Please check page 108 in the JAN '04 issue of "MA".

Is this the answer to NOT touching the GROUND?

Would a kiddie pool out across the runway be the answer?


Really, all tongue-in-cheek and just kidding. [>:]

Edited to JAN. 04 vice Feb. 04. Kinda' getting a bit ahead there.

i saw that, too.
and fer what it is worth, tail touches to a water surface should remove the danger of airframe/control damage.
course, that would also open up the whole, how deep can ya go, can of worms<G>.

there is also a guy hand launching something in same issue. Also lots of planes without rudders- is that a new rule? (require rudder?) Mike Krizan

Mike

Your mixing rules. A controllable rudder is required by rule 10 of the new turbine airframe rules. It only applies to them.... assuming they eventually go into affect.

JR

Horrace,

the kiddie pool might not be a bad idea... unless of course someone wants to use the runway to land on. Of course it could be put on the other side of the runway. My goodness, that might create seperation and make the whole issue moot.

Oddly enough I recall seeing a clip of some poor soul dropping a 35% or 40% into his local pond. Everyone but the owner thought it was great fun. If I recall correctly there was a sudden engine problem of some sort and the pilot just barely managed to get the remains of the airframe to the pond's edge where the expensive stuff could be salvaged.

actually, jr, that rule says all r/c aircraft.
it is in the turbine section, but worded rather vaguely.

What's vague about it? the title of the document is SAFETY REGULATIONS FOR FIXED/ROTARY WING MODEL
AIRCRAFT GAS TURBINES
http://www.modelaircraft.org/templat...Regulation.pdf

JR

Aw, com'on Mongo! Nothing at all Vague about that item. The Safety Code Turbine Section references to document 513, Turbine Safety Rules. In there you find that the safety rules are applied to both CL and RC aircraft and maybe for FF. (I wasn't looking for FF. [:-])
The item states RUDDER for all RC models. Without having to restate every already-stated word, the rule simply states that rudders are required on RC models and NO REFERENCE is made to CL etc. Doesn't say can or can't for those other than RC.

In the turbine document where CL and RC are addressed and specific to RC.

If that rule is vague, then so is just about everything else vague to you, except maybe "Time to eat."

So do all RC have to have rudders. I thought I read it somewhere. I know about the req in turbine and pylon. I was under the impression it was new req. I am so confused. Can DB make my day better? Mike Krizan

Hoss

Mongo ain't around. He's checking all his models for fuses.

FF section: 3) I will employ the use of an adequate device in flight to extinguish any fuses on the model after it has completed its function.

Mike

Half the 1/2 A kits used to be aileron and elevator... no functioning rudder. Somewhere recently, someone posted the new turbine rule up without explaination and that was probably what you saw.

JR

ambiguity is the playground of lawyers.
anything not spelled out in detail will be argued, if they are aware of it.

and yes, i was out flying F1B this afternoon.
and yes, i have a snuff tube on all my wakefields.

originally by jr
" Half the 1/2 A kits used to be aileron and elevator... no functioning rudder. Somewhere recently, someone posted the new turbine rule up without explaination and that was probably what you saw. "

now, most any rule that must havve an explanation posted along with it to be properly understood, is ambigous, or in my words to vague.

mongo

I think it was posted in THIS forum, but might have been in the Jets or Funfly one. I guess you could track it down and give the poster 'ell about it.

i could care less who posted it.

any rule that is simply the statement
all r/c aircraft must have movveable rudder (paraphrased, as i am to lazy to look it up again)

is way to all encompassing.
no matter what section of the code it is included in.

...even when it's under the heading, "The following rules apply to TURBINE POWERED AIRCRAFT???" I'm only paraphrasing, because I'm too lazy to go and look it up.

HOW 'BOUT US IN THE GGGGREAT WWWWWHITE NORTH? I don't know about anyone else, but my kidee pool is frozen solid, HOSS. That should be cause for a new rule! Oh boy!...JIM

just like here already, matt, it will not always be published with that heading attached.

and an area of confusion is not something we need more of.

If it does apply only to turbines, maybe they could clear up all ambiguity by simply amending the rule to:
-All turbine powered aircraft (not all RC aircraft) must have a rudder.
Seems a simple enough thing to do. Even being in that particular section, it has raised some eyebrows localy due to the wording.
Other items in the turbine rules specify turbines, and do not use the blanket statement "all RC aircraft" such as:
21. "Turbine engine RC models shall not be flown during any period of darkness...."
....so why not this one??
Is this like Washington law makers piggy-backing bills onto others being passed, with intent being hidden with-in other "higher-profile" items? I'm optimistic that this is not the case.

Brian

PS- Any of you waiver holders out there have a CL turbine?? I see some rules for CL in the turbine section too, and was wondering if these too applied only to turbine engines.
CL turbine....too crazy!! hehe

>>>>>>>>>>>
zxcv11

Brian

PS- Any of you waiver holders out there have a CL turbine?? I see some rules for CL in the turbine section too, and was wondering if these too applied only to turbine engines.
CL turbine....too crazy!! hehe
<<<<<<<<<


Charlie Bauer, Dist. VI VP flies a CL turbine, U-2.

Regardless of the web site title there is a world outside RC. Actually the site has a CL forum just a bit above the Clubhouse.

So What the -ell does one need an operable rudder for on a CL model other than CL Precision Aerobatics where at one time some were used, but now I don't see much of that anymore.
The objective is to keep it OUT on the lines, not to zero in on the pilot. [X(]

IMO, anyone unable to determine the printed rules, (see my post #9 this forum) walks in an aura of mental vagueness.

Guess it's the Safety Code and rules and insurance that makes the following indicate that AMA legislation is doing a great job.
"The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools."
--Herbert Spencer, English Philosopher (1820-1903)

Hoss, these rules and regs provoke and incite the 'aura of mental vagueness'. They are, in themselves sometimes, the "poster child" for speculation. Why, as I asked before, is it specified in some rules, and yet not in others?

Brian

PS- I'd really like to see that CL turbine fly.....that's some mighty swift circles boys!! Wizzzzzzzz

Did you note the CL turbine speed limit of 100 MPH???? Why bother with the turbine power if you have to fly it that slow? I bet Charley's U-2 is faster than that !