Go Back  RCU Forums > RC Airplanes > Aerodynamics
 What is on that aileron >

What is on that aileron

Community
Search
Notices
Aerodynamics Discuss the physics of flight revolving around the aerodynamics and design of aircraft.

What is on that aileron

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 02-23-2010 | 12:34 PM
  #1  
Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 589
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
From: Narvon, PA
Default What is on that aileron

I saw a boomerang looking trim tab on the bottom of the ailerons of the Yak .
1 What is it called ?
2. What is it for ?
3. How does it work ?
4. Is it for any plane ? ( Like my U Can Do ? )

Stupid question . But I do not know.
Old 02-23-2010 | 12:57 PM
  #2  
My Feedback: (1)
 
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,087
Received 7 Likes on 7 Posts
From: Over da rainbow, KS
Default RE: What is on that aileron

It's called an aileron spade. It boosts the aileron to make it easier for the pilot to give full control.
Old 02-23-2010 | 01:09 PM
  #3  
Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 589
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
From: Narvon, PA
Default RE: What is on that aileron

A spade.  Thanks.<div>
</div><div> So in a R C world , is it needed ? </div>
Old 02-23-2010 | 01:20 PM
  #4  
My Feedback: (1)
 
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,087
Received 7 Likes on 7 Posts
From: Over da rainbow, KS
Default RE: What is on that aileron

Not really. Just use big servos.
Old 02-23-2010 | 01:25 PM
  #5  
Senior Member
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 7,769
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 5 Posts
From: FL
Default RE: What is on that aileron

Properly installed and used, boost tabs are a big help. Much lower current drain (smaller batteries and lighter weight) and more positive control. There is also less force on the control rods (less blow back or deformation). Improperly used or to large and then big problems can occur. You want them to be not greater than 10% of the movable surface and absolutely no slop in the hinges.
Old 02-24-2010 | 03:43 AM
  #6  
 
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,329
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
From: Houston, TX
Default RE: What is on that aileron

As Bax explained to me when I asked the same question - it does not apply so well in RC as we usually control our ailerons independently (when the plane is big enough to matter). For the spade to help, you need the whole system working to a single input.

Bedford
Old 02-24-2010 | 07:22 AM
  #7  
Senior Member
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,517
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
From: Near Pfafftown NC
Default RE: What is on that aileron

ORIGINAL: beepee

As Bax explained to me when I asked the same question - it does not apply so well in RC as we usually control our ailerons independently (when the plane is big enough to matter). For the spade to help, you need the whole system working to a single input.

Bedford
The spade is rigidly connected to the aileron. They make one single unit. The aileron and spade will be worked by a "single input" in our usual servo-to-aileron setups.

The two most popular ways to help reduce the control load on surfaces are the spades and boost tabs. Boost tabs look like smaller "ailerons" set into the ailerons (or elevators or rudders). They move opposite to the surface they boost. They can be powered to move independently to their subject surface. You'd probably consider them as controlled by a different input than the surface and therefore not working from a single input with the surface. Most I've seen on models are connected to a horn and simply respond to the movement of the surface versus that rigidly mounted horn. (Horn is usually fixed on the wing/stab/fin.) That setup would be one where the boost tab and surface were controlled by a single input.

So the single input idea only applies to a system that is one of a couple of systems.
Old 02-24-2010 | 07:32 AM
  #8  
Senior Member
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,517
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
From: Near Pfafftown NC
Default RE: What is on that aileron

BTW, boost tabs look very much like trim tabs. In the case of boost tabs, they are driven opposite the direction you wish to move the surface. Their aerodynamic influence then drives the surface, or helps it move in the direction you want it to move. The spades actually cause a force that directly contradicts the resistance caused by the surface's movement. They create drag force opposite the drag the surface is causing that has been discovered to be "too much" for the pilot.

Spades can be a pita, as they restrict the surface's movement in one direction. And they can often create much more force in one direction than they create in the other. And who needs imbalance........... They appear to be a "duct tape and baling wire" solution to inappropriate design.
Old 02-25-2010 | 10:59 AM
  #9  
Bax
My Feedback: (11)
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 19,483
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 7 Posts
From: Monticello, IL
Default RE: What is on that aileron

In full-size aircraft, aileron spades reduce control forces to move the ailerons quickly. That's because the ailerons are inter-connected to the pilot via the stick. When an aileron is deflected up, the spade catches more air and helps the aileron move upward, reducing the stick force needed to move the aileron. When it moves down, the spade is more in line with the airflow, so does not oppose the aileron movement.

On full-size aircraft that use aileron spades, they spades are adjusted in size and angle until they work such that the pilot is comfortable with the feel of the ailerons when the airplane's in flight. You cannot just put them on and expect them to work. They need to be adjusted by 'feel', and the servo(s) in the model just won't give you that kind of information.

Also, the ailerons in the mode are not interconnected, that is, if you removed the aileron servo(s), deflecting one aileron won't cause the other one to deflect...unless you have an older model where the aileron servo moves a wire that activates a bellcrank in each wing panel in front of each aileron. If you have that kind of installation, you might be able to use aileron spades if you could determine the proper size and angle to allow the servo to work less. However, it would be all "hit and miss" unless you use complex instrumentation to tune the ailerons and servo to the actual forces involved.
Old 02-25-2010 | 03:24 PM
  #10  
My Feedback: (15)
 
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,297
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
From: Aurora, CO
Default RE: What is on that aileron


ORIGINAL: Bax

When an aileron is deflected up, the spade catches more air and helps the aileron move upward...
Is the spade parallel to the wing cord line?

Kurt
Old 02-25-2010 | 10:51 PM
  #11  
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,961
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
From: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Default RE: What is on that aileron

No, parallel to the FSD (Free Stream Direction) at that point of the wing chord. Simply, in S&L flight there is no (or at least equal) force transmitted back through the control system.
Evan, WB #12.
Old 02-26-2010 | 12:03 PM
  #12  
Senior Member
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,343
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default RE: What is on that aileron


ORIGINAL: ES CONTROL

I saw a boomerang looking trim tab on the bottom of the ailerons of the Yak .
1 What is it called ?
2. What is it for ?
3. How does it work ?
4. Is it for any plane ? ( Like my U Can Do ? )

Stupid question . But I do not know.
Hi- there are no 'stupid' questions, just stupid answers! The Boeing B-9, of which I am building a model, has a boost tab on its huge rudder. As stated in other posts, the boost tab is a little different than the spade in its application and function.
Old 02-26-2010 | 04:59 PM
  #13  
Senior Member
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 11,517
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
From: Near Pfafftown NC
Default RE: What is on that aileron


ORIGINAL: ARUP
As stated in other posts, the boost tab is a little different than the spade in its application and function.
And in fact there are at least three configurations/things that people think of when talking about reducing the load on a surface using aerodynamics. Problem us people have when thinking about something is that we often mix up our labels.

There are also horn balancers. The rudders that have a projecting section on their tops, forward of the hingeline sometimes have those sections called boost tabs by some people. But they're probably more correctly called horn balancers.

We also have surfaces with their hingelines aft the LE of the surface. Thankfully, there aren't too many who call that arrangement boost tabs.

Good thing about spades is they're scarce as hen's teeth, and the name is really, really distinctive.

Bad thing about boost tabs is they're scarce AND look so much like trim tabs nobody notices them.



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.