I've read on the newsgroups many tips and techniques on how to flat spin a plane and many of them differ. With the Cap 232 and Extra 300 what are the likely techniques one can use to get them to flat spin? I'm just starting my 3D career with these 2 models and there stunts are new for me.

I also go into a regular spin with both sticks in lower right or left hand corner. Plane falls down fast. I know you need LOTS of altitude to start the flat spin so you have time to get out but how can you push these planes into the flat spin and what's the easiest way out of them?