Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
07-16-2010, 08:36 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
i'm not saying the ama is a bad thing, i am merly saying the insurance that seems to be what people are pushing is not all that it is cracked up to be and is conditional on where you are . i am flying in big fields with no one and nothing around me for about a half mile in radius, thats why i have said the ama is not for me at this time .
i have not been on here for awhile i thought i herd the faa was trying to limit the hobby to a certian footage in the air is that it or has that changed again, the only thing i see from the faa is on the use of model aircraft for commercial use dated 06/2010 so what is it this time somebody help me out here .
i have not been on here for awhile i thought i herd the faa was trying to limit the hobby to a certian footage in the air is that it or has that changed again, the only thing i see from the faa is on the use of model aircraft for commercial use dated 06/2010 so what is it this time somebody help me out here .
07-16-2010, 11:16 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ANYONE wondering why you should join the AMA please read this thread "frequency up for grabs" started by 2 stroke here on RCU, this is an excerpt
Their club is having an issue with freq conflict. PLEASE read the thread and then decide why the AMA is worth every penny it costs......
Quote
We have been contacted by the president of the ama over our issue and they are now helping out, sometimes you have to go to top. I am impressed with him taking intrest in a small clubs problems.
Read more: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_98...#ixzz0tuMmNKE3
We have been contacted by the president of the ama over our issue and they are now helping out, sometimes you have to go to top. I am impressed with him taking intrest in a small clubs problems.
Read more: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_98...#ixzz0tuMmNKE3
07-16-2010, 11:51 PM
#53
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ORIGINAL: theriddler33872
ok i really don't want this to turn into a peeing match , this is what it says for one ........AMA coverage in not limited to model flying at contest or at a club field , it applies to flying on private property , at public demonstrations and at air shows lets brake this down as i stated writen premission would be private property the heli pilot did not have writen premission , it's a city park and the reason the city ( tampa ) did not press charges is that the law is writen in a way that doesn't really limit that kind of activity .
number two the heli pilot, i live in florida not to far from tampa and i think you are confusing the pilot they interviewed with the pilot that hit the girl ( the video can be found on fox 13 news tampa ). but ok lets say he was ama just for the reason to satisfy you ( although the pilot is not ama ) , the pilot was buzzing this poor 17 year old girl , how can i draw such a conclusion thats easy the girl stated in her interview she heard the heli going around her and it keep sounding like it was getting closer .......hmmmmm i wonder , the pilot claims he had a component failure of a part that rarely fails .so if he is ama he kinda falls under my statement again, is this the kind of person the ama in some small way wants representing them? before you make anymore statements watch the news please no where on the news do they state the pilot is or is not ama .although the pilot they interviewed was, he made a statement that would lead people to believe the pilots that did this were not ama .
number three , i said i applaud the ama for helping this girl and her family out i didn't remember the amount .
and just to let you know i wasn't referring to the tampa incident but once again just goes to my point .
if the insurance is conditional like it is with the ama then it's worthless , but to give someone the sense that they are covered when in fact they are not is the b.s. i'm talking about , i pay $106 a year for my home owners insurance which covers me in the event i have a accident , and we all have accidents it's just part of our hobby , although if it was something that could have been avoided , then it should have been avoided , that is why i keep saying the biggest rule to follow is to fly with common sense .
ok i really don't want this to turn into a peeing match , this is what it says for one ........AMA coverage in not limited to model flying at contest or at a club field , it applies to flying on private property , at public demonstrations and at air shows lets brake this down as i stated writen premission would be private property the heli pilot did not have writen premission , it's a city park and the reason the city ( tampa ) did not press charges is that the law is writen in a way that doesn't really limit that kind of activity .
number two the heli pilot, i live in florida not to far from tampa and i think you are confusing the pilot they interviewed with the pilot that hit the girl ( the video can be found on fox 13 news tampa ). but ok lets say he was ama just for the reason to satisfy you ( although the pilot is not ama ) , the pilot was buzzing this poor 17 year old girl , how can i draw such a conclusion thats easy the girl stated in her interview she heard the heli going around her and it keep sounding like it was getting closer .......hmmmmm i wonder , the pilot claims he had a component failure of a part that rarely fails .so if he is ama he kinda falls under my statement again, is this the kind of person the ama in some small way wants representing them? before you make anymore statements watch the news please no where on the news do they state the pilot is or is not ama .although the pilot they interviewed was, he made a statement that would lead people to believe the pilots that did this were not ama .
number three , i said i applaud the ama for helping this girl and her family out i didn't remember the amount .
and just to let you know i wasn't referring to the tampa incident but once again just goes to my point .
if the insurance is conditional like it is with the ama then it's worthless , but to give someone the sense that they are covered when in fact they are not is the b.s. i'm talking about , i pay $106 a year for my home owners insurance which covers me in the event i have a accident , and we all have accidents it's just part of our hobby , although if it was something that could have been avoided , then it should have been avoided , that is why i keep saying the biggest rule to follow is to fly with common sense .
I do not know for sure if the heli pilot was or was not an AMA member. The link provided: http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...iAccident.aspx is a statement from Dave M that says he was an AMA member. Perhaps he wasn't? I don't know, but I do not think Dave would have said so if he wasn't.
And I totally agree. That guy should not have been flying there in the first place but that topic has been covered in another thread.
Frank
07-16-2010, 11:55 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ORIGINAL: tinner1
ANYONE wondering why you should join the AMA please read this thread ''frequency up for grabs'' started by 2 stroke here on RCU, this is an excerpt
Their club is having an issue with freq conflict. PLEASE read the thread and then decide why the AMA is worth every penny it costs......
ANYONE wondering why you should join the AMA please read this thread ''frequency up for grabs'' started by 2 stroke here on RCU, this is an excerpt
Quote
We have been contacted by the president of the ama over our issue and they are now helping out, sometimes you have to go to top. I am impressed with him taking intrest in a small clubs problems.
Read more: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_98...#ixzz0tuMmNKE3
We have been contacted by the president of the ama over our issue and they are now helping out, sometimes you have to go to top. I am impressed with him taking intrest in a small clubs problems.
Read more: http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_98...#ixzz0tuMmNKE3
Frank
07-17-2010, 09:07 AM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ORIGINAL: Muroc1
I do not know for sure if the heli pilot was or was not an AMA member. The link provided: http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...iAccident.aspx is a statement from Dave M that says he was an AMA member. Perhaps he wasn't? I don't know, but I do not think Dave would have said so if he wasn't.
And I totally agree. That guy should not have been flying there in the first place but that topic has been covered in another thread.
Frank
I do not know for sure if the heli pilot was or was not an AMA member. The link provided: http://www.modelaircraft.org/aboutam...iAccident.aspx is a statement from Dave M that says he was an AMA member. Perhaps he wasn't? I don't know, but I do not think Dave would have said so if he wasn't.
And I totally agree. That guy should not have been flying there in the first place but that topic has been covered in another thread.
Frank
Remembering back...when it was suggested that he likely was an AMA member, the notion was heavily discounted....wonder why that was/is???
Now, you say he shouldn't have been flying there...but I wonder if model aircraft are still being flown there??? Even though there was ample conjecture about it being illegal to fly there, I haven't heard anything that confirms that it was truly against the law to fly models there...
Face it...model heli accidents happen...most often while AMA members are the PIC...and while at AMA club chartered fields...We just had a accident at our club field that was in many ways very similar to this incident... So, is it more about where...or more about how???
Maybe it was more how he was flying rather than where he was flying...
07-17-2010, 09:41 AM
#56
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
it is not illegal to still fly there and yes you drive by gasden park and there are still people that show up and fly there from time to time , i myself have never flown there because there are to many people there . it is frowned upon though .....
i've never said the ama doesn't do anything my ***** has been the insurance , too many ama'ers keep saying "and you get this great insurance" which is b.s. . so i'll put it this way if someone out there wants to join the ama don't do it over the insurance do it because you want to join your local club .
i live between florida and virginia and most of the time i am way out in the middle of no where , my reasons for me not to join is i go way , way out to no where land to fly no homes, no people , no cars except mine . i get the land owners ok and i do not tread a bunch of people out to there land .
now if you live in the city with limited places to fly, then if you want to fly you don't have much of a choice now do you , to join most clubs you have to belong to the ama.
with insurance no matter who holds it on your behalf there is always a out for them not to pay a claim , it's no different with the ama and if you are flying anywhere other then the club field you are putting yourself at risk , if the person in question in tampa, if hewas a ama member a city park is not a approved fly spot so the ama could refuse the claim anyway because the insurance is conditional ....
people make it sound like your covered just because you are a member that is not true.
to join or not to join , if your a member you should push to support it , and if you've ever had problems with them you should be advising against it .....i've had niether i have never been a member nor have i had problems with the ama , so many people ask this question and it always turns into a peeing match, i started off with just a question about the people that are making videos on utube , if some of those people are really who the ama wants representing them because of there disregard of the safety rules, i'm not refering to guys like nightfllyer there are others that show a blatant disregard for the rules but claim they are ama'ers or show themselfs at a club flying field , and so on and so forth .
i've never said the ama doesn't do anything my ***** has been the insurance , too many ama'ers keep saying "and you get this great insurance" which is b.s. . so i'll put it this way if someone out there wants to join the ama don't do it over the insurance do it because you want to join your local club .
i live between florida and virginia and most of the time i am way out in the middle of no where , my reasons for me not to join is i go way , way out to no where land to fly no homes, no people , no cars except mine . i get the land owners ok and i do not tread a bunch of people out to there land .
now if you live in the city with limited places to fly, then if you want to fly you don't have much of a choice now do you , to join most clubs you have to belong to the ama.
with insurance no matter who holds it on your behalf there is always a out for them not to pay a claim , it's no different with the ama and if you are flying anywhere other then the club field you are putting yourself at risk , if the person in question in tampa, if hewas a ama member a city park is not a approved fly spot so the ama could refuse the claim anyway because the insurance is conditional ....
people make it sound like your covered just because you are a member that is not true.
to join or not to join , if your a member you should push to support it , and if you've ever had problems with them you should be advising against it .....i've had niether i have never been a member nor have i had problems with the ama , so many people ask this question and it always turns into a peeing match, i started off with just a question about the people that are making videos on utube , if some of those people are really who the ama wants representing them because of there disregard of the safety rules, i'm not refering to guys like nightfllyer there are others that show a blatant disregard for the rules but claim they are ama'ers or show themselfs at a club flying field , and so on and so forth .
07-17-2010, 10:36 AM
#57
RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
I have never understood the concern about the AMA insurance being secondary. I worked for Allstate Insurance for several years and took many of the insurance courses offered by the Insurance Institute of America.
haveing the AMA insurance as secondary insurances means that it is less expensive and that it adds to any insurance you already have, giving you MORE protection. This is a VERY good set-up and well thought out.
Why people find this objectionable bewilders me.
haveing the AMA insurance as secondary insurances means that it is less expensive and that it adds to any insurance you already have, giving you MORE protection. This is a VERY good set-up and well thought out.
Why people find this objectionable bewilders me.
07-17-2010, 10:56 AM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
thats the second time i've herd secondary insurance from somebody i'm not trying to debt anything but which is it .....if you've looked at alot of these post on alot of these forums,alot of people think it's there insurance to fly, so maybe someone should brake it all down to those that think it's all about insurance .
i remember the first time i asked about the ama and why i decided not to join it was just like this thread , but i remember almost everyone was all about the "great insurance you get when you join" and of coarse the supporting of the hobby , which the support of the hobby in my opion would and should be first . i'm not about politics thats why i owned my onw business for years and why i haven't join the ama .
no matter in any case if you have ama insurance and you are not flying at a ama santioned area you are at risk of not being covered in the event of any mishap .
you don't need the ama the ama needs you
i remember the first time i asked about the ama and why i decided not to join it was just like this thread , but i remember almost everyone was all about the "great insurance you get when you join" and of coarse the supporting of the hobby , which the support of the hobby in my opion would and should be first . i'm not about politics thats why i owned my onw business for years and why i haven't join the ama .
no matter in any case if you have ama insurance and you are not flying at a ama santioned area you are at risk of not being covered in the event of any mishap .
you don't need the ama the ama needs you
07-17-2010, 01:51 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
It's really simple. If you have a homeowner's or other policy that covers the liability then that is your primary and the AMA insurance is secondary. However, if you're like me and don't have homeowner's insurance (we rent, and rental insurance is way expensive here) then the AMA insurance becomes primary. Like I said, simple.
The FAA issue is that they are working on formulating regulations to cover UAS (Unmanned Aircraft Systems) for commercial and other uses in US airspace. More and more law enforcement agencies are looking into UAS to help them do their jobs as well. By simple definition our model airplanes constitute a form of UAS, and as such could be adversely affected by FAA regulation. That is why the AMA is working closely with the FAA to insure that our hobby is impacted as little as possible by the new UAS regulations. Without the AMA who knows what would happen. There has been little to no information about these proposed new regulations outside the FAA because of their seemingly limited focus.
The FAA issue is that they are working on formulating regulations to cover UAS (Unmanned Aircraft Systems) for commercial and other uses in US airspace. More and more law enforcement agencies are looking into UAS to help them do their jobs as well. By simple definition our model airplanes constitute a form of UAS, and as such could be adversely affected by FAA regulation. That is why the AMA is working closely with the FAA to insure that our hobby is impacted as little as possible by the new UAS regulations. Without the AMA who knows what would happen. There has been little to no information about these proposed new regulations outside the FAA because of their seemingly limited focus.
07-17-2010, 02:47 PM
#60
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
thats what i thought thank you for clarifying the faa stuff .
on the insurance i'm not trying to complicate the insurance issue, what i am saying is that it is misleading to tell people you are covered when there are stipulations on where you can fly , a city park with hundreds of people wandering around , well that should be commen sense , but you wouldn't be covered in that situation , the same goes if you were trespassing on someones property and the same would go if you were flying out of your backdoor and caused damage due to a crash , this is all common sense no'no's and alot of us know and understand this (i hope) ,but you see this same disregard on utube or like in this case on the local news , by so called ama members i know you can't control what somebody is doing that is a given' ........but...........could it be they believe they are covered by something when in fact they are not , that would mean they were not educated in the rules set forth by the ama for everyones safety . any moran can feel out the app. and become a card holding member ....right .....so there is no real policing from within' the ama , is there any kind of penalty or fine from the ama if you are found in violation of rules ??? i'm asking because i've never seen it, maybe they have done something or maybe the money is more important, i don't really know anyone ever been banned or barred from the ama , has the ama ever fined someone for violating rules ??? ( i'm not talking like a whole club just a individual )
just read some of these forums it would lead most to believe they are getting insurance regardless , and most do not read what they are filling out they know it's $58 and check here if you agree to the above statement "click" done .
on the insurance i'm not trying to complicate the insurance issue, what i am saying is that it is misleading to tell people you are covered when there are stipulations on where you can fly , a city park with hundreds of people wandering around , well that should be commen sense , but you wouldn't be covered in that situation , the same goes if you were trespassing on someones property and the same would go if you were flying out of your backdoor and caused damage due to a crash , this is all common sense no'no's and alot of us know and understand this (i hope) ,but you see this same disregard on utube or like in this case on the local news , by so called ama members i know you can't control what somebody is doing that is a given' ........but...........could it be they believe they are covered by something when in fact they are not , that would mean they were not educated in the rules set forth by the ama for everyones safety . any moran can feel out the app. and become a card holding member ....right .....so there is no real policing from within' the ama , is there any kind of penalty or fine from the ama if you are found in violation of rules ??? i'm asking because i've never seen it, maybe they have done something or maybe the money is more important, i don't really know anyone ever been banned or barred from the ama , has the ama ever fined someone for violating rules ??? ( i'm not talking like a whole club just a individual )
just read some of these forums it would lead most to believe they are getting insurance regardless , and most do not read what they are filling out they know it's $58 and check here if you agree to the above statement "click" done .
07-17-2010, 04:52 PM
#61
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
Again, a simple issue. It is the responsibility of <u>each individual member of the AMA</u> to make sure they are flying by the AMA Safety Code, and in accordance with all applicable state/local/other ordinances. Due to the wide variance of ordinances governing what is or is not allowable in various places it is impossible for the AMA to set guidelines or regulations that cover each and every situation. It isn't all that hard for a member to determine if what they are doing is covered by AMA insurance or not. I'm sure quite a number would be totally surprised to find that they are NOT covered because they aren't flying by the Safety Code, in violation of local ordinances, or on property where they don't have the legal right to fly - for instance, Orange County here in Southern California prohibits ANY RC flying within the county, period. This isn't something unique to the AMA, either. Every year thousands of motorists find that their auto insurance won't pay a dime because they didn't follow the guidelines set forth for coverage. Same goes for homeowners and just about every other type of insurance you care to name.
The fact remains that for those of us who DO fly by the Safety Code and in accordance with all other applicable laws/ordinances/restrictions the AMA insurance is a valuable addition to our membership.
The fact remains that for those of us who DO fly by the Safety Code and in accordance with all other applicable laws/ordinances/restrictions the AMA insurance is a valuable addition to our membership.
07-17-2010, 05:32 PM
#62
RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
I have been a Ama member for 35 years and i have never bashed any one who is not a member. I have been in 2 clubs in that time and have had a great time. I fly at sea plane fun flys all summer and a ama card is needed but i would pay 58 bucks just for the magazine ,let alone for the insurance. If you want to go out to the boonys and fly by your self or have tons of insurance , go for it. I have made friends all over the US flying my model airplanes not to mention all the imfo i have learned from them. This thread comes up often and normaly i just sit and watch it but this subject has been beaten to death . I have seen some threads where you can read between the lines and the only reason the guy did not want to pay ama dues because they are so cheap or they might go broke paying 58 bucks . I spend 70 bucks to have my garbage picked up every month ,so the money i spend on my hobby is a little cost compared to how much fun i have had over the 35 years of flying. I would tell any one to join the ama as it has been very good for me. joe
07-17-2010, 11:28 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
my aim was not to "bash" the ama but to debt and inform on the insurance issue's, if anyone took it as "bashing" i apologize .
the insurance as i stated does not cover you totally and only if you are in designated areas as i stated before you are at risk with ama insurance if you are anywhere but at a ama sanctioned site , people make it sound like you are covered no matter what once you join , that is wheremy problem is ........
negativity will always lead to more negativity !</p>
07-18-2010, 07:26 AM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
Quote theriddler33872:
i'm not saying the ama is a bad thing, i am merly saying the insurance that seems to be what people are pushing is not all that it is cracked up to be and is conditional on where you are
i'm not saying the ama is a bad thing, i am merly saying the insurance that seems to be what people are pushing is not all that it is cracked up to be and is conditional on where you are
I am NOT trying to argue with you, but in my opinion, I see more people against the AMA posting insurance being the only benefit, and therefore not worth it. I posted earlier something the AMA IS doing for it's members and the modeling community in general, and it got overlooked by everyone except Muroc1. This anti AMA debate is a staple on these forums. Anytime something good is posted about the AMA it gets swept under the carpet. The anti AMA people will never see the benefits of joining the AMA, and the insurance thing is their "battle cry", when insurance is by far the smallest reason to join the AMA. I have been a member of the AMA for 50 years, and I will say that those that belong support the AMA, those that don't find every reason to not join, and THEY bring up insurance a LOT. IMO THAT is why insurance is so often linked to the AMA debates.....
07-18-2010, 11:18 AM
#65
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
tinner1......no, i did read you post and checked out your link, and i agree with your last statement. and even i said the ama members should push the support of the hobby over the insurance , i think ,and this is just my opion and everyones got one i know , clubs have to have somekind of insurance to cover there butt , becoming ama is the easiest most cost effective way to do that , the ama insurance how ever will only cover a individual under certain circumstances , and only if they are standing on ama or other approved land , the approved land other then a ama area is the tricky one no matter how you look at it , the ama leaves the insurance very open to interpretation , and to use that as the main sales ploy is wrong and misleading . that is my whole issue , anytime someone ask this question it seems to be the standard response " and you get this great insurance too" it's b.s. !
the only way to be sure you are covered by your ama insurance is to only fly at your local ama sanctioned field .
one day i'll have to join the ama to be apart of my local club , i won't be joining for the insurance, i'll be joining to futher my support of my hobby and my local club .
the only way to be sure you are covered by your ama insurance is to only fly at your local ama sanctioned field .
one day i'll have to join the ama to be apart of my local club , i won't be joining for the insurance, i'll be joining to futher my support of my hobby and my local club .
07-18-2010, 05:22 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
i'll be joining to futher my support of my hobby and my local club
And those are the best reasons to join the AMA, not for the insurance as some posters like to state. I'll welcome you, in advance, to the AMA, should you ever decide to join!
Happy Flying!!
07-18-2010, 07:37 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
and i thank you in advance , now lets all put this behind us, and lets get out there and fly .
there is one thing we all have in common weather we agree with each other or not and thats this passion for the hobby we all truly love . !
there is one thing we all have in common weather we agree with each other or not and thats this passion for the hobby we all truly love . !
07-18-2010, 08:15 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ORIGINAL: theriddler33872
the only way to be sure you are covered by your ama insurance is to only fly at your local ama sanctioned field .
the only way to be sure you are covered by your ama insurance is to only fly at your local ama sanctioned field .
Why do you keep saying that?
AMA's liability insurance will cover you even when you are not flying at a chartered club's field. See 500J: http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/500-j.pdf
And this: http://www.modelaircraft.org/forums/tm.aspx?m=2505
Or if you prefer call Ilona at (765) 287-1256 ext 251.
And BTW, local flying fields are not sanctioned. There is another myth that can never seem to go away.
Frank
07-18-2010, 10:07 PM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
No real benefits. I fly at parks and the insurance in my case is meaningless.
There are lots of personal reasons too, but none need to be discussed in this thread.
There are lots of personal reasons too, but none need to be discussed in this thread.
07-19-2010, 10:40 AM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
Quote dbcisco"
No real benefits. I fly at parks and the insurance in my case is meaningless.
No real benefits. I fly at parks and the insurance in my case is meaningless.
I have belonged for 50 years and I didn't always fly at an AMA field. In fact, being a member of the AMA and showing the people I was trying to get permission to use their field to fly, often got me in where others tried and failed. And like it or not, YES the insurance thing was what usually made people feel safe letting me use their property. That card also shows you are more concerned with the safety of the property owners, and in general are considered more responsible. That has been my experiences over the years.
Again, I am only trying to point out other reasons to join the AMA, BESIDES insurance.....
07-19-2010, 11:32 AM
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RE: Why join the AMA??? PROS/CONS
ORIGINAL: tinner1
I have belonged for 50 years and I didn't always fly at an AMA field. In fact, being a member of the AMA and showing the people I was trying to get permission to use their field to fly, often got me in where others tried and failed. And like it or not, YES the insurance thing was what usually made people feel safe letting me use their property. That card also shows you are more concerned with the safety of the property owners, and in general are considered more responsible. That has been my experiences over the years.
I have belonged for 50 years and I didn't always fly at an AMA field. In fact, being a member of the AMA and showing the people I was trying to get permission to use their field to fly, often got me in where others tried and failed. And like it or not, YES the insurance thing was what usually made people feel safe letting me use their property. That card also shows you are more concerned with the safety of the property owners, and in general are considered more responsible. That has been my experiences over the years.
