I have two Sukhoi (120 size) at the LHS. One is Goldberg SU 26 and another is Phoenix SU 31.
Phoenix price is $260 US and Goldberg is $580 US. I’ve found a huge amount of positive info on Goldberg here but almost nothing about Phoenix SU 31 120.
So, could anyone advise me on this plane (Phoenix SU-31 120)?

If both are the same size, and you can buy two Phoenix sukhois for the price of one Goldberg then if every thing else is the same, then go with the Phoenix.

I have had a Goldberg and it is great!
Never saw a Phoenix.

I gotta imagine for that price range there is a big differance in the two models. I bet if you open the boxes and compare you'll find differant quality coverings and construction as well as supplied hardware.

Hello

My brother have the Su26mx of Carl Goldgerg the kit is a good quality but he had a 23cc Super tigre and it's limit for the concours, the fly is very realist and xith a good motor torcroll is possible, photos on my website : http://aerochris.modelisme.com/photos%20sukhoi.html the capot wasn't paint

Chris

Go for the Phoenix, you will NOT regret it. I got the Black Horse SU31 which is not as good as the Phoenix but from the same factory, the BH flies darn well so you can imagine how much better the Phoenix will be!

Gee Tower hobbies has the Goldberg Sukhoi for 320. US sounds like your lhs is really gouging you, given the small price differenc go with the Goldberg ARF. has wing tubes and a really great looking/flying plane

Terry

In my neck of the woods a Phoenix SU31 is only USD110 max! Hehehee ...

tIANci:
He's talking about the 1.20 size Pheonix Suchoi.

ukrconsul:
The Pheonix Suchoi 1.20 is reasonably well built, but very poorly designed. The hardware is dangerously inadequate, the airplane comes out grossly tailheavy and 2 1/2 pounds overweight with a 1.20, the cowl does not fit the airplane if you mount the engine as recommended, and flight performance is really nasty.

As an example of the latter point: I used half the recommended elevator throw and then set my low rate at 50% of that. Even so, pulling full up from level flight in low rates causes the airplane to stall. It will loop at less that full travel (25% of the recommended) but if you pull full up it just continues in level flight with a porpoising of the tail. (The good news is it won't tip stall.)

I know, I have one. Two flights, two crashes.

The Goldberg Suchoi is a great kit and a great flyer. It may not be worth $580 USD, but the Pheonix is worth less than $0 because it will probably break your engine and radio when it goes in.

Jim

Now where the hell are my glasses??!!!! Hahahaaaaaa ...

I had the Phoenix .40 size Giles 202 and it too was way tail heavy. It tracked nicely but inverted filght seemed to take an extreme amount of down elevator to get it to fly level. The plane was very nice looking but seemed to be way overbuilt and simply too heavy. I would seriously compare the weight of the two planes (the Pheonix I had turned out way over the rating on the box) and consider the other comments with this plane. My impression from my Giles is Phoenix makes some nice looking "sport" planes but not what I would consider good aerobatic ones. Just too heavy in my experience.

That would indicate a nose heavy CG.

FlyerBry - Its definately not tail heavy if you need to push a lot for inverted flight. If it were tail heavy you would have a twitchy/sensitive plane on your hands.

I have seen 2 Phoenix Giles 202 and both are very light for a Vietnamese made ARF. I flew one and she balanced pretty good without any weight for the nose or tail. We found the plane to be still slightly nose heavy!

My Phoenix Giles had engine to firewall to cowl relationship problem. Couldn't mount the engine at the right distance from the firwall using the supplied mount. Therefore tricks were performed to get the proper distance so the cowl would mount correctly. Came out a little tail heavy with a Magnum XLS 52 installed, which fit completely inside the cowl. Took one ounce of lead to balance.

Honestly...if the Goldberg is $320.00 at Tower and the Phoenix is $260.00 at the LHS...go for the Goldberg. Until the end of August you can get $20.00 off any order of $150.00 or more at Tower. That would bring it down to $300.00. For the difference in the price at that point...I would go for the Goldberg.

Jim

It seemed odd to me at the time because the plane barely balanced out at the rear end of the recommended range. To me a plane of this type should fly almost equally well inverted as it does right side up. Sure didn't seem like the case with mine. The final weight came out to just under 7 pounds with standard servos, standard battery and a Saito .82 (same weight as the .72) on the nose. If it was truly tail heavy then I would have expected to need excessive up elevator but this wasn't the case. I suspect mine was one of the heavier ones to come out of the factory. I also tend to wonder if the incedence on the horizontal stab wasn't maybe off a bit.

The plane did track nice when not inverted and the fit and finish was quite good. I can't say I would buy another one though as the weight seemed a bit high compared to other manufacturers planes in the same size range. If I get a replacement it will be an Aeroworks or Pacific Aeromodels. A bit more money but much lighter.

Thanks for replay guys. I've already heard what I wanted to hear.
I know that Goldberg on Tower is for $320. The problem is that now I am working in Singapore and it's a different story here. First, ~ $600 US for Goldberg or another American kit is not a joke - it is real price that was given to me at LHS. I will not name them, despite that they even have a website with such prices. I think tIANci knows them too. Second, it is hard to ship such a kit by mail due to its size. And third, most North American on-line shops will not ship outside America. After being for a 5-6 years customer of Great Hobbies in Canada they have refused my order recently for above-mentioned reason. It was just a book. A year ago they shipped me my order here, but not now. The same with horizon, amazon and vice versa.
I am unable to understand this policy. Probably, it is pure American - Canadian issue due to well known events. I don't care actually. It is their problem. There are a lot of things to worry about these days other then some policy-making j....s.
Fortunately I can still buy on ebay.

Hi all. I have the phoenix Sukhoi. I don't know much about Aerodynamics so this may sound like a dumb question. What would cause one Phoenix model to stall with full up elevator and not the goldberg? I assumed that the general configuration of a sukhoi would be the same. what factors would contribute to stall?

Thanks!

Most all aerobatic planes will stall with too much up elevator, it is rather normal. The farther back the CG the more prone to elevator induced stall as well as higher wing loading increases this condition.

On my 1/4 scale Extra I only had 9/16" elevator travel on low rates and it would do all the basic manuvers with that setting. I have seen new pilots with Extras and Caps pull full elevator only to have the plane snap over on it's back and head for the ground. Of course their reaction is to pull elevator to get it to come out and when it crashes they imediately blame a radio hit since they had no control. If you still have your plane you have probably figured out to neutralize the controls and add throttle (which is hard to do when it is heading for the ground) when the wing begins to fly you gently pull level.

Just reduce your low rates and the problem will probably go away. Also, do whatever you can to take weight off the plane, an ounce here and an ounce there will add up to a better flying plane.

I agree with BasinBum, I 've seen the above at the field many times and the pilot will "YELL" radio hit!!!! you know how it goes.

later

Thanks for the reply Basinbum and Evfast! It's good to know that this is normal for an aerobatic plane. I will be sure and take your advice on set up and try to reduce some weight.

Thanks again!

Just thought I would post my experience with the Phoenix 1.2 here:

http://www.rccanada.ca/bb/viewtopic.php?t=10027

gus

I have the Phoenix Giles 202 with an MDS 58 and the battery tucked under the fuel tank and the CG came out perfect!
VERY nice model,tight strong covering.

Gus, Thanks for the review! it sounds like with a few modifications, this may not be that bad of a plane. I have a renewed urge to build the one I have!

Gus, what size servos and battery pack did you use!

[sm=spinnyeyes.gif] for a while..about the pricing
i'm getting the .46 size tomorrow...only $120 @ tower i couldn't pass it up.
i heard of some alternative wood that can be use other than balsa..can't remember
the name...i bought stacks of that stuff form hobby people years ago.
o yeah...Obishi or sum'in like that[sm=sunsmiley.gif]
it's a heavier than balsa but not much

what is the total wieght of the .40 size planes loaded ?

is the covering close to cub yellow?
i'm thinking..i should make it contrass on the bottom
i like to get rid of the red LE on the bottom or go all red on the bottom.