Got My 4D yesterday and started the build. Anyone done yet and are there any build and/or fight reports yet?

My dad and I are sharing one of these for Christmas. Gonna be cool. How's the building going? Good kit?

At first glance there seems to be a million steps in the build. But I got real far on the first day so it ought to go well. I've built 3 other Tufflight planes so I'm used to the system. It's supposed to rain alot this week so I hope to get it done soon.

what kind of servos are you guys stickin in the 4d? im undecided. do you need metal gear servos? maybe on the rudder and elev.

Here's a reply I put up on a different thread that I hope will answer your servo question. I only put metal gears on the rudder since it is the most vulnerable, and so far so good. I've flown the 4D about 3 more Saturdays since I wrote the paragraghs below, and I find I'm liking more all the time. I made up some skiis for my 4D a couple weeks ago and it hasn't snowed at our field since. Go figure. Feel free to post anymore questions you might have, I'll ck back later............................................. ......................

Good to hear you've also flown your new 4D. I've never heard if there is anyone else flying one yet...

My 4D is 4.75 lbs with YS .63 and HiTec 545s on ailerons and elevator, 525MG on rudder, and micro on throttle. 5 cell NiMH batt.

Hovers a bit above half throttle, but I'm at a mile hi elevation. Harriers sweetly but with a bit of wing rock sometimes. Torque rolls way better than my Morris profiles ever did. Waterfalls are awesome and easy- you can just hold full down, hi or lo rates, very minimal altitude loss.

I'm still getting expos and dual rates dialed in for my preferences, because high rates have amazing control authority. It took me several tries to get a good upright flat spin and when I got the surfaces set in their sweet spot it was spinning with no altitude loss- I hope to get it right to climb in the spin. I couldn't get inverted flat spin, but I think it is my problem, not the 4Ds.

I'm flying off asphalt- The plane acts weird on fast taxi- It seems to stick on the ground till it finally pops off the runway with full elevator- I haven't figured out what is happening. Perhaps I should switch on flaperons to give wing more lift? deep keel and rudder doesn't allow enough angle of attack on ground?

To land you have to come in with a little speed and power on and flare at the last moment, or slow it up and you have to add power to harrier land- your choice.

Best knife edge I've ever flown! Sometimes no aileron correction at all, sometimes a breath of elevator to keep it tracking perfect, but far and away the most balanced plane I've ever flown. I want to learn to KE from edge to edge without ever having to turn plane around.

My last flight last night I was having too much fun and ran the tank dry. Oops- downwind and 50 feet hi- no time to set up a glide- she went in pretty steep (30 degree) into a plowed field...just a little grimy- no damage whatsoever.

I'm loving this plane. What a great hybrid- Sort of like a QHOR but no flapping or flopping and better lo power glide. Sort of like a profile Morris but much more control authority- but I know I am not the most experienced fun flier. Some of you guys probably have profile planes and QHORS set up better than I ever got mine. I don't have many other serious fun flier pilots in my club to teach me so I've had to learn on my own. I've built and flown Morris the Knife, Morris Top Cap, Pizza Box, QHOR, Diamond Unlimited...

Anyone else flying the 4D yet??

I'm having a hard time with mine. It flies like it's tail heavy, very unstable, especially at low speeds. Of course I've checked the cg and it's where should be. I'm using an os46fx with stock muffler. It seems to have enough power but I wonder if more would help. The guys at Tufflight said I should have set up the pull-pull ailerons instead of the more typical set-up I used. I will say this though, it has survived every form of crash I can dish out. Hard crashes from altitude with no damage at all. I don't know if I set it up wrong or just don't know how to fly it yet.

I don't think a lack of power should make it unstable...but you have flown funfly aerobatic planes before, haven't you? I did my ailerons as Tufflight suggested, but i couldn't imagine pushrods on the ailerons could cause your problems. My guess is that perhaps your elevator linkage is a little sloppy. That full flying elevator has awesome control authority, but you don't want to fly the plane too fast and even slow, if your elevator linkage has much slop at all I bet it would flutter and flex and cause the plane to get very instable.

Do think my guess could be the problem? I'd like to learn what you find...

I built my 4D in about a three day weekend. Don't like the elevator linkage, I think it may be sloppy by nature. Any ideas on a stronger setup?

This plane was way easier to build than the Enduro I got from Tufflight last year, not 1/2 as much build time. I loved that Enduro though, it survived at least 50 crashes and about 5 trees before retirement. Definitely the best confidence builder out there.

Definitely get the Elmers poly glue to put the servos in the wing. And make sure to use plenty of spray mount or the covering won't adhere to the wing styrofoam.

I flew the 4D on skis 2 weeks ago. OS 70 4s (Surpass II, 2 yrs, 200 flights), futaba 3001s all around. 12x6 APC prop, I think it needs more like a 12x4 as it obviously flys better at low speeds. If you get too fast, esp with loose skis, it gets real sloppy. But it handled well at slow speeds. I could hover it, and mind you I am not into this long. I even did a waterfall duplicated from Realflight, and although it fell out on the second go around I easily save it from the ground. It gets torque rolling quick...

Engine went out 2x when pointed straight up, handles very well on a glide. Then on third engine out (I am stubborn) it stalled straight down into the snow. There was about 12" left here in upstate NY mtns. Only damage was 2 broken skewers. Can't wait to fly it on wheels.

This is my second fun fly, I have the Aeroworks Profile 80" with a Saito 1.8 (now that is fun). That is easier to fly than this 4D, but you can't match the 4th D of durability for learning how to fly 3D.

I didn't do it myself, I'm using the suggested elevator pushrod technique, but perhaps you could figure out pull-pull cables for the elevators??

Bill

By the way, Thanks for the post, theBender. It was very informative, and I've had a hard time finding anyone else out there with a 4D.

Did you attach your skiis the way Tufflight said to, with those glue-on coroplast tabs? Seems kinda funky, but I've never used skiis b4.

I also have an Enduro, but not built yet. Do you have any suggestions for modifications or improvements?

I'd definately go with the flattest pitch prop and big diameter for your 4D.

Thanks again. Keep hitting the spacebar!!

Bill

pull pull may work but would need another servo since I glued in the first one...

stdun, I would move the cg forward bit by bit to make sure...


When I built the Enduro, I didn't want to glue in the servos as explained. Instead I goop glued plywood to the wing surface, then was able to screw in the servos after covering the wing. With the Enduro, CG is very critical. I was off on initial flight, had no control and fat fingered the thing about 60' up an old oak tree. An hour and a tree climb later (no damage) I got the cg right and had it flying. The distance between the front gerar and the tail skid is very short so it is a bit touchy on the ground. After many landings, the gear spread and I would always hit the prop on landing (grass runway). So I tied some piano wire across the gear. keeping it from slipping up with a wheel collar on each leg just above the wire. Worked great although I popped it regularly. Easy field replacement though.

I dug many a hole with that enduro!

I did not build/use tuflight skis as they would take a long time to create and I got a pair off ebay for $20. Just tighten them to the axle area of the gear, they have torsion rods extending from a block at the axle which keep the ski from flopping more than a few degrees. Looks very odd in a hover, see tuffflight.com site for video.

Although I am pretty new to RC aircraft and self (realflight) taught, I find landing/taking off on skis much easier than wheels. Much more forgiving...

Will let you know how the 4D goes with 12 or 13x4 prop when the wind calms down...

Any pictures? Who makes this?

dannafinance,

The 4D is made by Tufflight. They have a great website-- I think at www.Tufflight.com

Their planes are kits, but very quick buiding because of the modern materials they use- (Expanded poly propelene and lexan and coroplast.) This also makes the plane extremely damage resistant. Their kits are also constantly revised and improved as they hear back from their customers. They sell almost exclusively through phone or website.

I'm particularly happy with the 4D because of the way it flies and yet is so easily modified/repaired. The tailboom can be quickly removed and replaced, the keels and tailpieces, etc.

Hope this helps you.

Just something else to use on the servos to hold them in... I've found that Great Stuff works very well, and has a faster cure time. It was also easier to trim off after it had dried. When I put the servos in my 4d with the poly glue, I had to take my razor saw and work at it to get it off. When I had done my zagi a year or so ago, I used Great Stuff and was able to trim it off with just a knife.

I'm hoping to have mine flying this weekend, as long as the weather's nice... so I'll be sure to report back.

I'm going to check the elevator servo and linkage for soundness, sounds like that could be the problem. Also add more weight to the nose to see if that is it. The plane acts like it's tailheavy, especially at slow speeds.

I tried Pull Pull on the Elevator and rudder on a prototype 4D and it didn't work. The slight flex in the long fuse would cause a wave effect on the pitch and yaw. Thats why we went with flexable nyrods. The best stuff for gluing servos in EPP is pro bond I think. It is easy to use and I have removed many servos using this glue by cutting around them with a long blade and prying the servo out with a screwdriver. Then I clean the servo up using a flap wheel on a dremmel tool. (watch the wires) The problem I have with Great Stuff is it is very difficult to reseal and reuse. I have to spend 10 minutes cleaning the nozzle with acetone.

Didn't someone do a pictorial 'build along' for the 4D in this newsgroup? I can't find it....help!

Jerry

Yes Jerry, it was the thread YOU started!

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_20...tm.htm#2037102

DAAAAAAAA....can't figure out why I didn't find it when I did a search! Oh well, thanks Wind Junkie, it was just what the doctor ordered

Jerry

I'm to the point where I will cover the wing. Has anybody had to remove a servo or the battery for servicing, yet? Seems like you could almost destroy the wing in the process.....that water activated glue is like rock!!! Has anybody covered or trimmed the cloroplast with Ultrakote? I tried it on a scrap and it went on well, but peeled off with only moderate resistance. Thanks.

GarySS,

It's pretty easy to cut the entire batt or servo completely free at the surrounding EPP. Then you can just graft in a new block of EPP with the Gorilla glue then sand it all smooth and flush when it is dry. No biggie. Ck the SPAD guys for how to paint coroplast...

I made my own control horns out of square PVC tubing so they have a bigger footprint on the coroplast surface and I've only had flutter once or twice in a year of flying, but I mostly 3D it...

You gotta try the skis on this- It is a kick!

Bill
4D over 1 yr old, still going great.