Interesting, another poor person is being accused of being me on that other place. The usual suspects are gathering to get another person banned thinking it was me, when it's not.

The lengths to which they'll go to shut down dialog is astonishing. The actions of fragile minds! And/or they must perceive the AMA as very weak. Can't help but notice our resident EC member is silent on whether he supports AMA members banning other AMA members from forums.

Was alerted to this and just wanted to register to say the following:
Leave me out of your feud. I have no ongoing beef with these two forums, nor with the AMA, I just disagreed with some of the language being used on a specific AMA webpage. Being a moderator is a difficult role and I'm not surprised that when my first post after lurking for two years is a long rather undiplomatic one on a charged topic suspicions were raised. To be honest biggest thing I have a problem with is that my admittedly verbose writing style could be confused with that of someone who unironically uses the phrase "The actions of fragile minds!"

I wasn't the one who accused you of being me. Others did that, I merely made the observation. In fact, I didn't even mention your RCG screen name in these pages.

Trust me, this isn't about you. I'm not, and have never been, a member of RCG and I still get called out and abused over in that forum. In fact, one of the "so called" members actually refers to me as "Soggy", but only because I run R/C boats. From what I can tell, being a non-member, those that hang out in the AMA area at RCG can't stand anyone to think differently than they do. Worse still, exf3bguy, known over here as speedracerntrixie, sent me a PM saying how we could be friends and then went over to RCG and was ripping my posts(which he cut and pasted or screen shot) apart.
And then, we have Coupez. Here's a cut and paste of a post in which he called me out as "Soggy":
Sorry for the repetition, guys; but I just have to share this one from one of f_m's minions. I'll call him "Soggy" because he plays with boats.

Quote: ...when I said "logging battery changes would be ridiculous since they get changed after every flight", I was referring to an aircraft specific log. If it was me, I would number the packs and keep a log on each showing:
when it was charged
when it was cycled
amount of time used per run/flight
charger indicated pack condition. Well gee, Soggy - I've got seven different 6S 3000mAh packs for that SE-5a I wrote the sample safety incident report on (do be sure to share that one with Franklin, too). That makes EIGHT separate books I have to lug to the field for that combination.

And I didn't just take one plane to the field that day. Matter of fact, it was four different planes and a whole ammo box full of batteries. Seven 6S, six 4S and five 3S. With the four planes, that makes 22 log books just to go have a day's fun at the field!

Now to be fair, my flying field car is the Traverse. But if Soggy got to be National Safety Chief, I'd still have to build a trailer to haul my portable library!

How would he know I have boats unless either he was coming over here and reading the posts or Speedracerntrixie told him. I'm not going to go over and join that forum to correct him on a minor point, that being I BUILD AND RACE BOATS, I DON'T PLAY WITH THEM, as he put it. Hell, my boats are probably more expensive than most, if not all, of his planes are, considering my engines are over $800 each new, including the tuned pipe and header, while the servos I use for the rudders are over $125 each. That roughly $1,000 is only a fraction of what I spend to build a boat. It's too bad that I could buy between 3 and 5 foamies for that same cost.
As you can probably see, it's not those of us here that are the problem. It's the "self righteous" AMA faithful at RCG that are the problem. Maybe, as an admin, you could do something about them and their flagrant rule breaking since, as I've been led to believe, personal attacks are forbidden but appear to by allowed by a special few over there

Speaking of the devil, Speed is back in the forum. Any bets he's scouting for the RCG group AMA zealots?

He's on a crusade to fight to hobby misinformation! So brave. Such courage.

LOL. OK, you just got me back! Almost spit my beverage all over my laptop.

Astro

Okay Astro, I think you need to start working on a boat so that, when that happens, you can spit your beverage into the lake/pond

Since speedy is so convinced I'm the new user over on RCG, why doesn't he get the other AMA acolytes, turn toward Taj-Muncie in unison, chant together "We're not worthy", and then go to their buddy Jason and have that new account banned?

At least it gives those guys something to gossip about over on the AMA Chat Shack where threads die of boredom - Let's see how many pages can we wring out over the definition of RC "safety" until everyone's eyes start bleeding.

You know I came close to getting one this summer. I just have too many things that I am into right now, and they all cost time and money. I'm in the midst of restoring a car, finishing a warbird project, been getting back into mountain biking and I'm shopping for a new one AND I realized that it is time for a new truck, sooo DON'T TEMPT ME!

Astro

Okay, let's look at this situation:

• I'm in the midst of restoring a car....not needed unless it's going to be a daily driver
• finishing a warbird project.....okay, I'll give you that one, but only if it's on floats
• been getting back into mountain biking and I'm shopping for a new one.....You got one, that's plenty
• AND I realized that it is time for a new truck......if the old one still runs and moves on its own, it doesn't need replacing
• sooo DON'T TEMPT ME! DO IT DO IT DO IT DO IT........................................

LOL. Well, there goes the RCG account. BANNED!

I posted a reply to speedy who asked the question if landowners would accept any other CBO's insurance. My reply was something like this:

"So, one CBO has State Farm and another has Safeco, are you saying that the landowner wouldn't accept one over the other?"

That got my account banned as a troll account.

I cannot imagine living in such a prison that my entire existence is centered around hating and censoring those who poke holes in my imaginary toy airplane world!

Astro

That action by RCG is the definition of arbitrary. As evidenced by this and other bans, it appears that Jason & Jim have deified the AMA to the point where the religious doctrine cannot even be questioned. As you note, it's sad commentary and more evidence of the weak minded cancel culture that Jason & Jim encourage over on RCG.

Oh, and in another interesting turn of events ...

So after I got the email response from FAA yesterday, I put it in an email from one of my personal accounts (Account A) and sent it to Chad, Dear Leader, and the rest of the knights of the Taj-Muncie round table. I noted something like "after Andy posted a statement on RCG, I decided to ask FAA .... here's their answer." I think I ended by saying something like "Now you cannot say you didn't know."

Next thing I know I'm getting an email from Andy, copy Chad, Dear Leader, and the rest that appends my email after his. However in his zest to justify his actions before his peers, he introduced two new challenges: (1) by appending my email in his reply, to a completely different email address than the one from which above was sent, he confirmed that the email above was indeed received. And (2), he included his official email signature block stating his title and position in AMA, and thus was speaking in his official capacity.

So here's an EC member, speaking in his official capacity to me (and other EC members in their official capacities) acknowledging (because it was appended in Andys) the FAA's answer with respect to lateral limits of FRIAs.

Yet another example of an EC with minds for checkers trying to play chess. No wonder all the industry stakeholders and agencies roll AMA so often!

Here is the post that got me banned:



And here is an almost identical post by another member that was posted immediately after mine and no infractions! HMMM......



Instead of arguing with idiots on internet toy airplane forums, I try to engage in civil discourse, provide impetus for my opinions and take responsibility for what I post. I guess this is clear evidence that others would rather just further their tiny agendas at any cost, rather than discuss the facts and reality. Pigeon chess at its finest! If you can't justify your wurdz, just cancel em'!

echo (JasonRCG?), are you listening? LOL

Astro

I will say this ... while we often find ourselves vehemently disagreeing, I have not seen behavior in this debate that warrants banning.

That said, I do feel that these topics have been so played out that we are all spinning in circles rehashing over and over the same points, which inevitably leads to comments that are (to put it mildly) "unproductive". I am NOT singling anyone out in this and know that I have been guilty of that myself on occasion.

Interesting that there's little to no sanctions here, and yet these discussions run their course. Self regulation works in the end. Over on RCG, you have an activist cancel culture that feels so threatened by any challenge to thinking they ban people based on what appears to be the same thing others are permitted to do with impunity.

That is true, but I do also note how the conversations here turn personal much more quickly than they do on the other site. I will also say that compared to a certain auto board that I frequent, both of these sites are like the wild west. The mods on that site accept no BS at all and proactively step in if things get too heated (with no prompting). IMHO, balanced and fair moderation is valuable at keeping the dialogue productive. Have a clear set of rules, make the rules known and enforce them consistently.

And that's the main beef with the moderation on RCG. It's anything but balanced and fair. Look at the banning of Astro above. Someone else makes essentially the same statement, no action. And there's countless other examples where a small group can say pretty much whatever they want w/o fear of having what I experience .... the rapid buildup of points faster than one can edit - leading to permanent ban.

If the individual who set up the entire thread about me was able to keep his account, so should have I been able to keep mine.

They may be quick and not tolerate, but they're a very long way from "balanced and fair." Might be a question someone could ask over there, why the different standards?

I don't know the history of everything that happened, so I won't comment on that.

I will say based on recent observations is that all of the AMA related topics have settled into a pattern of trench warfare with both sides digging in deeper and deeper. Absolutely none of this good for the hobby in any way and I am beginning to question what the real motivations are all around

Ah, if the standards are not subjective, but rather an objective standard, then history doesn't matter. That's the problem. In that forum on RCG, the most common violation is either provocation or trolling - both are anything but objective.

If you care to find the truth, simply go back and read any thread with an truly objective frame of mind. One “side” presents facts that support their narrative. The other “side” uses whatever means necessary (usually name-calling or moderation) to deflect from their agenda when it is debunked with facts and reality.

one side formulates their opinions based on facts and reality, the other side has opinions based on what suits them, then uses whatever means necessary to justify them. You know, cart before the horse, versus the other way around.

One of my pet peeves is dishonesty. When I spot a dishonest person spouting misinformation solely for their personal gain, I call it out. Unfortunately, in todays’ culture, I frequently get banned, ostracized and labeled petty for doing so. I’m 100% secure with who I am and do not base my value as a person on my toy airplane hobby, so it doesn’t faze me, except for the fact that society has devolved to the point of simply cancelling those who aren’t the same as you. And we wonder why racism still exists. Maybe more folks should look themselves in the eyes each morning and take a good, honest personal inventory.

Astro

Interesting how the discussion on RCG has devolved into a why AMA is better than the other CBOs. But what's more important is that despite some saying they refuse to interact with us (ok me) here, look at what they're saying with respect to accuracy of FRIA boundaries:
Hasn't that what I've been pushing for all along? As opposed to the EC member who said that the borders really don't matter?

I will probably regret diving into this, but you have heard me say many times that you make many valid points. Where I personally get frustrated is how every conversation devolves into a diatribe on why "the AMA is bad". It seems as your sole objective is to vilify and ultimately tear down the AMA. I have no objections to pointing out the AMA's flaws and where they can improve and I have even supported some of your assertions along those lines. But if there is never a constructive element to the conversation, then not only is it pointless, but it is ultimately damaging to the hobby.

I believe that you are intelligent and well informed on the topics. I believe many of your points are valid. But if the only point of a conversation is to provide a platform from which to say "the AMA is bad" then the it is not worth the time to engage. I hope you do not mind my directness. I do not mean this as an attack or to be an insult. I respect that you have your own (very strong) opinions on the matter and you are free to post and present them as you see fit. But from my perspective, there just really isn't any point to further interactions unless those interactions have constructive element.

p.s.; I speak for myself only, I am sure that others who have been involved in these discussions have their own opinions