Hossfly

The UNOFFICIAL minutes of the last AMA EC meeting have been posted on the AMA Web site.
They are long and indicate the EC had a long and WORKING meeting. They covered many topics. I suggest any AMA member take time to go there and read all that is being considered.

This is not something Ol' Hossfly usually says, however this past EC meeting has lots of information evidencing -- with a couple major exceptions -- someone has finally gotten down to thinking very positive about AMA's aeromodeling's future and looking at things in a business way. That does not mean that I approve or disapprove of each and every item, it just means that the overall tone of that meeting does appear to me to be very up front and much more professional than most EC meetings with true concerns for future operations.

Here are a few points that are of interest to me and I am glad to see them actually stated as they are. Some items of note emphasis added

1.)EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT'S REPORT:
a. Audit Report

The EVP introduced Diana Garza who is the new comptroller.

Bob Reynolds ( Brady Ware - Auditor Representative) thanked Council for the opportunity to continue working with them.

Important items to note:
Had an unqualified audit opinion.
Trends to think about in moving forward – had an operating loss; the board should be aware that other sources of income (rental, appreciation in investments, etc.) contributed to a positive bottom line. (This bottom line positive operation result did not come from membership revenue.)

He thanked Vicki Barkdull for assisting them (during her transition); Diana will be a great asset to the AMA.

They’ve given AMA a Management Letter with some recommendations.
In the wake of Enron et. al., the standards under which Brady Ware operates must change. Next year’s audit will spend more time looking at internal controls.

The Executive Council is responsible for the financial operations of the Academy; if there are any questions during the year contact Diana, Doug or Brady Ware.

Composition of the Board and term limits. Many organizations are going to term limits and are holding the board members accountable to recruit replacements. Brady Ware encourages the Board to think about term limits.

2.) Posted too early Edited to continue:
Committee Reports (continued)
e. Bylaws
Reviewed recommendations for AMA Bylaw and Standing Rule revisions that were previously presented.
Revised those recommendations and added language pursuant to the recommendation that the EVP position be appointed by the EC.
>>>>
INSERTED: OH NO! Leader Members let's not let this one slip by when they do send it out. NO EC APPOINTED NATIONAL OFFICERS -- TOO MUCH GOOD OL' BOY STUFF ALL READY!!!!! ONCE THAT FOOT IS IN THE DOOR, THE ELEPHANT WILL FOLLOW.
<<<<<
Distributed recommendations to committee members, attorneys and the ED for feedback.
The committee will continue to partner with the ED and attorneys and will bring a draft revision for Council review.

3.) Committee Reports (Continued)

h. Dues Review
A new dues structure is being explored

4.) Safety Code RC Item 10 – the committee discussed the practice of one club that was FBV (flying by video). They submitted a set of rules for possible implementation by AMA to allow this type of flying. The individual will be informed that this type of flying is in violation of the Safety Code and that the Safety Committee does not endorse his concept for a set of rules to allow FBV.


OK Troops that should bring up a couple discussions. You can find plenty more at http://www.modelaircraft.org/0407ecminutes.asp

Ya'll have a nice whatever of your choice.

Hossfly

With all the things that get hammered on this forum, and this forum being AMA which gets so well hammered, I find it very strange that none of you find it inviting to enter into any discussion on the topics brought up in the post above now under consideration by the Academy's Executive Council (Board of Directors).

1. EC is responsible for financial management and will now be audited for internal control moreso than book-keeping.
(This is Sarbanes-Oxley Act of 2002, in case you don't know)

2. Possible EC Directed Term-Limits: ( May require a Bylaws change )

3. EC Appointment of the currently member-elected Executive Vice President (the Chief Financial Officer). WILL require a
Bylaws change.

4. New Dues Structure. (What are they thinking?)

These are things that DVPs need member input on. Here is a good place to get some soup stirred. They do visit. I see the names every so often.

STLPilot

My Feedback: (21)

4. New Dues Structure. (What are they thinking?)

Ha, pretty obvious. That and combined efforts of the e-field prototype. Don't worry Hoss, it's coming soon. I don't think they really want too, they have too. Survival and stuff.

abel_pranger

Okay, Hoss, I'll break the ice and comment.

1. It's the law, opinions won't matter

2. I like the idea of term limits. Also think that measure of one's performance, elected or employed, should include evaluation of one's progress toward grooming a replacement. It may have to wait until DB is gone if a by-laws change is needed. That requires concurrence by a majority of the LM's. LM's have not and will not have a voice during DB's tenure.

3. Goes hand in hand with Item 2. in your list. It reflects the entrenched GOB mindset of the DB administration. The EVP, like other GOBs, is irreplaceable, so his position should be appointed to protect him. Hogwash! The same was said about Carl Maroney, insurance guru. He certainly operated in a manner that was shrouded in mystery, and some wondered how AMA could survive without him. Well, he's gone and yet AMA carries on. The good news on the EVP position is that the incumbent has been grooming a candidate replacement, and as you say, the LM's will have to agree to a bylaws change to make it happen. I doubt that they would.

4. New dues structure. Nothing to hint at what they are thinking. E-ticket is a possibility, but I doubt that the allocation of grounds at the Muncie site represents a prototype E-field. Just an adjunct to accommodate PF's at traditional chartered sites, as Brown editorialized about in the current MA.

Generally, I liked what I saw in the minutes of this meeting. It was the most productive in my memory, and there were several examples of fresh thinking. Seeking coverage for club officers from the insurance company is one, and IIRC the first ever for an insurance policy change during the current administration that would benefit members rather than watering down its value by removing activities and member actions from coverage. The message from the safety committee is encouraging - break the tie between safety and liability. The terms are not synonymous and somebody wised up to that fact. OTOH, the position on FBV (aka VR flight) is retro. Don't see much impact, except for increasing disrespect for AMA rules. This aspect of the hobby/sport is being actively pursued at a club I belong too, though it has the most draconian set or rules (made by a Bd of Dictators rather the members) of any club I am aware of. The ban on FBV will go the same route as the one-time-only buddy box flight, and simply be ignored. The EC needs to be aware that unneeded and unenforcible rules they make up only contribute to general disdain for AMA rules, and that erodes respect for the sensible rules that are actually needed, too.

Edit to add (a grumble):

From the audit report, "Trends to think about in moving forward – had an operating loss; the board should be aware that other sources of income (rental, appreciation in investments, etc.) contributed to a positive bottom line. (This bottom line positive operation result did not come from membership revenue.)"

Where the heck do the auditors think the $$$ that bought AMA's investment holdings came from?

Abel

Hossfly

I like to think they are telling the EC to get off their lazy behinds and pay attention to the fact that the #1 income stream -- the membership dues -- is drying up and if things are not given due attention so will their positions and need also dry up.
Those other small income sources will not hold for long. Just maybe this new law will build a fire under the EC.

My oldest grand-daughter in now employed by a large firm in Chicago. Double Major, one in Accounting, will soon be a CPA and the other Major is in a computer thing specializing in Sarbanes-Oxley computer networking audits. Highest Honors Gradute from -- YOU GUESSED it -- Ball State, Muncie IN.
Lots of counseling available if I get to be AMA Pres. [X(]

Red Scholefield

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Well we are offered a solution to the DB problem.

Hossfly

That would be SECOND best! Anyway, he will make the ballot.

rcflyerfl

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oh well we will have to put up with Horrass for a while longer................


when he passes on....

I will seek out his grave and

XXXX on it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

typicalaimster

Wow here this group is trying to help them advance with technology. Instead they punch them in the eye. *shakes head*

rob10000

I also find this disturbing. I've been FBV'ing for about a year at my local AMA field. When I first proposed this type of flight to the president, here's the logic I used.

I fly FPV with another safety pilot sitting by my side, with his eyes on the plane, ready to take over control of the aircraft in an instant if we have any issues.
This is no different than the technique used to teach a new pilot how to fly without the use of a buddy box.

According to strict interpretetation of rule 10, I guess we can't use the old "I'll take over the transmitter" approach to training potential new pilots, either.

IMHO, the AMA should be proactive and look at ways to incorporate this new technology, instead of closing the door to it like this. FBV is alot of fun, and if implemented safely with some thought is very rewarding. Here's the latest video I made while FBV'ing.
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z010lsBRaw0]Easystar Intercepts[/link]

Stubborn Mule

One needs to consider, at what point in the eyes of the FAA does an RC model plane, a toy, become a UAV?

Consider too all the discussion that's been done about toy airplanes being used by terrorists etc! Viable or not, more than one crazed Congressman and Senator have mentioned the possibilities. And we all know how they determine fact from fiction! "If it gets me da votes!"

For once I have to side with the AMA and agree that caution may be the best path in this case.

Blast! That hurt!

The Mule

abel_pranger

FAA has defined very clearly what limits a model airplane must be operated in to be considered a model airplane and not a regulated UA. See AFS-400 UAS POLICY 05-01 on the FAA web site.

Model airplanes employed by terrorists was last week's page 17 news. This week it is pleasure boats that are being tagged as terrorist weapon delivery platforms. Yellow journalists and publicity hungry pols are consistent in that they are always changing targets as the shock value subsides and fails to get their spew on the air or in newsprint anymore.

Abel

typicalaimster

"You cannot stop technology. At most, you can guide it and help shape its development." -former Intel CEO Andy Grove

STLPilot

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I don't think it's a technology issue, it's a safety issue. Whoda thought 30 years ago you would get pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt 30 years from then. Cars and the safety of cars have advanced, but it still doesn't prevent the dumb guy from not wearing their seatbelt. So while you can't stop technology from advancing, you can certainly just simply add rules to keep things safe. The biggest problem is that the human mind doesn't progress as fast as the neat stuff we get to play with.

If your flying a FBV just do it on a buddy box, problem solved. It's just like wearing a seatbelt and you always have a spotter. As long as the plane is in sight, the FAA doesn't have a problem with it. That line of sight is simply the spotter. Does the AMA have a problem with it currently on a buddy box?

Stubborn Mule

Perhaps Able you have some experience with government officials, elected and not, that causes you to have greater faith in them than I do. But the fact remains, they established the current parameters and they can change them for any little reason they like. 160,000 toy airplane enthusiasts don't mean squat when were talking the perceived safety of 300 million. Especially at election time!

In this case I believe the AMA has a potentially thin line to walk. And if they error on the side of caution, so be it. It could be the difference between your grand kids being able to enjoy the same priviledges 30 years from now that you do today!

The Mule

littlecrankshaf

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Mule
Good post... but the sad logic is if all things err on the side of caution (with endless regulations some seem to desire) our grand kids can't possibly enjoy the same privileges 30 years from now that we do today.

STLPilot

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Sure they will, in fact they'll have even more fun stuff to play with. Regulation only encourages ways around it or better things to replace it.

littlecrankshaf

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Of course I disagree. I guess if things are replaced our grand kids can't possibly enjoy the same privileges 30 years from now that we do today.

STLPilot

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That's prolly what a lot of ol timers said 30 years ago, but look what the kids get to play with today. Today we feel we have it all, 30 years from now they'll feel the same and it will go on another 30 years after that.

abel_pranger

Actually I have rather extensive experience dealing with fed officials, but I won't cite from that to illustrate why I trust FAA more than Dave Brown to leave our freedom to fly model airplanes unmolested, as the pertinent facts are readily available to you:
The AFS-400 UAS POLICY 05-01 I cited previously in this was issued by FAA only two years ago, but it reiterates by reference their laissez faire posture toward model airplane enthusiasts published 26 years ago, and without modification or additional constraints of any sort. You can read it on the AMA site, where it is listed as PDF Doc 540-C. Now compare that to AMA's record of restriction and outright banning of model airplane activities over that same 26 year period for its members, especially during the last 12 years while DB has been president. Note that nearly all of the activities that are restricted/banned by AMA are allowed by FAA. Brown even sent his lackey Mealy to address a Congressional Subcommittee to lie about the contents of the AMA Safety Code in an apparent attempt to get FAA to add restrictions that would affect all aeromodelers, not just AMA members. This restriction was born of his own paranoia, got jammed into the AMA SC by a staged emergency, and was subsequently rejected by the AMA safety committee with the concurrence of the EC. Thankfully, the ensuing FAA policy was not influenced one iota by Brown's shenanigans, or anything else from AMA over the past quarter century.

You want an organization dominated by Brown in control of your freedom to fly model airplanes? Do a little research and then come back and tell me the gummit is out to get us and only AMA is standing between them and us.

As for my grandkids being able to enjoy flying model airplanes, I am more confident in that than I was a few years ago when it seemed the future of model aviation in the US was in the hands of organization that had a questionable future in its own right. Then came the park flyer phenomenon. I feel much better about the future of model aviation now.

Abel

littlecrankshaf

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Kids??? what kids? Technology has progressed now to allow much greater participation in the hobby but yet the hobby lags. Why you ask... The overall perception of regulation is why...real or not it is one reason why. It really is not hard to understand why park flyers are the fastest growing segment...btw AMA can take no credit for that growth. Lack of regulation is certainly a prime ingredient for the popularity.

BTW STL you promised updates on your quest for acquiring a Central Park flying site. Haven’t heard much since you proclaimed you could get-r’-dun.

STLPilot

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The hobby lags or has evolved? Glueing wood together is fun for a lot of people, it's not a lot of fun for other people. Some people would rather not live their lives in their basements and garages, rather out on the field whether their backyard, schoolyard or AMA club. As far as regulation, not much to talk about there, the AMA has CERTAINLY helped contribute to keep things in check with the Feds and have so for many years. AMA can certainly take credit for parkflyers evolving, one good thing leads to another.

littlecrankshaf

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I guess you are right. Parkflyers are evolving thanks to the AMA...I guess it just depends on how you look at it. More and more parkflyers and less and less AMA members... And I thought it was mainly technology...sillly me.

STLPilot

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Well maybe it's not the AMA that can't keep up with the parkflyers and those who fly them, maybe it's the members holding them back. Last time I checked the AMA tried and is still trying to develop a program that's designed for a particular group of flyers aimed at a certain type of flying with a particular type of flying model i.e. parkflyers. Perhaps the growth of the parkflyer came at a fast rate, but if the AMA had the backing and support of the people whom they try to support, then maybe, just perhaps, the AMA could keep up with this new trend and most of all the people leaving or not joining.

You don't think that these people leaving and not joining are not trying to tell the AMA something about their reasoning for leaving or not joining? 1. It's too expensive. 2. Current AMA model does not fit the parkflyer model, obviously. And parkflyers are not 1/2A flyers, they are a totally different breed of flyer. They need their own segment and you know and I know it's coming for them. AMA doesn't want to do it, AMA has to do it. Survival and stuff, so don't why resist the inevitable.

I love when I read from the same people, AMA please support the parkflyers, AMA please don't support the parkflyers and then afterwards, AMA you didn't do anything to support parkflyers. Oh the irony.

littlecrankshaf

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STL

That concern (Survival of AMA) is the essence of most arguments like yours. I happen to have a somewhat inverse perspective I guess. By merely promoting the hobby, AMA will insure its own survival. I really don’t feel the hobby should concern itself with promoting AMA. AMA does not need to fully encompass the hobby…just promote it. Maybe the AMA could even help you get Central park opened up for Joe Q parkflyer… would be a great magnanimous effort to succeed without any obligation to join AMA to use the park. Would pay great dividends…believe it or not…