Jim,

glad to have you.


I don't think telling a new guy he can do with a lesser model is lying to him.

My friend Terry Hemmis is winning D7 championships flying a Tiger 60. This right here is a good example.

I think that if Sportsman pilots gravitate toward 2M models it will deter new pilots. I think we as pattern people should keep the idea as fly what you brung. If it happens to be a hand me down pattern model then so be it. But for most they are looking for a 60 sized or 90 sized model that will double as a sport model and a pattern model.

See we get stuck in the mud a bit. We don't Sport fly our pattern models. We practice with them. The average guy looking in sees that all we do is practice with them. One thing the Scale Aerobatics guys have on us is many people sport fly their SA models. If you want to talk about keeping up with Jones....I noticed out here on the west coast the SA guys that are flying in Basic and Sportsman (sportsman-intermediate for pattern classes) are all flying big models. In fact the smallest plane at the contest is usually a 33% model.

I think we should push the idea that you can still be judged fairly and still perform the maneuvers with precision not using a big expensive model. Its not blowing smoke up someones rear when there are more than enough examples of pilots that are competitive with less than the ideal model. Terry flying her Tiger 60 is a prime example. Boxer Bob Fortino winning the NATS in Intermediate a couple years ago flying an old 60 sized scratch built model that was really never a serious competition model even when it was introduced. But he won the NATS with it against BIG 2M models with 140 power plants.

In the Western side of the country we have lots of Tigers', Zens', and now some Excelleron's, and other "sport" pattern models. A Kaos falls into this realm. I think today there are better models that the Kaos out there. But its a matter of what you got to bring to the table. Pushing on to new guy that he may not be competitive without a 2M model is not fair to both his skill and or possible dedication to learning something about the models.

Its all a matter of where your goals are what you intend to accomplish. I'm not going to show up to a Team Selection event flying a Tiger 60. But I personally have seen a Tiger 60 walk the dog on many a 120 sized pattern model. Look to the sequences for what you need in equipment.

Sportsman

1. Takeoff
2. Straight Flight Out (U)
3 Half Reverse Cuban Eight
4 Straight Flight Back (D)
5 Half Cuban Eight
6 Two (2) Inside Loops (U)
EXIT THE BOX
ENTER THE BOX
7 Two Point Roll (D)
8 Stall Turn
9 Cobra without Rolls (U)
10 Immelmann Turn
11 One Horizontal Roll (D)
12 Split "S" K=1
13 Double Immelmann without Rolls (U)
EXIT THE BOX
14 Landing


For this sequence all you need is a model that has sufficient power to do a vertical upline for a stall turn. Enough power to do a 45 deg upline...doesn't need to be long just needs to be straight and at 45 degs. And the model needs to be able to roll axially with ailerons, and fly upside-down.

Beyond this anything else is fluff. There is nothing a 2M pattern model can do better in loops rolls and stall turns than a simple Tiger 60 or Kaos.

There are no slow rolls, 4pts that require knife edge flight, or rudder applied in the rolls. There are not long vertical lines with roll elements. Once the model is inverted it doesn't need to do an outside loop. All it has to do is hold inverted flight....I don't see anywhere in here where a 2m pattern model has an advantage.

One thing to consider is 90-95% of the models out there both pattern models and sport aerobatics model are not trimmed out as good as they can be. If you really work on getting the model to roll axially, draw straight up and down lines, and loop without corkscrewing....a 2m model no advantage over the Tiger 60.

Now the 2m pattern model might be easier to trim, or might handle the wind better...But only in high wind conditions. I think if we encourage the use of these types of models it will benefit us all.

There is another place the Tiger has an advantage...$$$ and the normal beginner in pattern is not terrified of the Tiger 60. He has usually been flying this type of model for a while. He is comfortable with and its rugged and can take poor landings and abuse. Even a wood pattern model that is scratch built like a Typhoon, can be intimidating to a new comer. It is also much more fragile than the average 60 sized ARF. Combine this with the hours of work it takes to build one and the guy with the Tiger can have a new one in the air after a weekend of work.

How many of you guys learning pattern loose a model and then are out of commission for weeks in not months until you build a new model. The Tiger is Cheap, and easy and will do the work required.

I have heard it said the Tiger was one of the best pattern model Dave Patrick ever designed. I think it is an extremely good base model to start with.

TN