usnretired1997

I am new to place RC. Flew helos though. REALLY want to build a warbird, giant scale. Just to do it and enjoy my down time. With a giant kit like a Zirolli, is it just too agressive a build? I am really good with my hands, tons of tools and computers to research and design.

Just a thought.

Jerry

Appowner

My first inclination is to say, no way! Don't try it. However, I have seen others take on a scale project early in their experience and make it work. So I'll start by asking, what experience with RC airplanes do you have? Include building as well as flying.
Do you understand what make a plane fly? i.e. how the controls make it do what it does?
And just how scale are you looking at? Precision? Stand Off? Or "satisfies me scale"?

It all plays into it.

Hydro Junkie

If you're looking at building something to display, a Ziroli could be a nice display model. IF, however, you plan on actually flying it but have only flown R/C helicopters, you might want to work your way up. Start with a trainer, such as a Sig Kadet Sr kit, and work up from there. Something else to consider is that warbirds are notorious for being aircraft that are very heavy, as far as wing loading. This may mean that you would have to learn to fly with flaps and retracts, just for starters. A large warbird is a large investment as far as time and funds so it would be a shame to see those commodities end up in a garbage can.

red head

Exactly what HYDRO said. Walk before you run ~~ you've sort of walked with the Helo's . Red usnretired 1974.

jester_s1

I'd also suggest ramping up to one of the serious scale kits. Since you've flown helicopters before, you can probably skip the trainer and go to a forgiving sport plane. An Ugly/Ultra Stick or Sig 4 Star are great choices. Get an instructor for your first few flights and have a good time with it. The option is there to build those planes if you want, which are pretty beginner friendly.
Your first warbird should be one of the "sport" warbirds made by Hangar 9 or Phoenix. Those manufacturers, as well as other ARF makers, include a few design compromises to take some of the cantankerousness out of these scale designs and lighten them up a bit. For example, my Phoenix Spitfire has an extended nose so that it won't need extra ballast up front to balance right. It also has a bigger tail than it should and much thicker wings than the original. Sport scale warbirds still will land faster and be harder to recover from stalls with and will still be more heavily loaded than a similar size sport plane. So they are a good middle ground. I'm sure there are some kit producers with similar design compromises if you want to work on building skills while you are at it.
Going to the true scale planes is another step up in both building skills and flying skills. They won't tolerate you pulling too hard on the elevator or getting too slow on a landing approach. They don't glide well if you don't know how to break in and tune your engine properly. They will break if you land too hard. In short, they are designed for experienced pilots who want to compromise practicality for scale fidelity. No beginner is ready for them.

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

I have been flying for many years and I have always owned at least one trainer. They are great for a confidence builder when you have been away for a while, great for after a winter with little or no flying to blow the cobwebs off, sometimes the need for a low stress day at the field and best of all to introduce someone to the hobby on a buddy box. In the mean time you get to learn how to fly and build experience. Don't just fly about without a purpose practice take offs and landings until you can do them perfectly even in adverse conditions. After that practice engine failures at different points in you flight from take offs and landing to altitude dead sticks. Of course any good trainer will allow you to do certain aerobatics. I have a couple of trainer that are well over 20 years old and still fly them off and on at least once a week. Mostly take them out now to introduce kids and adults to the hobby. My two favorites are the Telemaster 40 and an old old original Telemaster 66. The Telemaster 40 has flaps and this will help you get used to using flaps before you need them for your warbird.

You most likely will have to build these from kits so it will give you some experience in building from plans, shaping and forming some parts.

Pick a smaller warbird than the Ziroli something a little lighter and less expensive. I have flown Topflight kits before and they come in smaller and larger versions and use many different motors even convert easily to electric. Stuff like retracts and fiberglass parts are readily available.

Don't discount a warbird arf if all your looking for is to advance your skill set for operating a warbird. They may be a compromise as far as how close to scale they really are but they will give you the experience operating flaps and retracts. Every new operation you add to the flight makes your cockpit busier so having something that you don't have a ton of money or time invested to practice with will make your dream build that much better when it comes to your first flights.

Besides a project like you are contemplating will be an extended build so in the mean time you will be gaining experience and probably meet more than a few others who have already gained the knowledge you will be needing and with luck they most likely be willing to share with you.

Good luck.

Hydro Junkie

Jester, the reason I recommended the Kadet is not so much for the flight instruction but more for the building aspects. The Kadet line of kits are good way to learn the basics of building. The Senior or, for that matter, the Seniorita, would be good to learn on since the plans and instruction books are fairly easy to understand and, more so than some other kits, they are more forgiving when it comes to getting the balance right. This is something that isn't really looked at with a helicopter. If USNR wants to build a warbird, he's going to need to start the learning process with both flying and building large planes. The way I see it, the Senior is more in line with the size he is looking at with a Ziroli, is a little more difficult to build than most of the trainers and, in some cases, sport planes. Most importantly, however, the Senior is easier to adapt to what kind of flying and, what most don't think about, ground handling of the planes he ultimately wants to fly, a scale warbird. I only know of THREE warbirds that aren't tail draggers, the P-38, P-39 and F7F. The only one of those that would be a relatively simple build would be the P-39, considering the other two are twins. Other than that, he's going to need to learn how to fly a tail dragger, something that the Kadet is set up for quite often

Propworn

My Feedback: (3)

Deluxe Telemaster 40 Kit - Hobby Express the manual https://www.manualslib.com/manual/10...xe.html#manual



This by far is the best trainer air frame I have flown. Its designed as a tail dragger with flaps. I have used mine on floats, skis, and large wheels for rough ground. I have towed up gliders, dropped candies for the kids at club events and with flaps and a bit of head wind will land just about vertical which is perfect for club events like spot landings or pass the beans please. I currently am building a new one for night flying as an electric (low noise) with a bunch of leds from superbrights. Colors used will be red white and blue covered in translucent white.

Dennis

speedracerntrixie

My Feedback: (29)

Hydro Junkie

I can see you didn't read my post, at best you skimmed over it. Let me reiterate this so you can understand what I said:
1) USNR want's to build a warbird and has never built an airplane before. A Kadet, be it a Senior or Seniorita, is a harder build than most sport planes and trainers. A majority of those are slab sided, not stick built or rounded like a warbird. The wing is also larger, simulating the size of a Ziroli warbird.
2) Unless USNR builds a P-38, P-39 or F7F, he will need to learn how to handle a tail dragger on the ground. Something the size of a Senior would be better for this as it is similar in size to a Ziroli mentioned in the first post
3) Unless you are now an expert in helicopters, not to mention every other kind of R/C aircraft, you're not exactly up to date on most helicopters being sold. Just about every one I've seen has a preplaced mounting of some sort for batteries, servos and receiver. If it's nitro powered, it has a location for a fuel tank as well. This means helicopters are basically balanced from the manufacturer and only minor trimming is required. A balsa plane has to be totally assembled, thus the balance can be anywhere from right on to needing substantial ballasting for both lengthwise and span wise balance.
4) While the controls on a helicopter work in a similar way to an airplane, IIRC, helicopters generally use mode 1, not mode 2. This means he will either be flying his plane in mode 1, making it virtually impossible for him to get any assistance from an instructor that doesn't fly helicopters or he has to relearn how to fly mode 2. I learned this, first hand, when I ordered my Futaba 9CAP. Had I ordered a 9CHP, it would have been set up for right stick throttle instead of left stick like my 9CAP. Thus, trying to fly a mode 2 aircraft wouldn't be as easy as you make it sound, thus my recommendation of the Kadet.

jester_s1

I think he'll be fine either way. There are plenty of heli pilots that fly mode 2, so maybe that won't be an issue. I think a Stick is as easy to build as a Kadet, although there may not be a detailed instructions book.

speedracerntrixie

My Feedback: (29)

jester_s1

It's hard to focus on the helicopter in the picture with that sweet mullet in the photobomb position!
I'm genuinely impressed with anybody who can fly a helicopter. I tried and just couldn't keep up with what it was doing. I think it would be a lot easier to go from choppers to planks than the other way around.

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Most helicopter pilots make good fixed wing pilots. Not all FW pilots can tame helicopters.

speedracerntrixie

My Feedback: (29)

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Knock it off, you know who you are.

BarracudaHockey

My Feedback: (11)

Next one gets MS for a few weeks.

Appowner

Or look at it another way. You head to the local airport to START flying lessons. Now what bird are you going to strap your butt to for the first time? Cessna 152? P-51? Or that F-16 sitting on the ramp? RC flying runs much the same.

Appowner

Define "a few weeks" please?

Hydro Junkie

I had a thought. When you say you have tons of tools and computers to research and design, just what exactly do you mean?
Are you talking lots of hand tools, power tools or CNC?
Computers to research and design? Are you talking redesigning parts using Autocad(or similar) or just looking up scale details?

Appowner

Exactly! I've been told I'm good with my hands but I can also make a three legged stool wobble!

Hydro Junkie

I've learned, over the years, that for every good stool someone builds, there are at least two that are garbage. Has nothing to do with the materials or builder, just the way they turn out.

Appowner

No! Trust me. I can make it wobble.