Has anyone bought and put one together yet? Looking into buying one. MM

I bought one several months ago and have it all together except for the engine. I was planning to use my Saito 270 in it but couldn't bring myself to hack everything up to install that big heavy engine. I have now decided after some deliberation to get a Taurus 52 cc for it. The plane itself is well worth the money although I ended up replacing most of the hardware ( don't like metric stuff especially those @#*@++ philips head screws and bolts.

Everything went together quite well but I'm a bit concerned about 2 things. The Aeroworks site ( same plane ) state the stab incidence should be + 1 degree and mine came out at + 2 1/2. I tried to find out here a few weeks back if it would fly OK like that but no one would give me an answer. The other thing I don't like is minus the engine mine weighs 11.5 lbs. by the time I add a 50cc engine, battery, exhaust system, prop, fuel lines, wiring, glue and extra bracing for the engine box I have to add at least 5 lbs so that will end up at 16.5 or more. This is not what I expected.

All in all except for the weight I'm quite pleased. I wanted a big Ultimate for a decent price and that's what I got..... Good Luck.

BTW ............. I got the Yellow one and all assembled it looks NAAAAAASTY.

Test flew mine today in a 20 knot wind.Fitted with a Saito 270 it balanced on the top wing tube with no additional weights needed. Fitted with an APC 20X10 prop it just flew as the motor hasnt the grunt. Changed to a 23X8 NX prop and Wow what a difference, a little to windy to see what it can do but it looks promaceing. Will try a 21X8 NX as ground clearence is minimum with the 23". The only difficult assembly is fitting the nuts to the cabane supports inside the motor box.
I simply cut the motor box to the required length and fitted a hardwood beam across the back of the firewall and extended the left side 1/2" as the saito has a very wide mounting foot. Quality of this kit is first class and if you have a good phillips screwdrivers you wont have any problems with assembly.All servo arms and clevices are ball bearing and were supplied in my kit a testament of good hardware selection. I wouldnt hesitate to recommend this model to someone who wants a perfomance BIPE. Imagine it with a DA 50 it would be AUSOME

Fredo, did you leave your stab incidence the way it came or change it ?

I assembeld the model as it came. I will check the stab incadence for you monday and see what it is. But if you need to change it you could simply file the hole in the front rotation pin in the body and glue the stab in.It realy doesnt need to be removable. But as I said mine flys with no trim needed.

Thanks I would really appreciate knowing what yours is. Yes it would be easy to change, but don't really want to, if I don't have too.

Thanks a bunch ........................ Don

Tail +2 deg
Note if you use the saito the rockers just protrude the cowel

Thanks Fredo, that means if yours is alright mine will be also. At least I can try it without fear of a really bad handling plane.

There were more issues with my Saito than the rocker covers sticking out. I have one of the early ones where the carb sticks straight up and is well above the crankcase, this means I would have to cut a hole in top of the cowl and more importantly the needle valve would be above the top of the fuel tank, I looked at installing the new 300 carb & intake pipes but didn't know if they would fit and it would cost me $125.00 Cdn. I was also concerned about the weight, as I said the plane WITHOUT the engine weighs 11.5 lbs. my Saito with onboard glow and exhaust is 5.5 lbs, plus prop, plus fuel tank and lines, plus changes to the firewall, we're now up to an easy 17+ pounds - too heavy for me.....

Cheers Mate ..............

Dear Don Im not trying to convince you to use the saito but what else can you put a antique motor into. Anyhow my intake stack ends up just under the cowel.I have made a hole in the top of the cowel but its only to prime the motor as you know they like a wet start..Secondly Ive fitted a 2 oz tank that they use on helicopters high an the right side of the motot box that will stay full untill the tank is empty .I have tested this system and have found it to be 100% faultless and my motor will idle indefinately. My saito has the pitts style pipes which exit in the correct place and sounds like a honda motor cycle

Most people Ive contacted agree. No matter what engine you fit in this plane it will still be about 2 pounds overweight. Remember its a bipe.....

Fredo, your kinda shooting down every excuse I have NOT to use the Saito. I never thought about the small header tank, I was going to do the same thing many Moons ago with another plane and wondered how it might work. What size is you primary tank and how long can you fly on it. I have never had the Saito in a plane, I have run it up many times in the back yard just to listen to it. Mine has the dual pipes and primes very easily by holding my finger over the end of the right pipe ( the one with the tank pressure. )

Do you use an onboard glow or do you feel any need to ? I just ordered a new Taurus TS52 last night which means IF I use the Saito in the Ultimate I'll have to buy a plane for the Taurus, Oh Dear !!

My main tank is a 26 oz dubro although a much bigger tank would fit. I use a 3 line set up on the main tank filling the header tank with a tee first and then the main tank. I have flown the model for about ten min and have about a third left. I am also using an on bourd glow with a single 3000 ma battery to drive the system . The on bourd system only works on motor trim as usually the saito without it wont idle and reaccelerate without stumbling for long. The model itselfe has to be pulled in to land as it drops like a brick if alloud to idle for a long distance hence a fast idle is a must.I too have had this motor sitting around for many years waiting for a plane and didnt want a spacewalker or decathlon as times have changed.
For youre new motor how about a Hanger 9 extra 260 it seems to have a good wright ups.

I agree with you. I would recommend this plane. I only have 3 tanks of feul ran thru mine but the first flights have been fun with no surprises. I have a D/A 50 on mine and had to put the batteries all the way forward to somewhat balace. By that I mean its a tad tail heavy but flies like a dream. The only thing it doesn't do well is knife edge it has a lot of coupling and pulles to the wheels. I dont have any mixing in my radio yet but may have to later.

MM, I am just starting to assemble mine now. I weighed everything that came in the box, and it came to 8 lbs 8 oz. I am relly excited to finish it now & see how this plane flies. It should be awesome at around 15 lbs.

They did a report on this plane in the Jan 05' issue of Fly RC. Their AUW was 4 lbs 10 oz, mine should come out the same. Hey, that's light enough to consider a smoke system. I am also using a Brison 3.2. This plane should be a real animal.

There have been hundreds of 27% WM & Aerworks Ultimates sold. You guys that have them, do you like them? How do they fly? What problems did you have with them. If so, what were they. With as many of these planes sold, there should be a lot of comments on them, both pro & con.

Let's hear about it.

I have the 33% Ultimate and my flying buddy has the 27% . I have flown his and it fly's great. He has a DA 50 in his. I have a ZDZ 80 in my 33% which fly's a lot slower than the 27%. The only problem he had was the small tabs that hold the cabanes pulled out in one wing panel. Other than that it's a great plane and a good value. Both planes are built the same, with the exception of the flying wires which are not used on the 27%. It takes me 30 minutes to get my plane ready for flight.
jef

I'll give those tabs a good tug or two to mak sure they are firm. Thanks.

I have one of these planes and just love it. It had a few assembly & fit issues, but nothing too discouraging. I'll highlight

#1. Wing alignment dowels. I pulled them out of the wing, replaced them with 1/4 20 nylon bolt & hardwood block. Do yourself a big favor - pull off the bottom covering of the fuse, make a removeable plate, (under the wing) that way you can cinch the nylon bolts tight, and you have an additional compartment for gear. It is also a lot easier to install the pull pull with the bottom of the plane uncovered. and you can check the framework out in case it needs attention (i found a cracked former i woulnt have otherwise caught.
This modification took less than one evening, the surgery on the wing resulted in a small patch in the covering - no big deal.
I'll post some pictures if anybody wants to see how i did mine.

#2 The cabane mounts in the fuse started to 'woble' (i noticed this during transport when i would carry the plane by the center aluminum rib) I corrected it by cutting the square out that the 4 cabane mounts made - this entales cutting through the sheeting and foam. this exposed the 4 mounts so i could slide a reinforcing plate to reduce the flex. Replace foam and sheeting, recover. This was kind of a pain, but if you do it during initial assembly, it wont be so bad. I also glassed the inside of the box & firewall - that 3.2 has some umph!

#3 this one is easy- replace all those screws w/ hex bolts and blind nuts installed in cabanes. Also save the metal hinges for your screen door I used some Klett giant scale hinges

I'm running a brison 3.2 and its flys awsome @ a hair less than 16 lbs.
If you have a computer radio, take the time to mix out the roll coupling - its not as hard as i thought (if you have a buddy helping program while your flying), and its cool to see the plane KE across the field rock steady like the pros.

I took somebody's advise and didnt belabor the incidence issues, just fly it and adjust from there, there is alot going on with a biplane (aerodynamically)

F2G-1, I guess I'm a visual kind of guy, I need pictures, if at all possible. I don't understand what you sre doing with the 1/4 20 nylon bolts. Are you simply replacing the dowels with the nylon bolts, or are you using them to secure the wings somehow. See what I mean by visual?

That's a great idea, removing the area of the square made by the cabanes. Assembly should be a lot easier. I'm putting smoke on mine, since it is so light. I'm using a 16 oz fuel tank, & a 8 oz tank for the smoke oil, stacked on top of each other, so removing this area will be a big help.

I think anybody would be happy with 50cc plane[1450 sq in] that comes in under 16 lbs. I have a EF 87" Yak that weighs 15lbs 2 oz, & people say it flies like a 40%.
What prop are you using on your 3.2? Right now I'm running a NX 22/8 @ 7250 rpm, & it pulls real good. My 3.2 has about 5 gal through it, & it keepss getting stronger.

I'm anxious now to get mine completed. Thanks for the suggestions, I think I'll do them to mine.

Hope this helps. I just swaped the dowels for the nylon and small block(in wing), nuts go inside hatch. I also wraped the cabane mounts w/ glass to beef them up.
Im running a 20 10 zinger pro want to try a 22 8, we'll see. When you are setting up yours, go easy on the throws (on low rate) for maiden (mine where pretty wild, and when your maidening this plane, too much throw will make you think it has issues, which consequently disapeare when you dial in expo and reduce te throws) For

I am really impressed with WM, this was a fun plane and a very complete arf. I just finished putting together the WM 80" Extra Patty Wagstaff w/ BGX 3500 and it is just as well built, AND lighter than the GP patty. The covering was good on both planes. Hope she flies as good as she looks.

If anyone is still looking for one, the best deal i've found on the ultimate was $369.00 complete w/ hardware from aerotech hobbies (pm me for address and phone # - they do mail order, great people!)

Ted

Ted, thanks for the pics. Now I understand.

You will enjoy the Patty Wags, I had one, they fly great. She'll be real steady for sequence flying.

Ted,

How did you glue the nylon bolts inside the wing? Are they just bolted into the block? Did you cut the wing sheeting to install the block?
I don't really know if its good idea to ignore the incidences. All these Chinesse made aircrafts could have really big tolerances. Mine
had more than 5 deg total. You can't expect to trim out all these trends and have a precise aircraft. It was real pain to straighten up
but now I have 0 deg all wings with less than 0.25 tolerance and +1deg according the AeroWorks manual ( the two planes are same).
I used Robart pin hinges saving more than 65gr/2.3oz and saved the metal hinges for my bakyard door also...
You can save more than 1.6oz modifying the tank tray (-0.56oz) and the canopy hatch (-1.05oz). I removed all the foam from the inside
of the cannopy hatch and opened a lot of holes on the ply bottom and rear. I also replaced the hex nuts on the outer cabanes with blind nuts for easier installation.
Its a good idea to reinforce the ply cabanes. They seem to me very fragile. I am going to reinforce with a sheet of FR4.
I am looking forward to install my new MVVS 45 IRS/MG. I think its gona be balistic.

I made a small hardwood block (low profile to fit in wing) drilled a hole in it, put the nylon bolt through, then epoxyed this assembly in the wing, throught the hole in the root rib the dowel left. My incidences were not as far off as some (only 1 degree), thats why i didnt make a big deal (5 degrees is substantial).

I have been getting everything ready for this coming season, when i knoticed a little wobble in the stabs (almost like they were not pushed all the way on the tube when they were drilled.) I was thinking about making a shim to tighten it up (a thin 'rib'' between the stab and fuse). I dont know about flying wires (where is the hard points?) Anybody else notice this? Any ideas?

Ted

I know this sounds kinda lame, but you could turn the stab tube 90 degrees & re-drill it.

The other option is to inset two tabs on each stab & attatch to the side of the fuselage. You would have to build hard points into the fuselage. A lot of work, but very solid.

I thought of that too, but when i drilled the stab initially, I KNOW i presses the suckers in tight! (The wood in the fuse is probably the culprit)
Good idea with the tabs.

Ted