av8rsodt

My Feedback: (23)

Larry -

I have read lots of references on RCU that you worked for Cox at one time... Durious, what is your story? Did you know L.M. Cox?

I would love to hear about your contributions of Cox history...

Thanks!
Brian (Av8rsodt)

DesignMan

Sorry to miss your post for so long, I have been rather busy.

I worked for C*x for a total of 9 years in two sessions. The first time was 1972 through 1977, the second from 1988 through 1992. I met Roy Cox once, but when I worked there Liesure Dynamics owned the place and it was run by Bill Selzer.

I was involved in a lot of projects, some I initiated, others I finished or helped on. My favorite achievements were the ME-109/Chipmunk Super Stunter, the Black Widow, Killer Bee, RC05, RC09, QRC and Venom engines, the Electric Bearcat, the Balsa ARF Katydid and Scorpio and the ARF Lazy Bee. There was lots more, of course.

Until bought by the current owners, it was a dream come true, a job unlike any other I could have had in my lifetime. The guys there were helpful, competent and knowledgable. Some of them are Bill Atwood, Ron Young, Bruce Tunberg, Bill Fogler, Phillipe DesLespinay, Doug Malewicki (Robosaurus inventor), Charlie Mackey, Lee Renaud, Randy Wrisley, Randy Heydon and Kit McNorgan.

As a result of my employment and modeling involvement, I also handled a certain amount of PR work and eventually did some articles, almost all on 1/2A stuff. As a result of sending out sample engines and a magazine column, I have had the wonderful opportunity to meet an amazing number of "world class" modelers. The list is endless, and I am happy to say, that these people are universally interested in promoting the hobby and the skills of other modelers. They set a high standard as human beings in addition to their professional and/or competition prowess.

When not working for C*x, I have put in 11 years at Mattel, and now 5 or so in the Quick-Serve-Restaurant premium toy design field. These specifically are the give-aways from Burger King (GO BUY A WHOPPER!!!) I do a spot of free-lance design in the model industry, and plan to do more as I taper off this working for a living stuff.

Two kids, both married, one grandbaby. Everybody employed. My wife, Jeannette, and I are discussing what to do for our 25th anniversary next year. Life is GOOD!!!

mr_leffe

Yes indeed ... Life is good. With all the other things we have model airlpanes. I think I would be in Jail if I hadn't found them.
Maybe you can throw some light and the answer to one of life's persistant Questions........ Guy at the Acne Building doesn't return my calls.
Q..........The demise of the .020TD.... When I posted the question we only got conjecture and maybeeees.

DICKEYBIRD

Thanks for the bio Larry! Great stuff. Us Cox fans lap up any and all history on the company. I wish somebody'd do a program on the History Channel. It'd be much better than some of the shows I've seen lately. The creativity, sheer numbers and innovative production methods in the glory days would make a great story.

Mr_leffe, I suspect the Tee Dee .020 died because the sales numbers were just too low to make enough money. AFAIK they weren't used on an RTF model which would have limited sales to the numbers used by FF competion flyers and a few fanatics like us. Just not enough numbers to sustain the machinery and man-power needed to keep the process going.[] That may not have been the whole story but I'm pretty sure a it was a big part of it.

av8rsodt

My Feedback: (23)

Larry,

Thanks for the reply! I was in no hurry, I figured you would come across it sometime soon.

I, like DB, would love to see more history on Cox and its products. A History Channel show would be perfect.

Was there a team at Cox that brainstormed plane / engine projects?

Once the project was selected what happened? How were prototypes made / tested?

I am curious since Cox seemed to a master at this process...

Thanks again for you insights,
Brian (Av8rsodt)

DesignMan

Near total anarchy. Some engineer would get a wild idea, bounce it off the engineering boss, Bruce Paton, for an OK to proceed. We would then rough out a design on paper. The geniuses in the model shop, run by Cordy Freyermuth, would build it and then we would fiddle around until it flew, drove, sailed etc. Then it would be presented to management. If it was a go, we had professional draughtsmen who knew all the details of draft angles, wall thickness, undercuts etc. Finally the tooling guy would have the tools designed and made, the art guys would design the boxes, Otto Kuhni would do a painting for the cover, and there it was.

There was a huge closet with an incredible bunch of old prototypes that didn't make production. My favorite was the .020 ornithopter. All that got trashed when Leisure Dynamics shut the place down [:@]

BMatthews

I had one of those Messerschmitt stunters and a great model it was!

Too bad you didn't have a hand in those almost unflyable P40's and Spitfires and other plastic Frissbees from the early years.... From what I have seen and heard the ONLY one of the plastic lot that flew decently was the PT19. I tried to help a kid fly a Spitfire and it was a disaster. At one point I won a Reno Racer P51 and flew it as a way to "remove" the engine for other more useful duties. It actually flew decently but it sure was NOT a beginner's design. It was fast, touchy and tended to come in on the lines. I suppose I flew it about 20 or 25 times before it met it's end flying combat. The streamer slowed it down too much and it came in on the lines and busted the wing.

Regardless of all that there is no doubt that Cox was a major player in modeling and it's sorry to see that it's purchase by the conglomerates lead to not only it's demise but a loss of the historical aspects to the hobby.

DesignMan

Actually, the Stuka was a very good model, but very fragile. I would occasionally fly them in shows, and could nurse a huge loop out of them. Smooth flyer, as I recall.

The P-40 was another matter altogether. I never could get one to be smooth and stable without cranking the line spacing down to near zero. As a tribute to his flying skill, Bart Klapinski could fly three of them at one time and keep them in formation. Must be nice to be quick AND coordinated. (He did win stunt at the Nationals, and many other first places in major competition)

Around 1975, I went through the design of all the current C*x models and retuned the control sensitivity and balance points to get them as smooth as possible. The P-40 was the only real failure, I never could find anything worth doing to stabilize it.[&o]

av8rsodt

My Feedback: (23)

Larry,

How did the guys in prototype shop make the models? I heard the production dies cost something like $50k, so pretty expensive.

I am thinking of the Lil Stinker bipe... been around for years up until '95 when the gold edition came out. I am glad to have been able to purchase (2): #349 and #351... still in their boxes brand new.

Thanks,
Brian

DesignMan

The main technique for fuselages and wings was vacuum-forming. You carve a plug just undersize of what you want, then use a machine that heats sheet plastic then sucks it down over the plug to form it. The parts are then trimmed and fitted to each other, internal parts built up of plastic sheet(we often raided old model product for bellcranks and mounts, hinges, etc. Back in the '70s we figured a model cost about $1500 to produce. We were VERY careful with them!

Sheet styrene and good old plastic cement are pretty fuelproof, so no finish was required.