I am getting ready to put together my Carl Goldberg Ultimate 10-300. ARF I will be using a Saito 1.25 for power and I am looking for suggestions on what would be the best pitts style muffler to use with that engine and I am looking for suggestions on how to install a smoke system in this model. It will be my first time installing smoke in an airplane. I have been consitering using the Syliven smoke system. Thanks you in advance for your ideas and time.

Sincerely

Gavin

Gavin - I'm sure you will get a lot of response to this post, and I for one cannot give you any help from personal experience with smoke systems. I do have an interest in them for my next project, and perhaps the Yak I'm about to maiden. While you're waiting for others with experience to respond, here's some information I've found to be quiet interesting on the subject, and you may as well.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=455
and
http://www.rcdon.com/html/the_ultimate_project.html

And remember, "Experience is a hard teacher. She always gives the test first, and the lesson sometime later!"

Phillip

Gavin I would do my best to talk you out of it. If you do put a smoke system in it. Put all the smoke stuff on a plywood tray. Then fly it with and without the extra pound or so of weight. The difference will be a noticeable. I really think smoke is better for a larger plane. The ULT is a great flyer but if it dies with the smoke system in it. It will go in most of the time.

David

Thanks for the suggestions. Any other suggestion for this model?

This particular Ultimate benefits a lot from light weight,
I have seen it flying with:
OS 120 4-s.
YS 90 4-s
and OS 90 FX 2-s

I flew it for a little over 3 years with an OS FX90 2-s and a APC 15x6 perry pump , other friend flew it on same engine but 13x6,
( I fly at sea level )

this plane just dive when throttle comes to idle, funny way to approuch I will say, and if not landing with speed you will find fixing your landing gear often, as a matter of fact, reinforcing it now makes sence !

I think a SAITO 125 is flat out too much and adding a smoke system on top of it you make run the risk of not enjoying it as much as possible for overweight reasons !!

I used to do all type of nice aerobatics and my combo will sustain nice knife edge, knife edge "L" ( sort of a knife edge loop ), full throttle take off to imelman to name a few.

It went to major maintanace and now a days sits in my hangar orange and white ( gone is blue & yellow ) and ready to fly but has not seen action in 2 years, a pitts monters and a Balsa USA Dr.1 + my magic are
eating up my Saturdays.

Try your best to keep it light, if SAITO 125 is already purchased, so be it but, do not place a smoke system as yet; fly it first and get a feel of it's landing speed before adding more weight to it.

Sorry But I'll Have To Disagree With MANCHA On Using The Saito 125. Perfect Power For The Goldberg Ultimate. Just Balance It Dead On The Rear Cabane Bolt And It'll Fly Great. This Worked On The Kit Built Version. I'm Assuming That The ARF Version Is Exactly The Same Plane.

Flyinmike:
kit are in general lighter, big discussion can happen saying that it depends on how you build but through many years in the hobby, that is the way it is.

In a club 150 miles form Los Cabos, La Paz, I saw this plane as a kit with an OS MAX 120 4-s,
The pilot was one of the best I have seen, an airpilot from Aerocalifornia, He is retired in Ensenada now and has a surfboard factory, he has a lot of fun with it and did better everything than me but I still like this ARF as lite as possible.

Nevertheless, the recommendation is place more weight in phases, it will not hurt you.

HI
I bought used ultimate 10-300 golberg in goods conditions,I change the engine,IF I put 2 servos per aileron which are the output torque for these servos?
thanks for your help

uro:

the original design carries one servo per side that through a wire handles 2 ailerons per side; this wiht a regular servo of around 40 oz/....

If you want for accuracy, you can place a servo per aileron, a new mini digital servo at 6 volt may give you around that same torque and for sure it will handle much better.

Flown mine all summer with a Satio 150 under the cowl, swinging a 17 X 6 prop. Plenty of power for knife edge loops and such. I have had three dead sticks with it due to mufflers coming loose. Absolutely no issues. The plane had a decent glide ( I would say above average for a bipe) and I was able to make the runway with ease each time. The Ultimate is aerodynamically clean for a bipe. She does pretty well without power, unless, of course, one has it balanced nose heavy. I was able to get the CG back with the servos and battery. I wouldn't put anything smaller than a 125 in her. But then, I like plenty of reserve power. Some aerobatics call for it.

The pictures were before I installed the wheel pants. She looks better now with them on.

ram3500-RCU:

At sea level a 90 2-s is plenty.
120 4-s are nice as well.

Your looks really nice !!

The 125 is actually on the small side for the Goldberg. I flew one for 10 years with a 1.08 2 - stroke and ALWAYS wished for more power. I have seen them with a YS 140 ( perfect ) and a YS 110 ( perfect with less weight ).

I put 1100 flights on mine and I can tell you it glides like a man hole cover

I guess this is all relative. I'm at 600' asl, and think the 150 is about right on this plane. The Ultimate is capable of some of the more extreme aerobatics and the power the 150 offers dosen't leave much of this on the table. I guess it is all about how much of the Ultimates potential a guy wants to tap into.

Most bipes do have the glide ratio of a well trimmed Coke machine, but again, my Ultimate (when balanced properly) does have the best glide of any bipe I have had, which include, the Pitts, Christian Eagle, EAA, Liberty Sport, Weeks, Skybolt, Sopwith Pup, among others.

ram3500-rcu:

I can tell you love them,
I have flown:
CG pitt monster, Balsa USA DrI, CG ultimate, and my first biplane, a tiger moth from Kyosho which by the way it was the ONLY one that actualy glides well.
now a days I have a ultimate from WM making the line, it will have a DA 50cc, I have read this bigger biplanes are gliders I will see that next December !!

Enjoy !

Thanks everyone for the advice, it is great to hear what has worked for other people. There hasn't been much responce to this post and then all of a sudden it took off.[X(] I have decied not to put smoke in the plane but I am still looking at using a pitts style muffler, any thought on this? I had hoped to have the plane in the air by now but budget restraints on purchasing the engine and damnaging my Extra 300 have delayed progress on the Ultimate. Please keep the posts comming.

If you mount the engine sideways, there is no need for a Pitts muffler. Plenty of room to angle the stock one down to the gear and still be in the cowl.

I've had a few of these built from kits powered with Os 120 Surpasses. The only manuever I was lacking power on was a vertical snap roll. I could get through it, but it was hard to keep the airplane going straight at such a slow airspeed. I think the Saito 125 will work fine. I would skip the smoke. The extra weight will kill your performance and glo motors don't seem to give off much smoke anyway. If you want smoke, go with a gas engine on a bigger plane. Take your time building and make sure everything is dead straight and all incidences are exact. One of mine was perfect and it flew much better than the others that were "just good enough".

Not trying to get off the topic . I am currently building my 10-300 and after reading a couple other threads on kit building . I have done some mod's to beef mine up. I wanted to know if anyone has a good idea on how to attach the upper wing without having to use the wing pin ?

mono wing:

CG 10-300 ARF uses 2 4-40 hex head bolts to attached upper wing.

I use lock nuts and with the right tool, it is easy and fast to attached at the field, not to mention, safe.

some plywood may be needed to reinforce that specific area but after 7 years of flight on my ship, I have seen no issues on such an attachment.

enjoy.

Thanks for the info mancha . I was looking at some other post in kit building and at my instruction manual in the kit . There is a wing pin that goes thru the center LE of the upper wing that I was trying to get rid of . It just seems alittle mickey mouse [:-]