Are nicads history?
02-26-2013, 09:33 AM
#26
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RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: eddieC
I also keep my NiCad and NiMh batteries on trickle charge (C/50) so they are always ready to go. I have done this for years and my packs last at least 5-6 years this way.
A continuous trickle charge is NOT good. The cells will vent and lose capacity. I lost a very nice scale bird (Swallow) to this practice. I now let my nicad packs set for a couple months during the winter and charge once about mid-winter.
I believe you mean C5 or C10, as C50 is 50% charge per hour.
Bruce
02-26-2013, 10:44 AM
#28
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RE: Are nicads history?
All I can say is that a trickle charge (C/50 or 20 ma for a 1000 mah battery) has worked for me for 30 years with out any problems.
C50 is C/50 or 50% capacity/hour. 20 ma into a 1A battery is 2%, as far as I know that's not enough to do the job. I don't doubt your 30 yr span of 'good luck', as I too thought I was doing well until my crash.
What kind of charger are you using to get that low? Is it a constant 20 ma? Have you cycled the battery recently?
02-26-2013, 11:10 AM
#29
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RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: eddieC
All I can say is that a trickle charge (C/50 or 20 ma for a 1000 mah battery) has worked for me for 30 years with out any problems.
C50 is C/50 or 50% capacity/hour. 20 ma into a 1A battery is 2%, as far as I know that's not enough to do the job. I don't doubt your 30 yr span of 'good luck', as I too thought I was doing well until my crash.
What kind of charger are you using to get that low? Is it a constant 20 ma? Have you cycled the battery recently?
I use a number of different chargers. From the '80s I have four Ace chargers that charge at a slow rate (C/10) for 15 hours and then automatically switch to a trickle charge (C/50). My newest chargers are GP ElectriFly AC Park Flyer Peak Chargers which are set to peak charge at 500 ma and then automatically switch to trickle charge.
Bruce
02-26-2013, 11:46 AM
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RE: Are nicads history?
Bruce, you are correct on the C50. Brain fade. [X(]
I'm switching to a123 tech in any event, as my Nicads are getting pretty old and unreliable.
02-26-2013, 03:24 PM
#32
RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: eddieC
Bruce, you are correct on the C50. Brain fade. [X(]
Bruce, you are correct on the C50. Brain fade. [X(]
I'm switching to a123 tech in any event, as my Nicads are getting pretty old and unreliable.
How old ot too old for Nicads, as I have some that are all of 8 years old that are still giving excellent service and show no apparent signs of breaking down. I treat my batteries with lots of TLC, never overcharging and cycle them every few months.
02-26-2013, 03:39 PM
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RE: Are nicads history?
Lol mine are so old I can't recall how old.
We do have guys flying 10+ yr old nicads, they cycle & baby them too. Sometimes they quit with no warning, as I've had happen.
02-27-2013, 08:44 AM
#34
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RE: Are nicads history?
It is good to see Landeck useing the proper terminology when talking of trickle and slow charge. He is very correct, trickle charge is defined as just that amount of charge to compensate for the leakage current of fully charged batteries. However that is hard to correctly define as it can vary from a few microamperes to a milliamper or so depending on the age of the batteries and the temperature. Slow charge is typically defined as about 0.1C but different suppliers may use slightly different rates. Theoretically, trickle charge will never harm a cell no matter how long it is applied. A slow charge probably will not do much if any harm as long as the temperature of the cell is not allowed to get to high. How much is "to High", a difficult number to ascertain. I have never seen any tests to show what are safe upper extremes of temperature. It probably is quite dependent on the quality of the separating membranes in the individual cells as that does vary between manufactures and whether or not the cells are designed for high current usage or low current usage such as flashlights, transmitters etc.
03-13-2013, 10:23 AM
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RE: Are nicads history?
I haven't used nicad in years and much prefer NIMH. You can charge NIMH with your Nicd charger, same settings. But I'm also using A123 LifePO4 batteries and like the steady voltage and storage charge life. But they're not for everything. On small models with cramped quarters a small 4.8c nimh pack is sometimes a better application. Thought I'd heard that A123 went out of business. Is this not the battery folks?
03-13-2013, 12:07 PM
#37
RE: Are nicads history?
sounds scary switching to NIMH. So, a 1000 mah NIMH can be charged no problem at 100mah for 14-15 hours? Sounds to me like that would be too much. I dont know anything about peak charg\ing and all that stuff. I just want to plug it up, go to bed, and go fly the next day. i dont enjoy playing with batteries...gonna order something today.
03-13-2013, 12:16 PM
#38
RE: Are nicads history?
let me ask this off the walll question..
.Ive had more servo and switch failures since I started using 6 volt paks over 4.8....is this just all in my mind?
d
.Ive had more servo and switch failures since I started using 6 volt paks over 4.8....is this just all in my mind?
d
03-13-2013, 12:23 PM
#39
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RE: Are nicads history?
Yes you can do just what you want. Both NiCad and NiMh have similar characteristics and both can be safely charged at about 0.1C for extended periods without damage should you leave them on for an extra 24 hours. What damages them is heat; as long as they do exceed ambient temperatures by more than 10 degrees, you will not damage them. More are ruined by fast chargers that miss the peak or are charged so fast they get excessively hot than ever got hurt by slow charging to long. The Nixx batteries charging cycle is not very efficient; you have to put in about 120% of the amount you take out to recharge them. That is why it is wise to charge them for 14 to 16 hours at 0.1c after they have been discharged in use or when new. Contrary to what is often seen on the forums slow charged cells will last longer (more charge/recharge cycles) than those fast charged using peak detection.
03-13-2013, 12:26 PM
#40
RE: Are nicads history?
well, Im on batteries america site right now....cant decide...prolly gonna stick with what I know....nicads LMAO 
Im soooo undecided I appreciate the input
Im soooo undecided I appreciate the input
03-13-2013, 12:32 PM
#41
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RE: Are nicads history?
bignasdy,
One of the best things I ever did was to put my wall warts away and purchase a Turnigy Accucell 6 charger from Hobby King. Once I figured it out I find it very easy to change between battery chemistries and do just as you say...put it on and walk away. No more false peaks with Nicd or Nimh and it will charge Lipo and LifePO4 just fine. I've used it for all of those not to mention it also will cycle batteries if you wish and will balance charge the various lipo chemistries. Once you make your settings as per the battery manufacturer's recommendations (printed on the packs usually) you just let it run on Auto and it goes until the battery is fully charged. You can set the time limit for charging, peak voltage, or capacity as limits. I removed the timer limits and set the voltage and capacity. It cuts off when it hits one of those (so far the voltage) and reports how much it put back in and how long it ran. It is modeled after more expensive chargers, uses the same menu but doesn't have the memory or usb port so mine do not store my settings even though the menu indicates it does. I believe they used to include those features but no longer in keeping with the economy pricing. But mine have worked flawlessly.
Clay
One of the best things I ever did was to put my wall warts away and purchase a Turnigy Accucell 6 charger from Hobby King. Once I figured it out I find it very easy to change between battery chemistries and do just as you say...put it on and walk away. No more false peaks with Nicd or Nimh and it will charge Lipo and LifePO4 just fine. I've used it for all of those not to mention it also will cycle batteries if you wish and will balance charge the various lipo chemistries. Once you make your settings as per the battery manufacturer's recommendations (printed on the packs usually) you just let it run on Auto and it goes until the battery is fully charged. You can set the time limit for charging, peak voltage, or capacity as limits. I removed the timer limits and set the voltage and capacity. It cuts off when it hits one of those (so far the voltage) and reports how much it put back in and how long it ran. It is modeled after more expensive chargers, uses the same menu but doesn't have the memory or usb port so mine do not store my settings even though the menu indicates it does. I believe they used to include those features but no longer in keeping with the economy pricing. But mine have worked flawlessly.
Clay
03-13-2013, 04:23 PM
#44
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RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: bignasdy
just ordered nicad pak from batteries usa
just ordered nicad pak from batteries usa
03-13-2013, 04:45 PM
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RE: Are nicads history?
I wrote about it once in MA. I forget but one of the IC components in the servos was only rated between 3.2v min and 6v max with a typ supply value of 4.8v. So if you supplied it with a 4.8v you were operating quite safely in the typ condition characterization range. 6v was on the high end but safe and within the manufacturers characterization range. But going to 6.6v.. as with 2 cell Life and A123.. well that would not be recommended. Since that time though servos have changed for the better. And now you have HV servos that can operate with a 2 cell lipo supply.
03-13-2013, 05:13 PM
#46
RE: Are nicads history?
My experience is that Nicads are the most reliable and predictable batteries out there. I used to have several 20 plus year old military surplus 2000 mAH cells that I used for various ground applications. I characterize my battery packs occasionally to see how they are doing and here is a 15 year old Sanyo receiver pack still putting out its rated 600 mAH. Unfortunately, its transmitter mate started a linear voltage decline right away so it is not usable, and I'll have to keep a closer eye on this receiver pack. My experience with metal hydride and lithium based batteries are that they will fail unpredictably, and that they are much more sensitive to improper charging techniques than Nicads. I certainly hope Nicads are not history as this retro-grouch wants to keep using them as well.
03-13-2013, 05:58 PM
#47
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RE: Are nicads history?
Go on ebay and you will find what your looking for. Battery packs either 4.8 or 6.0 come in two sizes double A and sub C. High current drain requires Sub C packs and for everthing else you can run double As. I use nothing but JR battery packs but there are other brands to choose from. Word of advice stay away from batteries made in China.
03-14-2013, 01:54 AM
#49
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RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: Clay Walters
bignasdy,
One of the best things I ever did was to put my wall warts away and purchase a Turnigy Accucell 6 charger from Hobby King. Once I figured it out I find it very easy to change between battery chemistries and do just as you say...put it on and walk away. No more false peaks with Nicd or Nimh and it will charge Lipo and LifePO4 just fine. I've used it for all of those not to mention it also will cycle batteries if you wish and will balance charge the various lipo chemistries. Once you make your settings as per the battery manufacturer's recommendations (printed on the packs usually) you just let it run on Auto and it goes until the battery is fully charged. You can set the time limit for charging, peak voltage, or capacity as limits. I removed the timer limits and set the voltage and capacity. It cuts off when it hits one of those (so far the voltage) and reports how much it put back in and how long it ran. It is modeled after more expensive chargers, uses the same menu but doesn't have the memory or usb port so mine do not store my settings even though the menu indicates it does. I believe they used to include those features but no longer in keeping with the economy pricing. But mine have worked flawlessly.
Clay
bignasdy,
One of the best things I ever did was to put my wall warts away and purchase a Turnigy Accucell 6 charger from Hobby King. Once I figured it out I find it very easy to change between battery chemistries and do just as you say...put it on and walk away. No more false peaks with Nicd or Nimh and it will charge Lipo and LifePO4 just fine. I've used it for all of those not to mention it also will cycle batteries if you wish and will balance charge the various lipo chemistries. Once you make your settings as per the battery manufacturer's recommendations (printed on the packs usually) you just let it run on Auto and it goes until the battery is fully charged. You can set the time limit for charging, peak voltage, or capacity as limits. I removed the timer limits and set the voltage and capacity. It cuts off when it hits one of those (so far the voltage) and reports how much it put back in and how long it ran. It is modeled after more expensive chargers, uses the same menu but doesn't have the memory or usb port so mine do not store my settings even though the menu indicates it does. I believe they used to include those features but no longer in keeping with the economy pricing. But mine have worked flawlessly.
Clay
03-14-2013, 06:51 AM
#50
RE: Are nicads history?
ORIGINAL: flycatch
Go on ebay and you will find what your looking for. Battery packs either 4.8 or 6.0 come in two sizes double A and sub C. High current drain requires Sub C packs and for everthing else you can run double As. I use nothing but JR battery packs but there are other brands to choose from. Word of advice stay away from batteries made in China.
Go on ebay and you will find what your looking for. Battery packs either 4.8 or 6.0 come in two sizes double A and sub C. High current drain requires Sub C packs and for everthing else you can run double As. I use nothing but JR battery packs but there are other brands to choose from. Word of advice stay away from batteries made in China.
Here's a link:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/browse/p...:cp=1/:ip=45/: