Frank Tiano for AMA President
08-02-2016, 08:16 AM
#152
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There is a hidden discussion in here , just waiting to bust out like the alien in that dude's chest in the movie "Alien" ;
The two gents who have come out with anti drone statements , have they defined what exactly they mean by drone ?
To the public , drones are multicopters with cameras . To the FAA , drones are all non manned aircraft . My personal definition has always been a craft flown for a specific mission , usually out of it's operator's physical line of sight , VS a hobby model aircraft which is flown for the fun of seeing it fly only and always in it's operator's direct line of sight .
So , what exactly IS it they are against ;
1 All Multicopters , even if flown LOS with no AMA #550 approved FPV flight conditions ?
2 All FPV flight , including AMA condoned #550 FPV with it's required LOS spotter , whether rotary OR fixed wing (Easystar , for EX) ?
3 All BLOS flight whether multirotor or fixed wing , which our code presently does not allow anyway ?
I ask this in all seriousness , cause to me since both #1 and #2 above are already AMA approved flight conditions , and since in my personal opinion I only consider #3 to be drone operations , what exactly IS it that they are against and want to change ? I do think this a fair question since there is a difference in the way different folks use the word drone .....
The two gents who have come out with anti drone statements , have they defined what exactly they mean by drone ?
To the public , drones are multicopters with cameras . To the FAA , drones are all non manned aircraft . My personal definition has always been a craft flown for a specific mission , usually out of it's operator's physical line of sight , VS a hobby model aircraft which is flown for the fun of seeing it fly only and always in it's operator's direct line of sight .
So , what exactly IS it they are against ;
1 All Multicopters , even if flown LOS with no AMA #550 approved FPV flight conditions ?
2 All FPV flight , including AMA condoned #550 FPV with it's required LOS spotter , whether rotary OR fixed wing (Easystar , for EX) ?
3 All BLOS flight whether multirotor or fixed wing , which our code presently does not allow anyway ?
I ask this in all seriousness , cause to me since both #1 and #2 above are already AMA approved flight conditions , and since in my personal opinion I only consider #3 to be drone operations , what exactly IS it that they are against and want to change ? I do think this a fair question since there is a difference in the way different folks use the word drone .....
I think it's a safe bet that they are using the terms "drones" in the sense that most would understand...multi-rotor aircraft, either flown LOS or BLOS, I don't think it makes a difference. If it ain't fixed wing, it ain't "traditional". Both have mentioned the complete absence of flying skills needed to fly them (a big red flag for me...absolutes are usually questionable)Neither have mentioned helis. I think both have expressed the thought that the AMA has somehow rewritten their vision and "catered" to the MR crowd, for a whole host of reasons. I don't think they are hairsplitting or being vague...when they say drones it's a drone.
08-02-2016, 08:25 AM
#153
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There is a hidden discussion in here , just waiting to bust out like the alien in that dude's chest in the movie "Alien" ;
The two gents who have come out with anti drone statements , have they defined what exactly they mean by drone ?
To the public , drones are multicopters with cameras . To the FAA , drones are all non manned aircraft . My personal definition has always been a craft flown for a specific mission , usually out of it's operator's physical line of sight , VS a hobby model aircraft which is flown for the fun of seeing it fly only and always in it's operator's direct line of sight .
So , what exactly IS it they are against ;
1 All Multicopters , even if flown LOS with no AMA #550 approved FPV flight conditions ?
2 All FPV flight , including AMA condoned #550 FPV with it's required LOS spotter , whether rotary OR fixed wing (Easystar , for EX) ?
3 All BLOS flight whether multirotor or fixed wing , which our code presently does not allow anyway ?
I ask this in all seriousness , cause to me since both #1 and #2 above are already AMA approved flight conditions , and since in my personal opinion I only consider #3 to be drone operations , what exactly IS it that they are against and want to change ? I do think this a fair question since there is a difference in the way different folks use the word drone .....
The two gents who have come out with anti drone statements , have they defined what exactly they mean by drone ?
To the public , drones are multicopters with cameras . To the FAA , drones are all non manned aircraft . My personal definition has always been a craft flown for a specific mission , usually out of it's operator's physical line of sight , VS a hobby model aircraft which is flown for the fun of seeing it fly only and always in it's operator's direct line of sight .
So , what exactly IS it they are against ;
1 All Multicopters , even if flown LOS with no AMA #550 approved FPV flight conditions ?
2 All FPV flight , including AMA condoned #550 FPV with it's required LOS spotter , whether rotary OR fixed wing (Easystar , for EX) ?
3 All BLOS flight whether multirotor or fixed wing , which our code presently does not allow anyway ?
I ask this in all seriousness , cause to me since both #1 and #2 above are already AMA approved flight conditions , and since in my personal opinion I only consider #3 to be drone operations , what exactly IS it that they are against and want to change ? I do think this a fair question since there is a difference in the way different folks use the word drone .....
08-02-2016, 10:46 AM
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And the other candidates have not worked hard to fight for model aviation, especially as the other candidates are volunteers?
Last edited by Dokesflyer; 08-02-2016 at 10:54 AM.
08-02-2016, 11:25 AM
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Hi Tim , I envy your position of knowing them all as friends since I don't know a single one of them . I do give Rich Hanson major credit for politely answering a question or two of mine over the years and quite honestly with all the Presidential election's deliberate dividing of folks I don't see where that kind of separation would be in our (the AMA's) best interest , to be excluding MR pilots . Since Rich does sound like a steady sort I would most likely vote for him , unless of course we're all dead from the zika virus by then ....
bahahahahaah!.......zika virus. LOL? meh.
08-02-2016, 11:49 AM
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The hairsplitting begins at the fact that a fixed wing can be fitted with cameras and flown on "drone like" missions if it's operator so chooses , and so to single out one type of airframe from the many that can be employed for a drone mission is absurd . Lets pretend that with a wave of a magic wand all multirotors go "poof !" , back into history and were never invented , does anyone think cameras wouldn't have continued to have been fitted to fixed wing , single rotor "traditional" helicopters and even lighter than air craft like blimps if no multirotors existed ? .
At the end of the day, It isn't the airframes fault for the problems that we have endured. It is in fact how quickly Multi-Rotors exploded and became main stream without any kind of education behind the products.
This is a type of product the hobby industry wanted for so many years. Hints why Futaba released a few decades ago an "auto pilot" in an attempt to appeal to the masses. And there were other companies to follow suit. But none of those products appeal to the masses.
Why you may ask that is the case? My answer is "low hanging fruit". What I mean by that is with RTF Multi-Rotors the assimilation process into the model aviation world did not happen. The availability and ability to fly these aircraft without anyone educating and helping, the masses just went out and did what ever they felt like. Which BTW, this could have easily happened to the helicopter platform, but focus in technology and the appeal of something with such a strange appearance flying around was much more interesting than a traditional helicopter.
Lessons learned from Multi-Rotor aircraft. Our hobby of model aviation really is not suited for the masses. It clearly only appeals to people whom love aviation or have a mind for engineering and want to assimilate to the hobby . There will always be model aviation. The amount of people whom belong to the AMA and join clubs will fluctuate up and down, but it will really never go away.
50 years from now, there will be a new group of people like us arguing that Model Aircraft with anti-gravity technology and capable of flying in earths orbit via FPV should be out casted .....Or something like that. LOL
Last edited by TimJ; 08-02-2016 at 02:19 PM.
08-02-2016, 12:08 PM
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08-02-2016, 12:26 PM
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Hopefully. But it's important to recognize the commitment, time, effort, dedication, and accomplishments of those candidates who've volunteered much to serve the members!
Last edited by Dokesflyer; 08-02-2016 at 12:37 PM.
08-02-2016, 01:32 PM
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08-02-2016, 02:48 PM
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08-02-2016, 03:00 PM
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Mike
Last edited by rcmiket; 08-02-2016 at 03:04 PM.
08-02-2016, 03:04 PM
#166
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And cameras were fitted to fixed wing and helis. I messed around with Ham TV on aircraft a number of times.
At the end of the day, It isn't the airframes fault for the problems that we have endured. It is in fact how quickly Multi-Rotors exploded and became main stream without any kind of education behind the products.
This is a type of product the hobby industry wanted for so many years. Hints why Futaba released a few decades ago an "auto pilot" in an attempt to appeal to the masses. And there were other companies to follow suit. But none of those products appeal to the masses.
Why you may ask that is the case? My answer is "low hanging fruit". What I mean by that is with RTF Multi-Rotors the assimilation process into the model aviation world did not happen. The availability and ability to fly these aircraft without anyone educating and helping, the masses just went out and did what ever they felt like. Which BTW, this could have easily happened to the helicopter platform, but focus in technology and the appeal of something with such a strange appearance flying around was much more interesting than a traditional helicopter.
Lessons learned from Multi-Rotor aircraft. Our hobby of model aviation really is not suited for the masses. It clearly only appeals to people whom love aviation or have a mind for engineering and want to assimilate to the hobby . There will always be model aviation. The amount of people whom belong to the AMA and join clubs will fluctuate up and down, but it will really never go away.
50 years from now, there will be a new group of people like us arguing that Model Aircraft with anti-gravity technology and capable of flying in earths orbit via FPV should be out casted .....Or something like that. LOL
At the end of the day, It isn't the airframes fault for the problems that we have endured. It is in fact how quickly Multi-Rotors exploded and became main stream without any kind of education behind the products.
This is a type of product the hobby industry wanted for so many years. Hints why Futaba released a few decades ago an "auto pilot" in an attempt to appeal to the masses. And there were other companies to follow suit. But none of those products appeal to the masses.
Why you may ask that is the case? My answer is "low hanging fruit". What I mean by that is with RTF Multi-Rotors the assimilation process into the model aviation world did not happen. The availability and ability to fly these aircraft without anyone educating and helping, the masses just went out and did what ever they felt like. Which BTW, this could have easily happened to the helicopter platform, but focus in technology and the appeal of something with such a strange appearance flying around was much more interesting than a traditional helicopter.
Lessons learned from Multi-Rotor aircraft. Our hobby of model aviation really is not suited for the masses. It clearly only appeals to people whom love aviation or have a mind for engineering and want to assimilate to the hobby . There will always be model aviation. The amount of people whom belong to the AMA and join clubs will fluctuate up and down, but it will really never go away.
50 years from now, there will be a new group of people like us arguing that Model Aircraft with anti-gravity technology and capable of flying in earths orbit via FPV should be out casted .....Or something like that. LOL
I can only imagine the technology in 20 years...let alone 50. To think my phone has more capacity then my first real computer...amazing.
08-02-2016, 03:09 PM
#167
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There's also something to be said for those whom are "making a living at it". They know the nuts and bolts of running successful events along with the business end. I'd say they promote the hobby also. They also know modelers as their livelihood depends on it. This isn't the first time a business man in the hobby has run for AMA office heck I can think of one District VP's doing just that now. .
Mike
Mike
08-02-2016, 03:52 PM
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I'm not sure what you are trying to imply here. Choose your words wisely. I'm sure there are a few people in this thread that both make a living in the hobby and volunteer their time.
08-02-2016, 04:00 PM
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08-02-2016, 05:04 PM
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Does anybody know if and when the three candidates on the Ballot will be issuing statements on their campaign's behalf ? Have they been issued and I'm not looking in the right place ? (went poking around the AMA website but didn't see any statements) I will agree 100% with the thought that it's very generous indeed for Rich to "give up his day job" to take on this unpaid position . I think another fair assessment would be that since he has been right in the midst of the recent FAA interactions he's well versed in dealings with them and will interact well with them in the future as AMA President . Now this is no slam at the other two , like I've said I don't know them , and that's why I'd like to read a statement from all 3 to get an idea of what they plan to bring to the position .
08-02-2016, 05:08 PM
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There's also something to be said for those whom are "making a living at it". They know the nuts and bolts of running successful events along with the business end. I'd say they promote the hobby also. They also know modelers as their livelihood depends on it. This isn't the first time a business man in the hobby has run for AMA office heck I can think of one District VP's doing just that now.
Mike
Mike
Could it be that other candidates have exceptional business experience, a track record of accomplishment, really know common modelers by being a common modeler, and the dedication to serve and do the work simply because they care?
08-02-2016, 05:22 PM
#175
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They may know how to run successful, invitation only commercial events, but how many clubs have they worked with directly to provide guidance and experience to build successful clubs and club events - in local communities where 99% of events are really located. Hobby businessmen don't really know modelers and clubs that well, they know what sells to modelers and how to sell it.
Could it be that other candidates have exceptional business experience, a track record of accomplishment, really know common modelers by being a common modeler, and the dedication to serve and do the work simply because they care?
Could it be that other candidates have exceptional business experience, a track record of accomplishment, really know common modelers by being a common modeler, and the dedication to serve and do the work simply because they care?
+10!
Each of them my have specific and transferable skills when it comes to the hobby in general, the question is how will/can they leverage that into leading an organization of 188,000 people, and deal with the challenges of the times, namely the feds. They won't care a hill of beans about the ability to organize a for profit giant scale event, or the fact that a candidate is the only one who flies each week. Can the new guy go from shooting the breeze at a local club in say, Texas, to headlining the AMA Expo, to walking the hills of Congress and interacting with those people?