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3D Rates?

Old 01-17-2014, 07:19 PM
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KaP2011
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Default 3D Rates?

I know this is probably not the fourm to ask this question but I thought I would try anyway.

I thought I would try my hand at 3D flying and I've got an airframe capable of 3D. My problem is that I can't figure out how to program my radio. I've done several searches and I've not gotten any help. What little I have found is beyond my understanding.

I have a Futaba 14SG and the manual might as well be written in chinese. I want to program my 3 position switches to low rate, high rate and 3d rate. I've never set up a flight condition and I have no idea how to even get started.

Any guidance as I dip my toe into the 3D pond would be greatly appreciated.
Old 01-18-2014, 12:12 PM
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KaP2011
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Disregard the post above. After some experimentation I figured it out last night. No matter though, on the maiden flight today the pre-glued aileron hinges on the right wing pulled out and the plane was a total loss.
Old 01-18-2014, 06:13 PM
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ahicks
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My condolences. Man, that's a tough way to learn a lesson, but a LOT of us seem to learn it the same way! Hopefully you won't let it prevent you from trying again?
Old 01-18-2014, 07:13 PM
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I don't use dual rates I use expo...No switches to fiddle with is something like that happens.
Old 01-18-2014, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by ahicks View Post
My condolences. Man, that's a tough way to learn a lesson, but a LOT of us seem to learn it the same way! Hopefully you won't let it prevent you from trying again?
Thanks ahicks. No it won't stop me from trying again. I'll just get another plane and learn from my mistake. No ca hinges.

Originally Posted by Desertlakesflying View Post
I don't use dual rates I use expo...No switches to fiddle with is something like that happens.
I was thinking the same thing, it makes more sence. It did however teach me something new about my radio, how to set up flight conditions, so some good came from my first try.
Old 01-21-2014, 07:03 PM
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bummer
don't blame CA hinges either, prolly had those on over 30 planes, less than 12 pounds and never broke even on hard crashes. it does happen though.
Always give your controls a healthy tug on preflight. Pretend its the real plane you are about to sit in.
Old 01-22-2014, 06:13 AM
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KaP2011
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It was the hinges. The first photo shows the right elevator, the fiber material is completely gone and the hinges are slick. The second photo is the right aileron, it is a better photo of the way the hinges pulled out.

I agree, in the future, I will pin all hinges that are not hinge points. I should have known this already. However, this was my first 3D type plane and I didn't think about it. Since 1991 I have only seen a ca type hinge pull out one time. That was on an Extra 300S and it was my own fault, I had not put enough ca on the hinge. I should have learned then but it was sometime ago and I had forgotten.

No where in the instructions were there any indication that I should pin the hinges, hinges were only mentioned one time in the attachment of the rudder. I had thought it looked like the elevators were double hinged, two side by side, I thought that's a good idea so when I hinged the rudder that's what I did. But, I used actual GP hinges that I had on hand. And by the way, they did not look anything like the hinges provided with the plane for hinging the rudder, they looked like the cheap hinges I had gotten with a Seagull model.

Oh, and by the way, I had pulled on the control surfaces, not the day of the first flight but a couple of days before. They seemed fine at the time.
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Old 01-22-2014, 09:44 PM
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Hobbico responded today by email. They agree the hinges should not have pulled out. They will replace the plane + 2 S3010 servos, aluminum spinner, head and rocker cover for the damaged engine. I am pleased.

Wooohoooo, Hobbico Rocks!
Old 01-24-2014, 01:09 PM
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wow you should really be happy .. other's have not been so lucky

always nice to hear a good ending
Old 01-25-2014, 03:20 AM
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One thing for sure, CA hinges are not as bad as some would say. You certainly can get bad ones, yet I have not seen any. I have a plane with CA hinges that flew well over 600 flights (many aggressive) and never had a hinge failure. That was stock factory hinges, too. It proved to me that it is a myth that CA hinges don't last but around 100 flights.
Old 01-25-2014, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by zacharyR View Post
wow you should really be happy .. other's have not been so lucky

always nice to hear a good ending
I am very happy though I do not believe it was luck. I have been buying from Tower Hobbies since I started flying, in that time I've had other problems with products. It's always been something wrong with the product, damaged cowl, wing, etc. They have always without fail stood behind the products they sell. This time I was not sure they would replace an entire airplane after a crash but all is well.

Originally Posted by Luchnia View Post
One thing for sure, CA hinges are not as bad as some would say. You certainly can get bad ones, yet I have not seen any. I have a plane with CA hinges that flew well over 600 flights (many aggressive) and never had a hinge failure. That was stock factory hinges, too. It proved to me that it is a myth that CA hinges don't last but around 100 flights.
Like you, I've used ca hinges many, many times in the past with onty two failures. I have seen many that I would not use, usualy in the cheaper imports from China. The 3 provided with this plane for attaching the rudder were that type, they had a very smooth feel and were thinner than the regular great planes hinges. I still used them but I doubled them side by side with standard great planes hinges and they held through a very hard crash. I still trust ca hinges but from now on I will pin them.

With the replacement plane I'm going to cut the hinges out and use a wider ca hinge that will be pinned. Several of the hinges on the plane that was destroyed I noticed afterwards were crooked as seen in the photo of the elevator above. If I had pinned them the pins would have probably missed the hinge.

No matter how much quality control Hobbico has in place, you still have people building the planes in China who are not flyers. Sometimes they just do not take the time to make sure everything is correct.
Old 01-26-2014, 11:58 PM
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Sorry about the loss and great that you are getting a replacement.

By the way, Tower's pregluing is usually quite good but, like someone said, always give them a tug to check. I used to worry about CA hinges on my airplanes but I found that they ususally outlast the airplane. However, these days I prefer to use nylon hinges or robart hinges for my larger airplanes. Robarts are particularly easy to install with epoxy

Did you figure out the set up issue on the TX? I prefer to go into "dual rates" and select switch positions from there first. You can select 2 positions for each surface. Then in AFR and set the rates from there. I also use some expos on all surfaces- usually 25% for 3d rates, 15 for high and 5-10 for low rates. It just makes your airplane fly better and easier. My buddy sets a condition to take everything to low rates in a panic situation but I prefer to fly the airplane rather tha flip switches if I get there. I have a 12FG though, so yours may be slightly different.
If you are confused, PM me and we will go through in detail

Ameyam

Last edited by ameyam; 01-27-2014 at 12:01 AM.
Old 01-27-2014, 08:59 AM
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I would use some rouned toothpicks and a tiny drillbit and go ahead and pin those babies in.
Old 01-28-2014, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by ameyam View Post
Sorry about the loss and great that you are getting a replacement.

By the way, Tower's pregluing is usually quite good but, like someone said, always give them a tug to check. I used to worry about CA hinges on my airplanes but I found that they ususally outlast the airplane. However, these days I prefer to use nylon hinges or robart hinges for my larger airplanes. Robarts are particularly easy to install with epoxy

Did you figure out the set up issue on the TX? I prefer to go into "dual rates" and select switch positions from there first. You can select 2 positions for each surface. Then in AFR and set the rates from there. I also use some expos on all surfaces- usually 25% for 3d rates, 15 for high and 5-10 for low rates. It just makes your airplane fly better and easier. My buddy sets a condition to take everything to low rates in a panic situation but I prefer to fly the airplane rather tha flip switches if I get there. I have a 12FG though, so yours may be slightly different.
If you are confused, PM me and we will go through in detail

Ameyam
I did figure out the transmitter setup for 3D rates after experimenting for about an hour. I set the dual rates on the switches I normally use then set a flight condition on a switch by itself. I will probably change that on Eagle 580 v2.

Originally Posted by a70eliminator View Post
I would use some rouned toothpicks and a tiny drillbit and go ahead and pin those babies in.
My plan is to use the Robart hinges this time around.
Old 01-28-2014, 11:50 AM
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wait guys nothing wrong with CA hinges are smaller planes thats just what it is robart are fine normaly bigger meater wood is good for that .. just saying we dont need to re invent the wheel
Old 01-28-2014, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Desertlakesflying View Post
I don't use dual rates I use expo...No switches to fiddle with is something like that happens.
+1
expo and massive throws....

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