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How to??? Flat spins??

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How to??? Flat spins??

Old 05-26-2004, 06:57 PM
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CDignition
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Default How to??? Flat spins??

How is this done??
Old 05-26-2004, 07:21 PM
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NOVAflier
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

I have not tried it in real life yet, but I learned how to do it on the simulator from this page..

http://members.cox.net/moorman1/maneuver.htm

The key is to slide the aileron over to the left (or right) slowly...
Old 05-26-2004, 09:09 PM
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JoeAirPort
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

An aft CG is and large throws are required for best results.

Inverted: Go up very high. Stall plane, point it down, full left aileron for 2-3 rolls, then full right rudder, then full down elevator. Center ailerons to flatten out. Use throttle to speed up or slow down the spin. Center sticks to pull out, roll upright. Gradual up elevator so it doesn't snap. Leave plenty of altitude to pull out.

Upright: Go up very high. Stall plane, full left aileron and full left rudder for a few rotations. Pull full up elevator and center ailerons to flatten out. Use throttle to speed up or slow down the spin. Center sticks to pull out. Gradual up elevator so it doesn't snap. Leave plenty of altitude to pull out.

This is just how I do them. Others may do it differently.
Old 05-26-2004, 09:43 PM
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wyflyer
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

On my Magic I go on a full throttle up line and input full right rudder, full down elevator, full left aileron, and lower the throttle to idle. Once it starts to go down in a normal spin, I cross the aileron over to the right some. It flattens right out.
Old 05-26-2004, 10:15 PM
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smokingcrater
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

large control deflections aren't always neccessary. a couple of my plane spin MUCH nicer if the sticks aren't thrown to the corners. half or a little more of the stick travel works great.
Old 05-27-2004, 10:46 PM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

here's how i do it and it usually works.
most aerobatic aircraft will want to rotate with the torque of the engine, so use that to yoru advantage. one thing you can do is pull a sharp down or up and give full rudder while holding your up/down and it will usually enter the spin. see, flat spins are easier to enter when your aircraft is stalled, and wont end up in a steep spin rather. so while your wing is stalled completely, your rudder is not so while you are stalled and your airspeed is too slow for your tailfeathers to make a big difference as far as keeping the plane true goes and your power is high enough to vector it, you have the perfect setup for a spin. try it.
Old 05-27-2004, 11:24 PM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

ORIGINAL: rkramer

large control deflections aren't always neccessary. a couple of my plane spin MUCH nicer if the sticks aren't thrown to the corners. half or a little more of the stick travel works great.
Yeah especially when your CG is aft enough, which I also mentioned.
Old 05-27-2004, 11:25 PM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

Some planes do it a little differently too, youll have to experiment, but a couple of my big ones only need full down, full rudder, and 1/4 throttle and it will do it all the way down.
Old 05-27-2004, 11:34 PM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

I have two Funtanas. One is 5.75" CG and the other is 6.5" CG. They both do awesome blenders but the one at 6.5 does them tighter and flatter. But I can NOT use full down on the 6.5" CG, it's just too much and screws it up the flat spin. So the rudder and elevator are having more effect on the more AFT CG. It's pretty cool to be able to compare the two CG's on the same model of ARFs.
Old 05-27-2004, 11:45 PM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

I support JoeAirPort's view of doing the flatspin. Just play around with the CG(rearwards) to flatten out the spin.
Old 05-28-2004, 02:52 AM
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MarkNovack
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

Getting a little bit deeper into this subject, there is a difference between a flat spin and a blender which results in a flatter than normal spin which easily converts into a very flat spin. Here are my methods for all of the above.

1. Flat spin upright. Slow the airplane to a stall and enter a normal spin with full up and full rudder and aileron deflected in the same direction. After the spin develops, smoothly return your ailerons to neutral and while gently adding power, slowly move your ailerons to opposite of the rudder. This creates more drag and lift on the inside wing, raising the wing and the gyroscopic precession of the motor will raise the nose flattening out the spin. To much opposite aileron will often cause the airplane to fold out of the spin. The further back the CG, the more opposite aileron can be used resulting in even flatter spins.

2. Flat spin inverted. Fly into a stall inverted and push full down and full rudder with full opposite aileron. After the spin develops, move ailerons to neutral and, while gently adding power, move the ailerons to the same direction as rudder.

3. Blender to inverted flat spin to flatter spin. Slow the airplane to moderate speed, pull to low throttle or idle and push the nose straight down. You may add rolls or simply enter the blender without rolling. Same result, different effect aesthetically. After a short down line push as you would for an inverted spin, full down, opposite full rudder and aileron. This will result in a flat spin because of the centrifugal forces from the accelerated rotations on entry. Here, again, slowly cross the aileron and add throttle. This will further flatten the spin. On some airplanes, the correct combination of control deflection, power, and CG can arrest the descent completely as the airplane flies around in the inside wing.

It is important to realize that getting the spins perfect on any particular airplane requires finding the right combination of control throws, power settings, and CG. While the normal spin entry is simple and can normally be executed by hitting the stops, the flat portion can be either a nervous, ratchety thing or a super smooth, beautiful, tight rotation with very slow descent. Common mistakes are not using enough or too much power, CG to far forward, or getting too rough on the ailerons.

RECOVERY. Start with simple recovery. Release controls and cut power to idle, allow the airplane to start flying and gently pull or push to horizontal. Common mistakes. Not cutting power or releasing elevator which can result in a fatal spin (most modern high performance aerobats will fly right out of any type of spin with their high power ratios, but some airplanes still need recovery and I have seen quite a few crashes). Also, yanking a slow airplane with too much elevator can result in a snapping spin to mother earth. Shoud releasing the controls and not cutting power cause the rotation to arrest, then apply opposite rudder to stop the rotation. Should that not arrest the rotation push down elevator (for upright spins, eh) to lower the nose. If at that point your airplane does not recover, start planning you next airplane. Again, most airplanes will leave a spin easily and classic recovery is becoming a thing of the past for heavy, highly loaded airplanes. I do have a Pitts S-1-11B with very rear CG that will continue autorotation with neutral controls and demands opposite rudder to stop. It freaked me out the first time but I had lots of room and remembered opposite rudder.

Happy spins,
Mark
Old 05-28-2004, 09:30 AM
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Default RE: How to??? Flat spins??

nice writup[8D]

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