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Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

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Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Old 03-23-2004, 06:33 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I fly mine with a Saito 180 and APC 17-8 prop. With 30% heli fuel the engine sings and one might be able to hand launch the plane... I've never had a plane that would do better knife-edge spins than this one. With power, it tends to go a little flat and the sink rate slows right down. Don't think there is enough power to climb in the spin, however. Floats on landings...Just don't let her "plop" at the end of a flair. The fuse is a little tender, but most light aircraft are. I think for 3-D, however, the Edge 540 (hangar 9(?)) is a better plane. Rolls off a lttle less during harriers. I like my Sig. Good looking airplane with all the stickers applied....
Old 04-24-2004, 05:34 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

i have a cap with futaba s9202 servos for the ailerons and both stripped out today on me.I thought it was gone. it happened when from straight and level flight i added power. the plane rolled right and shook violently. i reduced power immediately and got back control and landed. these are 70 oz. servos and fairly new. i had sealed the gaps on all surfaces and i have a saito 180 for power.What servo do youll think would work for the ailerons?
Old 04-24-2004, 11:46 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Which servos will work? None will work very long after aileron flutter begins. They don't work worth a crap once the control horns pull off or the ailerons rip away from the hinges.
You may be flying too fast with a high pitch prop or you may have the older wing.
I lost an aileron due to flutter off my SIG CAP231EX at the bottom of a split-S just as I added throttle. At that time I was using a 16x10 prop which is one of the props recommended by OS for the OS 160 engine. I have a new wing and it has no aileron flutter. The only obvious difference between the wings is the new one has the servo mounting cut outs perpendicular (90 deg) to the aileron hinge line. I did not seal the aileron gaps on either wing since I have never found that sealing control surface gaps cures a flutter problem. Proper wing/aileron design will prevent flutter in the intended speed range of the model. The correct size prop and throttle management will keep you below the speed where flutter occurs.
That 16x10 prop presented other problems such as the inability to get the model to slow down enough to land safely at tight flying fields. I later changed to an APC 18x6W prop which allows the plane to slow down quicker and also takes some of the worry out of throttle management.
My CAP has Futaba S9304 core-less servos.
Old 04-25-2004, 01:08 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I wonder if a Brison 2.4 gasser would work w/ this model
Old 04-28-2004, 10:00 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I am on my third Cap 231 and love the airplane. I am a old pattern flyer and find it will do any thing smoothly. I have a YS 120FZ, APC 16X10 and 30% heli fuel. Lost my first one to flutter caused by 9202 plastric gear servos, lost my second one to dumb pilot crashing into trees after triple snap on take off. I highly recommend metal gear high torque servos on all flight controls. Mine is getting old now and looking at Cap-X as replacement.
Old 04-29-2004, 01:37 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

ORIGINAL: FBaity

Lost my first one to flutter caused by 9202 plastric gear servos,
How do plastic gear servos cause flutter? Plastic gear servos generally tend to have less gear play that metal gears. Metal gears are tougher but once flutter starts and one aileron separates from the plane and the other aileron has its control horn ripped out it won't matter if the gears are still there or not.
Can you please clarify how plastic gears caused flutter in your experience?
Old 04-29-2004, 02:35 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

It isn't the plastic gears causing the flutter, just that they fail sooner under those conditions. I have one of the original kits, which I haven't assembled yet, and I found the ailerons to physically be very heavy. They were built like a tank it seems. I'm sure that has contributed to part of the problem this plane had with aileron flutter. I'm thinking of counterbalancing them once I do put it together this summer.
Old 04-29-2004, 06:07 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I'm glad to hear that you're considering counterbalancing the ailerons on your SIG CAP 231EX and I'd like to hear the results. I had planned to try doing that but I put the idea aside after my new wings exhibited no tendency toward aileron flutter. At least they don't flutter in the same speed range that the older wings did.
Old 04-29-2004, 08:07 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I was flying with a 16 x 10 apc prop and I bet I have the older wing too.I will check when Im back in town. I will try an apc 18x8 and see how that works.My horns were tight and hinges are still solid.dont know?
Old 04-30-2004, 10:12 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I was using some 9202s that I had taken from a heli that I had sold. I first noticed stripped gears in a servo on the aileron and supposed it was just from wear in the heli and installed another used 9202. I realize now that the aileron was fluttering and messing up the gears and later lost the aircraft due to flutter and gears were srtipped again. I was flying the Cap at Warp 9 speed but linkage was tight and gaps sealed and I was warned by the first servo gear problem , just didn't recognize what the problem was. I called Sig and they suggested Hitec MG615 servos on ailerons and elevator which I put in my second Cap 231 with no further problems.. I have propped the YS 120 up and now fly at a slower speed but still have gobs of power.
Old 04-30-2004, 03:41 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I know that I am way late in the game on this thread but here goes.

I purchased one of these when they first came out. At that time the Hanger 9 CAP 232 was still the talk of the new generation ARFs.
I set it up with the same equipment as the H-9 and flew them side by side. The H-9 was always better in the high alpha manuevers. One day I removed the landing gear from both models and layed them belly to belly to see what the obvious differences in moments were.
I found that the wing on the SIG was 3 1/2 further back on the fuselage than the H-9 Making for a much longer nose moment.
With that, I notched the wing leading edge back to the main spar and re-made the wing saddles to accomodate the new forward wing position. I re-balanced the plane by cramming everything that could move as far forward as possible.
The following flights showed that it transformed into a really great flyer compared to the stock arrangement. Unfortunately I only got about thirty flights in before it was lost in a head to head midair with a US Aircorps trainer. Both airplanes were totaled showing that AIRCORPS planes were tough but far from indestructible.[8D]
Old 08-10-2004, 09:45 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I have one of these with the old wing with the aileron pushrods at an angle to the hinge line. I'm considering a Saito 150 for power. My linkages are all tight, no play, and I'm using Hitec 605 servos. From what I've read , in order to avoid flutter, power needs to be managed so that excessive speed is avoided. I'm wondering how well this airplane will perform at moderate speeds and why high rates of speed would be necessary to perform most airobatics. Also what size prop would be best for the Saito 150 to deliver the necessary thrust and prevent excessive airspeed ?
Old 08-11-2004, 06:20 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I am rebuilding one of these that my instructor gave to me after belly landing in a field. The fuse is cracked in half, but the rest of the plane is in great shape. The covering needed attention too, so I stripped it. I would like to know, how would you counterbalance the ailerons, as I am at the perfect point to do this. Does it really fly that much better with the wing moved up more? Did it change your incidence? I am hoping to rebuild it soon and trying to get the right power for it. I do plan on adding as little weight as possible, but will probably have some inevitable weight gain. I like resurrecting planes. I just got a Sig Something Extra that was cracked up and rebuilt it adding ony 2 oz. It flies great.
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Old 01-08-2005, 01:39 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Can anyone remind me what the CG is supost to be on this Cap? thanks.
Old 01-08-2005, 09:17 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

ORIGINAL: supertiger2004

Can anyone remind me what the CG is supost to be on this Cap? thanks.
Well for you, I pulled out my booklet. It states that you should start out at 4" behind the leading edge at the root and that you can go all the way to 4 15/16". They said there favorite spot was at 4 1/2" back, but that you should soften the elevator throw because of how sensitive it becomes. I hope this helps you out.

Here is the progress of mine, since I finally started getting into it. It is a challenge for sure.
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Old 01-08-2005, 07:05 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Thanks,, for the info, ive just traided a mustang for this Cap and i am putting it together right now. I hope that my zdz40 wont be to heavy for this plane, ive had a brand new zdz40 in a bag for two years now and i am just now installing it into a plane.
Old 01-08-2005, 11:01 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Cool, let me know how it turns out.
Old 01-15-2005, 10:17 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

runover1, If your still out there can you also tell me the High and Low travels for the ailerons and elevater, most everything is finished now i just need to get it ballanced this Sunday.
Old 01-15-2005, 11:19 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Just for you supertiger,
Here is what the manual says:
Aileron: H=7/8" u&d; L=3/4"U&D
Elevator: H=1 3/4"u&d; L=1 3/8"U&D
Rudder: 3"R&L at widest lower trailing edge. I hope this helps.
I am just about done cutting all of the new plywood out for the airframe. I am still trying to figure out how to join the new front end with the empannage of the rear.
Have a good one.
Old 01-16-2005, 09:35 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

thanks im working on it now. ill take some pictures maby just not shure if i can get them to post or not.
Old 02-22-2005, 10:50 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

All,

I just bought and am learning to fly a VMAR CAP 231 EX 40 (looks the same, just smaller). I need a coweling for it. Anyone have an idea where I might find one?

Appreciate it!

MobilityMax
Old 02-25-2005, 12:41 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

I don't know about VMAR but the 40 size caps I have and need replacement cowls for including replacing the ABS ones that come with certain kits, I use the Hanger 9 Sport cap cowl. You can get them from Horizon and they work well with every cap I have put them on. Just an idea plus there like twenty bucks and fiberglass. Got to paint it though kind of a bummer.
Old 02-25-2005, 05:59 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

Great advice! Thanks. I'll look into one of those.
Old 03-07-2005, 09:12 AM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

well the day finally happend for my first flight with this plane using the zdz40 engine, its 13lbs. All i can say is that the CG must be right on because this thing flys like its on rails and the engine is so powerfull it flys like a plane that doesnt weigh 5 lbs, Im verry impressed I was expecting a tip stalling monster but that only happens if i make it. landings are smooth no unexpected flair ups or diving on landing approches. Well illl shut up now, oh ya i was able to record the first flight using a mini vidio camera i thought that if the flight when badly i would at least get to see what happend.
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Old 03-07-2005, 05:01 PM
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Default RE: Sig Cap 231 EX ARF

That sucks, not you, but I let the page open so long, it timed out and erased my post. Oh well. That is awesome, I wonder how mine will fly with a TT Pro 120. I shelved it for awhile, but I think I'll move it right up behind my UCD 46 with an OS 91FS in it. I am really contemplating selling my Matrix though, I just don't like the way it flies.

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