Mike ... I just got back to the hobby after 20 years break. I was shocked that it is all about ARF now and its cheap and its from Vietnam! Phoenix is very cheap here in Malaysia, cheaper than what you get it for in Down Under. I saw a 12 year old kid fly the Phoenix Giles, he installed a .61 engine in there and the plane can really perform, not just speeds. What amazed me was he flew it inverted in a very tight circle, very slowly at about 15' - 20' only. He throttled the plane like a RC car ... vroom vroom vroom ... that is how good the plane is in the hands of a capable pilot. I am thinking of getting one.