Originally Posted by
porcia83
Well that's curious, because the Navy sure seems to have a huge problem over the past few years with crashes, accident, and it's pilots violating protocol. At what point does the leadership take responsibility for this well established record of reckless behavior (not setting instruments correctly, doing extremely low unauthorized fly-bys?
Well, the current mishap rate, through June, is 0.85/100,000 flight hours. That's on track to be the fourth best year ever. Of the six events you mentioned, the Blue Angel one happened because the pilot apparently failed to properly execute a planned maneuver. The dipping helos and the too low flyby were breaches of flight discipline, the Hornet crash at Fallon and the T-45 crash reasons have yet to be determined, and the E2 event was a material failure - that due to the skill of the crew DID NOT result in a mishap. Oh, speaking of mishap rates, what's the AMA's? Oh, that's right. They don't know because they don't collect data!
(BTW, I did a rough calculation of a jet event based on numbers presented in MA a while back - mishap rate at that event was about ten times higher than the GA mishap rate).
The Blue Angel pilot knew the maneuver was high risk and left little room for error. As he knew departure from the procedure could be fatal, that appears to be pilot error. Nobody said "accidents happen" and just moved along. They did an in depth investigation, and as a risk mitigation will not perform that maneuver again this year. Had he not perished, there would have been consequences, as there have in years past. In fact, two Blue Angels resigned from the team when they breached flight discipline. They held themselves accountable, despite the public embarrassment that would cause them personally. Yet they did the right thing.
For the two flight discipline breaches, the dipping helos and the too low flyby, accountability was swift and decisive. The pilots involved were grounded by their unit commanders, and those groundings made permanent after an investigation. Quite literally, those particular flights were their last in Naval aircraft. Contrast that with AMA who's grappling with flight discipline problems in a high profile community. I've yet to see a single waiver pulled as a result.
When we figure out why the Marine Hornet at Fallon crashed and why the T-45 crashed, there will be action taken. I assure you that nobody is saying "accidents happen" and moving on.
And the material failure with the E2. We had a similar problem with a mishap at my base. We investigated the failure, traced it to a defective lot of purchase cables, and immediately removed all of the remaining members of that lot from supplies world-wide. Again, nobody was satisfied with "accidents happen." We found out why and fixed it.
Originally Posted by
porcia83
I guess you would expect a CD to be a johnny on the spot judge and jury by looking at someone's "waiver history" and deciding if they should fly or not?
Hyperbole aside, that's not what I'm saying. Rather, when an individual is known to have a history of performance or flight discipline issues, wouldn't it be prudent to watch them more closely? But AMA prevents that by wiping the slate clean when a waiver is pulled. Thus the CD has no idea that an individual could represent a higher risk than others.[/QUOTE]
Originally Posted by
porcia83
I honestly think you've been away from a club scenario, or event events to really understand what goes on there. It seems like you're relying on videos from Youtube to pass judgement. As I've recommended previously, get back into a club, or at least attend some functions in person, then come back to the table to have a meaningful and realistic discussion. Watch what goes on between a CD, a field marshal, a safety officer or aircraft inspector might open your eyes. I've attended 3 events in two months across 2 states....
Easy to say for someone who can get to three states in one day. I checked the event calendar. There's an event 3 hours one way in Philly the day before I've got a 6AM flight out of town for work, a soaring event in MD (2.5 hours one way), another MD event 3.5 hours one way, and two VA events 5.5 hours one way. I've been to the club about five times since mid summer, yet to see a single person flying. As for visiting other clubs, you seem to be very generous with my time away from home given the distances to get to anything. As I've said multiple times, if that makes me less of a AMA member because I have other hobbies and demands on my time, so be it.
Originally Posted by
porcia83
I've yet to see a CD that can predict an accident based on someones past.
Not what I was saying. I'm saying that if a CD is aware someone has a past history of skill or flight discipline issues, they should probably watch the individual more closely. And that close attention may well prevent a mishap.
Originally Posted by
porcia83
As per the usual, you've tried to characterize something you don't like or approve of as "hiding", or "move along, nothing to see". This new tempest in a teapot issue of a CD being able to see a waivers history is yet another in a long line seemingly non issues, and of course presents no workable or reasonable solutions. So CD could see that a guy crashed 4 years ago because of....what? Does the AMA do NTSB level recons now? The CD is suddenly empowered to make instant decisions based on the past? Completely unworkable, and patently unfair too I would add.
Unless I'm mistaken, a CD already has authority to ground someone, so I'm not sure why that's unworkable. Perhaps if that happened more often, particularly in cases where there's a breach of flight discipline, there might be fewer breaches? I know...holding people accountable is a foreign concept, but it really does work.
Yet again, you talk about grounding someone due to past events. Again I say it's not grounding them, but watching them more closely. But AMA prevents that from happening by wiping the slate clean.
Perhaps if having a waiver pulled stayed on ones record for a long time, folks might be less likely to do things that would get it pulled - Oh darn, there I am with that holding people accountable thing again. What a concept.