a pretty violent landing for the plane to "walk away from" unscathed.
After seeing that, it gives you some insight as to what is needed for bare strength minimums.
1/2A RC Combat has been useful for the same purpose.
Yes, 1/16" either side of center ought to be a sporty setting for ailerons. For Pylon Trim, even less I'll bet, but you would still want a higher rate option for landing dead stick on a windy day.

Pond Skipper

That sucker twisted in inverted and smacked in at full bore, had it been a balsa fuselage there would have been repairs for sure. The engine is so small dirt is like boulders inside the combustion chamber.
Had it been summer time the ground would be dry and hard with brown dead grass to cushion the blow.


The Lil Speedy has full strip ailerons and hair more deflection to start with and still does.
It's more flat bottom airfoil slows down airflow under and speeds it up on top the fully symmetrical wing speeds it up under and over making the ailerons more effective this is the difference that sent it off in a fast spin I think. Prior to this I was doing minimal movements zipping about, I put in up elevator and hard left aileron to do a fast turn right in front of the cam. Instead the ailerons over rode the elevator at the speed it was going and showed me its roll rate before I had tested it out higher in the air. I should have ran it more rich for the first flight given me more time to discover the mid level throws. I had just finally had it in trim it was time to start flying closer to the cam. Rebate time is due.

Reference maiden flight with the TD.010 / Lil Speedy / same stock prop.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU0Le8UVXbw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU0Le8UVXbw
Edit for the NANO tonight I set throws at 17% ailerons and 22% on the elevator.

Pond Skipper

FYI GEMFAN plastic props came in for review bought on a hunch as no data is given for dia. / pitch.

Prop appears to be a 4x3 hub is reinforced big plus.
Weight:
1.5g vs 2.1g cox 4.5x2

Should be a winner for speed upgrade over a stock prop / prop is thought out with an airfoil.
Hub has a built in spinner helping to reduce spinning mass on the engine.





http://www.ebay.com/itm/291471086591...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT


Also for the first time a carbon fiber 3030 trimed to 2.5x3 should be safe for the TD .010



http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...cw_1pair_.html

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

Okay, there's the Micro Scat Cat prop! Time for another HK order.

I notice some new APC props designed for quad racing, they just have to be useful for other things too.. http://www.apcprop.com/category_s/12.htm

Pond Skipper

Lol I beat you to it bought 5 sets just to get 5 CCW / $29.23 shipped so 5.85 ea not bad for carbon!

Yes about 4 months ago they started adding props to their drone line started
with standard props now it's morphed into some designated designs. In time
they will try their hand at 3" and more 4" props I hope.

The 3030 could be used with the TD .020 as is.

TD .020 results with the light weight 3ch design Lil Speedy:
So far 3.75x3E best passes:
29.55k level passes / 84 mph
31.41k down wind dive / 89.3 mph

Est. 3x3E - taking in account its wider blade
32.5 level pass / 92 mph
34.4k down wind dive / 98 mph

Really need a 3.5x3.5 / 3x4

On a side note tracking says these will be in my mail box Friday

4x2.8 apparently from the same manufacture out of china found on ebay.
Hobby King sells them too great for the TD .020 as I will test this weekend.
I expect loading will be around the same as the 3.75x3 but even faster vertical
Vertical now is about 45mph straight up hope to bust 50mph as the blade
is a bit wider too looking for faster turns too.



Here are both links ebay was a bit cheaper 3.25ea

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4x-Carbon-Fi...gAAOSwv0tU~aaH


http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...CW_1pair_.html


Could work...

Mr Cox

What are the rpm ratings of these props?

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

I think Brad has volunteered to bravely find the limits for all of us.. then we can buy them afterwards with impunity.

Okay maybe not..

My opinion is we probably worry more than needed about electric props on the small stuff. After all, considering how hard a fast electric motor spools up on small light props, is the single power stroke per revolution really all that much of a big deal. Not sure.

Mr Cox

Yes, electric props for high rpm applications are probably fine, those electric motors can certainly turn some high rpms. With Graupner and APC you get recommended maximum rpm, while with cox props for instance you have to more very careful, they also had a bad batch made of the 5x3 props recently...

I don't know much about the electric stuff, but quads are all about static thrust(?) so I guess they are only meant for rpms around 10-15krpm?

If you look at a proper carbon prop that is designed for high rpm use, you can see that they only put carbon strands along the high tension direction, where it counts. The direction of the weave in the pictures above just doesn't look right in order to provide any strength in tension mode?

All the cheap Chinese stuff with added "bling" just gives me the creeps...

Pond Skipper

The race guys go for high rpm and these things are always in static load lifting..

Here you go use at your own risk. I wear safety glasses when I fly with two exposed juggler veins.
So far the E Flight 3.75x3 can handle 32,000 rpm and vertical loading.
The green drone prop 3x2 can handle 36,000 rpm

These are strong enough from my inspections thus far.
4x2.8 carbon 2.6g out of the 6 CCW bought the weight varies up to 2.9g

Stock prop is 2g / E-Flight is 1.2g

The good thing is these where made by humans so I'm willing to try them out.

Mr Cox

I did some "googling" on the Gemfan props, still haven't found any rpm rating, but lots of threads and youtube videos about failing props...

I will not use them myself...

Take care!

Pond Skipper

Its not about the brand name it's about the prop type. Type of design is everything.

That prop you show is just like the GWS props not the same as what I have from GEMFAN

Drone props hit things clearly may cause failure, not due to 70w motor stress 150w maybe..
However even with my 38w TD .020 I wouldn't use those type either but the ones I bought I will.

Take a look how the blade at the hub is reinforced, not even the same type material.
GEMFAN Blade 200 QX Propellers



http://www.ebay.com/itm/291471086591...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

It is actually not uncommon to apply glass or carbon weave to the face of an otherwise unidirectional CF prop, I have a couple of examples. It provides resistance to splitting, not to mention a nice surface finish.

So if you get a balance of bling and functionality, that's good. If the whole prop is made of pieces of weave, well that's a different thing. I see weave on both faces.. is there any unidirectional fibre hiding in there?

Pond Skipper

Bling?? Was bling das nein blingstein hier!




Edit:
The stiff blade may help hold a steady peak prior to launch the weight is 1.4g
more than the E-flite 3.75x3 and the blade is thicker. The best attributes from
the carbon prop will be more thrust having a wider blade and bit more dia. with good speed from the 2.8 pitch.

For now the E-flites rule there is nothing on the market that can touch
their performance I have looked everywhere. I have 9 of them on hand for use.

There is another of interest it too has a more beefy hub to prop joint and
is a Eflite 5.25x3.5 the extra pitch will allow a cut down 3.5x3.5 the perfect speed
prop for the TD .020 / Est. 29k / down wind passes to 110mph / 96 mph level
passes cross wind. Can mod the carbon prop of course.

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Never say it isn't possible to throw a blade, but I've run some pretty mismatched combos [tiny prop / big engine] and have never thrown a blade...except once with a cheap plastic 14 x 6 on a 1.20 engine.
These tiny 3 and 4 inch props just don't generate that much force against the hub, but always handle the running setup like you are holding a snake before launch.

Pond Skipper

Getting ready for Sunday flying I have put some pop on the top wing the neon pink should make
both right and left panels obvious as it bolts around in a screaming blur.

Pond Skipper

Gentleman I have broken the world speed record for the TD .010 with a stock prop and engine...if there was one lol.

Best down wind: 39,567 rpm / 47 mph per calc / but with a 1:1 thrust to weight ratio it was going past 50 with ease.
I caught it on vid last pass of the flying session. Plane lands great nice and smooth wing loading is spot on.
2nd best pass 38,840 rpm

The lower rates did the trick but I need to add some back to improve roll rate, its set at 16% right now
will try 22% next.

Media to follow will upload...

combatpigg

My Feedback: (3)

Well done...!
Wish I could watch it in person, I've never seen a .020 or .010 doing anything other than serving duty as conversation pieces.

Pond Skipper

Thank you Chuck,

I have new vid of both planes the Carbon prop performed very well with the Lil Speedy.
I have two vids of the Lil Speedy one with the 3.75x3 and one with the 4x2.8 carbon
both props did very good on a sunny day.


Here is the NANO the final few passes the last one hits 39,567 rpm. I have edited out the trim flight section
of the vid and only show the good stuff. Plane tracks on rails with the wings airfoil and shape. I never knew
the TD .010 could reach such rpm it has changed the game. I have not had a chance to review the TD .020
today I suspect more record breaking rpm / speed. Edit carbon prop did 30,113 down wind 28.2k cross.
thus far looking at part of the vid..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCueeI9HbEU Total run time was 4.27mins from start up to the engine stopping, 5g worth of fuel weight.