Bob Mitchell

Horace and Mark:

I've read with interest the statements that both of you have posted here concerning your candidacies for Executive Vice President. Both give readers of this forum an excellent picture of your backgrounds and involvement in the Radio Control hobby.

Both of you talk at length about the need to move the hobby and AMA forward, to increase membership, to protect flying fields, to make it easier to create new clubs and fields, etc. I'm disappointed, though, in the lack of specifics on exactly how these things should be done, and in one case at least, some significant differrences in what you've said here now, and what I've seen earlier. It's quite obvious that both of you want to make things "better", but in order to make a reasoned decision on my voting choice I'd like to know more about just what each of you think is "better" for the hobby and the AMA, and SPECIFICALLY how you would go about implementing your vision for the organization.

So.......some questions.

1. What do you think is the single biggest obstacle that the AMA and it's members will face over the next 10 years? What specifically do you think needs to be done to make that obstacle go away or be as small as possible.

2. What is the AMA NOT doing now, that it should be, to prevent the loss of club flying sites. What should the AMA be doing to assist those clubs that are at risk of losing their flying site?

3. What specific marketing initiatives, programs, campaigns, etc. to grow AMA membership would you like to implement?

4. What is your position on the PPP program? Should the AMA move forward with the program as it is? If not what should be changed? Should it be abandoned?

Mark: I have no idea what your feelings are on the PPP so we're starting from scratch here.

Horace: You have stated that you wish to reserve your judgement on the program and it's effects on membership. To be honest that comment surprised me quite a bit based on the impression I've gotten from what you've posted here. To make sure I wasn't jumping to conclusions I spent about 10 minutes looking back through a couple of PPP threads here on the board and from based on what you've previously said it seems that you are NOT reserving your judgement. Here is what I found in just a few minutes. The items include date posted, thread title and then the quote. To me, the first and second seem the most significant in terms of your judgement on PPP and appear to directly contradict that you have reserved judgement.

I can't do a similar search for Mark's comments since he doesn't post here.

Begin Quotes

3/17 Will your club allow PPP members to join?
As far as the TOPIC goes, my views are contained in post 34 of this thread. To save you time here is the meat of that post:

>>>"With the above in mind, I have no real interest in the individual that has no interest in the real model aviation world. If one cannot afford full AMA dues, and an annual club dues of $150.00 per year which may have to increase soon, then I will do whatever I can to send these persons to another place to play with their toys. In my long history within this sport, I find that those that reject clubs and organization have almost no interest in being a real part of the force needed to maintain the sport. In reality, IMO, 70% of the very active fliers have little or no ORGANIZATIONAL interest outside their own self-gratification. If they did, then we would not be having this discussion.
<<<

I will do my best to keep Jetero RC Club, Inc from recognizing the PPP as true AMA membership. Unfortunately for me, as in the rest of AMA, my disciplined views are not well accepted by the majority at any club.

7/19 International park flyers association?
Now mind you, I don't support the PPP as presented by AMA, however I do admire those individuals - not the corporate protected "bottom suckers" - that get off center and try to accomplish a new framework, even though they may well be and often are, very much in a minority.
-
7/17 Will your club allow PPP members to join?
As for me, let the kids play in their yard and I will play in mine. Some things are more important to me than being the good guy while others fail to shoulder their responsibility as I do mine.

7/09 Will your club allow PPP members to join?
IMO, -pkh-, you are correct, however the holes in the program need to be fixed by those that left/made the holes. Personally, I think as you do, however I have been very much subjected to the Bureaucracy's different thinking.
As it has been said before, "Nothing is so UNCOMMON as COMMON SENSE.

7/09 Will your club allow PPP members to join?
I am all for AMA reaching out to any and all modelers. I do have reservations with the methods that are now being used. I stand with P-51B. It's the program that is the problem, and I see no reasons that Club Officers have to attend to AMA's screw-ups with new programs, especially since for almost 40 years, the Chartered Club Officers have been AMA's unpaid SALES FORCE. Club officers have well paid their dues, and not just the AMA annual dues!

AMA states they wish for the PFers to attain their own facilities and clubs. I say, "Have at it." The AMA staff created the problem, the EC approved the problem, so let those that created and sustain the problem handle the consequences.
-
4/11 Will your club allow PPP members to join?
That reason is: $2.5 million liability insurance for first class and $500,000 liability insurance for the economy class. If a PF prop catches me in the eye, unless Joe Parkee Flyee has significant assets, that $500,000 is insufficent to compensate me for a condition where I may not be able to function outside being a burden on others.

End Quotes

5. What is your position of First Person Video (FPV) flying? This is use of a video downlink from the aircraft to give a pilot seat frame of reference to the RC pilot to use to make control inputs. From what I've read it seems to me that this sort of flying is here to stay, with equipment becoming cheaper and better similar to computing technology. I believe that the AMA should embrace this technology so it can grow and expand safely. The current AMA safety code prohibits even equipping a plane in such a manner.

6. What do you thiink needs to be done to increase real AMA involvement by rank and file members, many of whom don't know or want to know what AMA is and does beyond allowing them to join an AMA chartered club?

7. How well do you play with others? How would you discribe your management style and ability to work effectively with others who may not share you opinion?

Mark: again, I have no knowledge of you in this respect other than what is written in the posted statements.

Horace: I do have some insight into your style based on your postings here, and frankly it concerns me. My perception of you is that you have a very combative style of management/leadership. A "my way or the highway" view of things. It's also my perception that you have an ax to grind with current AMA leadership and that this would seriously reduce your effectiveness were you elected to the EVP position. I have no problem with strongly held opinions; it's how one deals with those differences that makes the difference between progress and stalemate. How do you respond to my concerns?

8. For Mark (and Red): Red posted your comments here. Did he do that on his own or at your request? I hope it was at your request and that you will deem the group here important enough to register as a member and respond directly. Same for RC Groups where Red also posted your statements.

(Edit: added new question)

9. What, if anything, do you think should be done with MA? I've seen general comments about it being a drag on AMA finances. I've also seen comments about how much people like the magazine (I'm one of 'em). Should it continue as is? Be scaled back to basically a monthly newsletter? Do you see a roll for MA in attracting and keeping members? Horace, you don't mention MA specifically in your comments, but do refer to it (I think) as "other business interests", so I know you have an opinion on this.

To both of you: Thank you for your time and committment to the AMA and the RC hobby. Real involvement begins when one chooses to invest their time rather than just their money. I am relatively new to the hobby, but it has caught my attention as few other hobbys ever have. I'm fortunate enough to belong to a club that welcomes newcomers and has a first class facility to boot. Anytime I've been to the field I've never had a shortage of help if needed as I learn about how to properly fly and maintain my plane. My guess is that both of you would be among those wanting to help.

Bob Mitchell

littlecrankshaf

My Feedback: (58)

Bob

Please excuse my interruption but just have to say:

What a great post...good questions. Right on target! I really wish you were running for EVP. AMA needs more like you.

Thanks, Mark

Bob Mitchell

I'm flattered by your comments but I'm pretty new to the hobby and certainly not qualified.

But thanks.

littlecrankshaf

My Feedback: (58)

Yea, but it is your fresh perspective that is most needed...maybe that should be a prerequisite. It seems all too often the allegiance to the machine overlooks what it is we are here to do.

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

8. For Mark (and Red): Red posted your comments here. Did he do that on his own or at your request? I hope it was at your request and that you will deem the group here important enough to register as a member and respond directly. Same for RC Groups where Red also posted your statements.

I posted Mark's campaign statement here and on RCG on my own. It was not requested by Mark, but I felt the subscribers to this forum should see them and be able to weigh them against any others posted. I did find HC's response rather telling and indicative of what could be expected should he be elected. I pasted it here so others won't have to go looking for it. It is a shame that more people than the limited number on this group will not have seen it.

"Horrace Cain

Hey, Red! Does Mark use his AMA DVP expense allowance to pay you for being his campaign manager? Is Mark afraid to come here and do it himself and be ready to field one-on-one answers to questions, or will you also answer his questions for him?

While I started the thread, I did leave the door open for other candidates to enter here, even anyone doing write-in."

Rather magnanimous of him to "leave the door open for other candidates".

Bob Mitchell

I suspected that was the case and is the reason I asked the question. IMO you should have stated that at the very beginning of your posting. If you know Mark why don't you suggest that he register on the forum and post his replies to the questions I've asked?


Although I can't control it, I would certainly like to limit comments in this specific thread to the questions I've asked and to any responses posted by either Horace or Mark. I specifically would like to AVOID bringing in comments from a different thread and hashing them over here. Your comments to Horace concerning something he said in another thread which you started don't really add much to THIS thread, I don't believe.

It may be a pipe dream but wouldn't it be nice if we could have a discussion over these questions and issues that doesn't end up becoming a free for all? Your cooperation is much appreciated.

KidEpoxy

Bob
Good questions, will be interesting to compare the 2 candidates answers

Hossfly

When I was a DVP, 79-82, I was at first very focused on one thing and that was to rid AMA of the ED John Worth. I allowed that focus to become detrimental to my other objectives. That was a serious mistake which resulted in all reality to get me a reputation that some love to refer to this very day. At this time I only have one strong objective, however that one will NOT be so overriding as to preclude working for an AMA that promotes all disciplines of model aviation.
In that respect, while I do have detailed plans, I will not allow myself to NOT question those plans and learn and work with others when I can see that other plans may well produce the desired results. I plan to enter this position with my own ideas, yet a very OPEN mind, and proceed as a team member but yet a dedicated one not afraid of work.
Flying facilities in urban areas. Education of political establishments to just how much it is in their interests to provide such facilities for recreation and education of young families (taxpayers [>:] ) along with the older people.
See item #1. Direct representation to the area.
Read my campaign statement.
Thanks for reminding me of these posts. Before Muncie, I was deadly against the Muncie selection even when a search was in being. I was against Muncie after it was selected. Then I changed my mind because I had to accept that Muncie was what we had, and no use in fighting it.
I have never been for the PPP because of the way it was administrated and accepted, as my quotes you bring here so state.
Once I was for a tiered membership. After some additional study I came to believe such was a bad idea. I am now reserving any solid mindset until I see the results of the program for a couple years.

As the quotes below so evidence, I will lobby (I am not a Jetero Officer) for Jetero to NOT accept PPP members into the club as club members. Many of Jetero's members fly foamies. No problem with that. My reasons for that decision are in the quotes you have provided.

Nationally, I believe each club should have the right to determine for themselves what their club wants and which serves that club's best interests.
My personal prejudices are for me and me alone. I do NOT demand anyone or anything follow my lead in that respect.

I do not support anything that disrupts the pilot's attention from situational awareness. Focusing on such is like 1:1 pilots that cannot get their heads out of the cockpit to see other traffic. In my 41 years, I learned to "see and be seen". Unfortunately so much of the airlines' problems today are the pilots that cannot watch anything other than their instruments, which create the bureaucratic air-traffic control system that eats up multibillions of $$$ in fuel wastes. So many of today's pilots are unaware of so much outside their cockpit.
So many RCers are not aware of anything outside their model. Your item will increase that inattention to the world. FAA could get involved. Before you know it, all that will remain of aeromodeling is Indoor Electric.
I live in the real world and have immense experience with the bureaucrats especially the FAA.

I have far too much experience in aeromodeling to waste time on trying to organize today's aeromodelers into such a disciplined goose step. IMO, so few can even pick up their garbage at the field. Those that wish to be a part of the program will. Like so many of our natural citizens, the average AMAer will not even vote in AMA elections.
That is what usually happens when a person is forceful other than saying, "me too" as the label sticks because 85% of the populace are not going to do other than bend with the wind. However I will push in a group, yet I can listen and learn. One problem is getting the dissidents to consider the real subject rather than make tangents to offset the true discussions.

My "ax to grind" is with AMA's direction. If I can redirect AMA to where I think it should be going, then there may be some "grinding." The good point I now see is that in the past 10+/- years that I have been running for office, many of my ideas and many of my terms are beginning to surface more and more. Let 'em claim those things as their original thoughts. Makes no diff. to me as long as the redirect is there. [8D]
OTH with the recent Bylaws changes, I am afraid that there are some undertows still waiting.

Now, Bob, you did not get detailed battle plans. You won't. The enemy can turn the tide of battle when they know your specific plans.

Thanks for asking.

Others. please wait a bit. RCU may be in the works to set up a Q & A place for this election. Give it a rest for a few days, please.

RCKen

My Feedback: (9)

As a side note on this issue. We are in the works of setting up candidate sub-forums for this election. These will be ran in the same manner as the presidentional election sub-forums were ran. Each candidate will have his own sub-forum and member are free to ask any question that relates to the candidate, the AMA, the office they are running for, and the election itself. There will be no cross dicussion allowed between members of each topic. I have already contacted Horrace and he has indicated that we does want to participate in this. I have no contact information for Mark, so if anybody out there knows him could you please have him contact me to let me know if he is interested in participating.

Ken

Bob Mitchell

Thanks for the information, Ken.

I specifically held off with any questions until after there was some activity from each of the candidates.

I wasn't around for the last election you mentioned, and I certainly hope that the 2 sub-forums can be used to really understand what each candidate is about, and not degrade into the typical sniping fests that seem to happen here so often.

Bob Mitchell

>>Thanks for asking. <<

You're welcome.

I do have a number of follow-up questions and comments, but given what RCKen has posted will hold them pending the new sub-forums.

I hope that Mark replies in the affirmative and agrees to participate.

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

There is always the option to question the candidates directly. Mark Smith's e-mail address is no secret and available on the AMA web site under EC members for those that care to send him their questions.

Just go to: http://www.modelaircraft.org/members...c/contact.aspx and then click on his name.

Bob Mitchell

I just sent him a message asking him to join the discussion here.

Since you seem to know him well enough to post campaign information for him, have you discussed this with him? Have you let him know about the plans here on the board?

Red Scholefield

My Feedback: (9)

For the record. I am not posting Mark's campaign statement for him, I posted it on my own as I explained earlier. Campaign statements will appear in the October issue of MA. Since a number on this forum claim they trash it without looking I thought it prudent to give them a look at the candidate.

That being said, I did forward Ken's message to him. Whether he chooses to participate is up to him. Given the relatively few number of votes (61 have voted in the EVP election poll) at stake here and the AMA malcontents that populate the AMA RCU forums he may not feel it is worth his time.

PLANE JIM

My Feedback: (109)

Bob, I sure like the way you operate and try to maintain the focus of the topic without letting another member with their own ax-grinding agendas disrupt the discussion. Way to go again.

Bob Mitchell

Thank you.

PLANE JIM

My Feedback: (109)

EDITED -GREAT THREAD

fliers1

I suppose I am once more "spitting in the wind" but here goes. The ground roots problem is due to the stressful nature of giving flight instruction. Until that problem is addressed and solved, there is literally nothing that AMA nor anyone else can do to solve any of the hobby/sport's serious lack of growth problems. Many, many times, I've offered my "solution" but either I received not so nice replies or lately, none at all.

BTW, I do have to say that Horrace Cain did try help me in a significant way. If anyone can make a signicant positive change, he can.

"We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them."
Albert Einstein

"Swim upsteam. Go the other way. Ignore the conventional wisdom. If everybody else is doing it one way, there's a good chance you can find your niche by going in exactly the opposite direction." Sam Walton

Take care,
Clarence C. Ragland
http://www.abchobbyshop.com