Pardon me, if this turns out to be a dumb question. Are brushless motor universal? CouldIuse my 450M brushless motor in my TREX 450 helicopter in T28D Trojan?

Here is the link for 450M Brushless motor...http://www.helidirect.com/align-450m...0m-p-13240.hdx

Thanks

???????? If you go to the bottom of the header bar there is a web site called Watt Flyer. It's one of the better places to ask electric questions and some really nice folks over there. Well worth looking into.
Gene

Thanks. I will check out that forum

Beginners can also get good answers to almost all their questions right here in the beginner forum.

There actually isn't anything about electric motors that would be specific to helicopters or fixed wing or anything. If the specs suit your application, they suit that application as well as any other electric motor with those specs.

And if you want to post in forum that would have really good attendance from electric gurus, RCU has a hundred or maybe a thousand forums dedicated to electric. OK, maybe not quite that many. But they're just down the page on the list of forums.

No reason it wouldn't, just be sure to re-program your controller.  Typically helicopters call for the controller to have a soft start, and a pretty significant pause after shut-down to help save the motor and gears, whereas airplanes don't really benefit from either of those, and you will want more immediate response from the motor.  Other than that, all components will switch over from the heli to the T-28.

That Heli motor in the link is a HIGH KV motor, designed to be used with the gear reduction system inherent in most helis.

If you put it on a plane, the motor will attempt to spin the prop far too fast.

This will mean you'll either have to use a very small prop, resulting in poor performance, or if you attempt to use a standard sized prop, you'll burn out the motor, as the prop will NEVER be able to spin at the speeds being commanded. ( Remember ESC's ALWAYS try to spin the motor at their maximum speed! e.g. KV x voltage = RPM of motor ).

Your only option would be to mount that motor in a gear reduction system, so that the plane could spin a properly sized prop.

If you did that, it would work... but then you'll have to deal with the motor mount and gearing system.

Tower actually has a nice package for both, which I've used with inrunners on various sized motors.

You'll need to keep the motor within it's maximum operating parameters so a Watt meter will also be a MUST.


Do you have a Watt meter?

Opjose: Do you have a link to Tower on that gear box?

CGr

Here are the links for the two parts I recently used for a Keda 38mm 2800KV Inrunner ( 1800 watts! )

The gear drive mates perfectly with the mount... You just buy the appropriately sized gear drive and mount.

The drive comes with a couple of pinion gears so you can vary the reduction amount.



[link=http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXMLK0]Gear Drive - Click me![/link]

[link=http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXLCL5]Mount - Click me![/link]

For something like the above motor, you would want to use the "medium" (28mm) or small, gear drive and mount, then select an appropriate reduction depending upon the voltage.

e.g. if using 11.1v a 3:1 would be fine.

Pretty slick! Thanks.

Wow.. I just re-read your post.. and you did say 1800 watts!! Okey doke..

CGr.

I see that the ad says these will work with the Rimfire outrunners, so there should be no problem using the OP's motor too.

The Rimfires have pretty standard motor mount hole spacing, down to the 300-370 range, where they get into the unusual 3 screw/lob mounts.

Yup... This combo is going into a .60-.90 size plane...

It's a shame people have practically forgotten about gear reduction drives. They are great at helping to keep motors working efficiently and temps and draw lower.

Normally you can spin a larger prop this way, using an electric motor... which is one reason so many of the smaller brushed foamies resort to gearing.

touche
I too did not read the description of the motor thoroughly.  I apologize for the mis-information.

IMO its not worth the trouble gearing the motor unless you love the challenge, theres a lot of cheap motors out there with good quality which were made specifically for planes

All too often people dimiss geared systems out of hand...

With the smaller motors you CAN swing a larger prop with a geared system, making the resulting output equivalent to a larger motor's effect at significantly reduced weight.

That's why my Typhoon 2 came with a geared system, but it still supports a brushless inrunner.

It swings a 13" prop for 3D. The plane can hang on the prop for a good 10+ minutes using a lowly 2200mA battery pack.

Try doing the same with a direct drive system and you'll bog the plane down with a lot of extra weight just to attain the same slow speed 3D performance.

Each has tradeoffs and benefits.

Speaking of that, check this out.

http://www.eurekaaircraft.com/airplanes/babykits.htm

Not a bad price.. a 40 size "pattern" design for small glow or electrics. I'll bet this would be just great with the geared system you are discussing, Opjose.

CGr.

I'd bet that it would work fine, making it a very light plane.


I purchased a Lancair EP from Tower a few years ago. It came with a geared system and a brushed motor and a 1800mAh NiCD battery pack...

I replaced the included motor with a rather tiny Ultrafly 3200KV Outrunner "B" series motor.

The weight savings was amazing, and the power available transformed the plane completely.

The only thing I had to do was change out the motor ( the Ultrafly was a drop-in fit! ), and ESC, then use my existing 2200mA 11.1v LiPo packs.

When I show the components to other EP flyers I often get amazement at the realized performance with such a small motor.
The motor sees very little load due to the gearing.

The geared system has held up well so far. It's too bad they are often so overlooked.

I ordered one of the planes a short time ago. I'll go ahead and get the gear box setup as you suggested. I have several motors/ESC combinations at home that may work out just fine.

I have to see what the weight works out to be so I can properly figure out what to use.. as I said, I have several combinations to use. The only geared setup I've used so far was a brushed gizmo that didn't work well.. it was what came with the particular model and was somewhat lousy quality. That setup you suggested looks pretty solid.

I do have a brushless in-runner that I bought a year or so ago that is brand new. I believe it's a Park 400. It's not a helimotor, though. (notice how I kept within the topic of the OP.. just so I don't get "yelled" at ) I actually have a pair of them, used one in a ducted fan setup that gave me some pretty awsome power.

This ought to be a fun project. Looking at the wing, for instance, it requires something that I've not tried yet... foam core sheeting.

CGr.

I just got an Email back from the manufacturer. He said that the finished product, minus power pack, should be under a pound!!! This sounds like a fun project.

CGr.

If it's that small, you'll probably want a small gearbox setup like this:

[link=http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXHUV9&P=ML]Click me![/link]

That will permit you to utilize a small 400 sized motor, be it brushed or brushless.

The biggest problem is getting the right pinion to match your motor's shaft size.

Note they suggest swinging an 11x4.7 prop with an 8.4v battery pack.

With a small brushless motor you could swing the same or larger using an 11.1v LiPo pack while still keeping the amp draw low.

I prefer brushless... I have to check what I have lying around.

Thanks for the input on the gearbox. That's very helpful.

I have a few two cell and several three cell LiPo packs too. I'm not quite sure about what ESC's I have.

All of this, of course, is speculation based on what the actual weight is. He said that he didn't weight the prototype, was going to do that before he crunched it in.. dumb thumbs.

Once I get the model in, I think I'll start a build thread. Since this is going to involve something new to me.. sheeting a foam core wing, this will be something that I am both looking forward to and looking for "help" in the process.

CGr.

I've picked up a few small foamies that came with gearboxes, ESC's and motors.

Usually I use the included gearbox if I can find a small brushless motor to fit it.... as I did with the Lancair.

It's an interest change of pace.

Well, I have three of those old gearboxes lying around, along with brushed motors that they came with. I wonder if the "bolt" pattern is the same as for a brushless motor?

CGr.

In several of the gear boxes I played with, the bolt pattern was identical.

In one I merely had to oval out the mounting hole for two of the four screws to get a good fit for all four, although only two screws are said to be necessary to mount the smaller motors.

I looked in my "drawer" and found three or four gearboxes. Two are the plastic type that come with ARF's. One is an aluminum gearbox that appears to be of good quality. I can't see any numbers or lables on the thing. I will have to dig out my camera and take a picture of it and put here.

It has a brushed motor bolted to it.

After some talk with some others, it may not be practical for a geared motor on the Baby Trouble Maker.. weight considerations may make it better for a direct drive outrunner.

This gearbox looks to me like it needs a home. So, I am gonna find something to put it on!!!

CGr.