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04-29-2007 | 02:08 PM

#998

Michaelh

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From: Abingdon, VA

RE: FS One by Hangar 9

Quote:

ORIGINAL: malcolmm

Quote:

ORIGINAL: MSelig

Malcolmm -

Long answer:

Does wing rock happen w/ all airplanes in real? No. Are there theories for wing rock? Sort of and they are various, and nothing is very satisfactory. Are there any specific aerodynamics models in the literature? Not that I've found math-model wise. Does FS One have any special aerodynamics model for wing rock? Yes, but we turned it off in the version you have because it's a work in progress. Do some airplanes in FS One wing rock anyway? Yes, in some situations you'll see it happen. Why do they wing rock in FS One ... "anyway"? I don't know, but it happens w/ some airplanes in some situations. Do the other sims model wing rock? No, not that I'm aware of (includes RC and full scale in the mass market and in research). How do I know? Because I've looked really hard at this. There are a zillion things in the aerodynamics in FS One, but wing rock is still a work in progress. There are others. By the way, the more aero we throw at your computer, the slower the sim. It's a trade off. Right now our sim uses (way) more CPU for aero than probably any other sim out there. Nothing in FS One is 'fudge', and we don't want to fudge what we don't know bottom to top - wing rock. When we understand the underlying mechanism for wing rock, we'll include it as a patch. Some things from what you describe make me think your Funtana90 in real was not setup as good as (or like) the one in the sim. Mike McConville setup all Hangar 9 airplanes in the sim (i.e. set the c.g., throws, and radio expos-D/R stuff).

Another idea - you might want to try turning on turbulence. Pick "Wind" and then pick "Turbulent Wind", say 10 mph. That's going to be more realistic and you'll see more, I'll say, 'rocking around'. This turbulence will slow your frame rate. I get 90 Hz w/ this turbulence at Frasca field. Press 'f' to see your framerate. It should be above 60 Hz if you have the recommended specs. Panos run much faster.

BTW - Here's a video of the real Funtana90 doing walls (easy as was mentioned above):
http://www.seligspace.com/videos/
This one:
http://www.seligspace.com/videos/Rea...lightTests.wmv
It was taken on a turbulent windy day. We use video like this to help 'tune' the airplanes in the sim. Mike was flying. I was talking. This was my first experience seeing this stuff in real / up close, and "it concerned me"....

Michael

Thanks for the detailed answer Michael. It is nice to know that you are still working on the physics. If there is a problem with processing power, personally I would have no problem with taking a hit to the framerate for better physics. If it was possible to have some aspects of the physics model being optional, e.g. a "model wing rock" option, that would be great. But I imagine that might be difficult.

I will try the "Turbulent Wind".

I have read that some planes don't have wing rock in harrier, but having owned approximately 10 3D planes, I've never encountered one, partiularily in upright harriers. The closest I have come to rock free harrier is my Yak Byp, but even with it I have to be very precise (lucky?) to get just the right throttle and elevator to briefly eliminate wing rock - I need to practise obviously.

Also, my criticisms of FS One wasn't meant to imply there is another flight sim with better physics, I doubt there is. I was just concerned that I had spent a lot of money on something that might not let me improve my 3D flying in the way I was hoping. But I'm sure it will help in other areas, and I'm also planing to try the helicopters.

Malcolm

Malcom,
Trust me I have flown some others out there and this is the best for physics. In another sim I tried the first flight with a yak I started to do rolling harriers straight down the runway. No way! May look cool and make you feel good till you go to a fly in and try it in front of your buddies with a real plane

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