I will have to defend the vmar fans as well.

I have to agree for the price its hard to find a decent bird other than trainers so its nice to know that anyone with half decent building skills can purchase one, prep it accordingly and have a fine flying machine for the price of a trainer. im in the same boat where I cant afford the ones id really like to get so I end up buying used or finding inexpensive ones. kudos VMAR for helping us out.