Thx, i guess i haven't checked sig yet, but hobby-lobby is all ARF and I want the experience of building my own kit... I enjoyed putting my ARF together and I have done model airplanes before (nonflyable) so I would like a kit. Sure there aren't aileron trainers?? Well, I could get a more advanced model. and no I don't know where grant's pass is, im from eastern oregon, very eastern.