Fair enough, but I still say flying is flying. Those of us with some education, I have a BS in Information Systems, do understand aerodynamics. But I do take exception to the "flying outlaw" comment. Why is it "outlaw" to fly outside a club? I guess things are different here in SoCal. We don't need "permits" to fly like in New York. Oh well, I am not trying to de-legitimize clubs or instruction, I am just trying to point out that those of us who fly "outlaw" don't enjoy our exerience any less than you guys do.