Thanks for the feedback. I agree with reading the manual and have done it twice, but prob could use a coupld of more times. As far as the experimenting goes, I agree as well but unfortunately sometimes the plane is not as forgiving to the experimenting as I believe happened today :-) and crashes happen. I think there is some standard initial setup for these types of planes and your feedback certainly helps. Any other suggestions from you or the other members will be greatly appreciated. thanks