All right, after much talk I've decided I'm going to either order a kit or an ARF and just get it together this winter and learn how to fly next year. The models that have been suggested to me are the Sig Kadet LT-40 and the Goldberg Eagle 2, either of which seem to be nice planes. So for my first question I am wondering if anybody has good/bad thoughts on either of those planes.

For my second question, what would be the best engine to get for either of these planes?? I was looking at both the OS .40 LA and the Thunder Tiger Pro .46 (which has also been recommended as a good powerful, yet fairly cheap engine). I've heard a lot of good things about OS, and from what I've seen its a real popular engine, but I'd still like feedback on both of these engines to see which one would be better for me.

Sort of a question: does anyone have any input on the Futaba 4YF radio, its a little more expensive than I could spend on a radio, but it might be worth it.. The servos it comes with on tower are S3004 servos, which I'd imagine are nice, but that is one thing I know absolutely nothing about is servos, so can anyone offer any input on those servos also??

One more question: Without a field box all the tower "needed accessories" come to a little under a hundred dollars, does this sound about right?? I'll make my own field box because I can do that for real cheap, and am trying to tighten all the edges on spending here. So far the whole plane including radio, engine, and all other stuff comes to about $393.49 w/ everything... about $40 cheaper if i build the kit instead (speaking of which, I don't think i need all the building accessories for the ARF, am I correct in assuming this... building accessories meaning glue epoxy all the pins and all that)

As long as you have all winter, I would recommend getting a kit. Either of the two you have in mind are excellent.

I would avoid the OS 40LA. While OS does make some outstanding engines, the LA Series is weak. Take a look at the TT .46 Pro or this one:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=153

They are only a few bucks more than the OS, but MUCH better.

You will still need Glues, drills razors blades, etc. for an AFR, but there will be a few more building tools required for a kit. If you can improvise, you won't HAVE to buy everything.

Same goes for a flight box. Start with fuel, and a glow driver, and the guys at the field will help you with the rest until you can get a few birthday presents.

Thats what I was thinking too, since I'm going to be in all winter not flying I could probably build a kit, but there is also the small problem of time constraints. I ski, and am in school, so the only time I'm actually home is after school monday through wednesday, monday through friday all day is school, thursday is school sponsored skiing, then the weekend is me and a few friends up at the mountain. I payed a little under $400 for a season pass, and will not under any circumstances let them cheat me out of money, so I feel I must ski at least 3 times a week Thanks for the tip on the engine, now i'll know to look at a different one instead. Im seriously considering a kit though, and I was looking through the suggested accessories thing, and do I really need thin and medium CA, and 6 and 30 minute epoxy?? Those two extra bottles cost $13, and it doesn't seem like a lot until you realize how little money you have, and how hard it is to get decent money at my age. I'm also looking at that horizon engine, it looks pretty good (of course then again I wouldn't know) and at $80 its not overly expensive (will have to pay shipping on it though, so I might end up going with the TT)


Now for some serious cost cutting I'm gunna look through tower and see what I do/don't need, and if i can get what I do need for cheaper (for example I can save $1 on rubber bands alone )

Look at this web site www.gmsengines.com for a nice engine for your trainer. You can get a GMS .47 for 75.00 shipped to you. I ordered a .76 for my 4*60 and it is a nice engine.

Rick

More than one modeler has faced the winter with a plane (kit) and found out it was July before it was 'almost' complete.

But if you stick with it (building some each day - every day) I think you will enjoy the hobby that much more.

The total cost you projected sounds about right - there is always 'next year' to buy something extra

Let us know what your decision is/was and if you have any questions, please feel free to contact this group!

Jerry

I can tell you my opinion. Beware though, Crashem sent me a PM saying that I was a 2 month expert. So my advice may be warranted useless.

But..

I got the LT 40 and I like it a lot. I can't speak for the other plane. I have absolutely no complaints with it except that it will not roll that easy. You have to baby it with the elevator.

I got the Evo .46 NT. I am very happy with it. Then again it is the only engine I've had so I have nothing to compare it to. But I can tell you that is more than plenty enough engine for me with the LT 40. It MOVES!

I got a Futaba 4exa. I am very happy with it. The price is right for a computer radio. I would at least check it out.

The LT 40 was an ARF, but it was still fun to put together. The wings and fuse were build and covered. The rest has to be put together.

Again, this info can be warranted useless because I have only been in the hobby for a few months...

Good Luck,

Wings

I just got started and was kinda in the same boat as you. I don't have a lot of time. Do I want to learn how to build, or fly? I got a Hangar 9 Xtra Easy 2 for $379 and it comes 99% built (takes about an hour to build), and includes a Evolution .46 engine installed, and a JR 421 radio. I still had to get fuel, fuel pump, and glow starter, but that was it. The time I'd have spent building a kit I can now spend deer hunting, ice fishing, and flying my plane. Then again, I didn't save any money or time in the long run. I got hooked, and am now building another so I still had to buy all the tools & glue & stuff, but it's all good... - Joe

Welcome aboard, Skitchen.

Your planes are good choices, I think highly of the LT40. Others have had good luck with the Eagle II, though the only one I ever saw was less impressive than the LT40's at my club.

Your engine choices are fine. If you keep an eye on the literature, there will be a sale on .46 size engines this winter or spring, notice the prices so you'll recognize a real bargain.

There will also be a good deal on flightline sets. Keep your eyes open for a field box and the assorted stuff to go on sale as a set. You have plenty of time.

I wish I hadn't taken advantage of ALL the big bargains I ever saw.... but that's another story.

Good luck!
Dave Olson

The biggest thing if your going to build is to build it straight, make sure you have a good flat building surface and a straight edge. Most of all have fun and welcome to the hobby!!!

Thanks for the input everyone, although so far the only mixed input is about whether to buy kit or ARF. I'd like to build, but as twostroke was alluding too, everything has to be perfect or I waste a lot of money just do dig a hole in the ground. Regarding the xtra easy: does the radio that comes with it have a buddy cord plug that is compatible with Futaba?? The club I plan to learn with I have been told flies mostly with futaba radio's, and the owner expressed a thought to me that if I'm going to get a glow plane and want to learn from them I might want to look into a futaba to make it easier on me and the club.

From what I've heard the LT-40 is a good plane, and from what i've heard sig is a real good name too, the only reason I like the Eagle II is because its a little bit cheaper. Im gunna reprice everything with the LT-40 and see what kind of money that is looking at. Right now I'm thinking that I will have enough time over the winter, and if it doesn't get done immediately that leaves me with more time to save up money and buy better things for it, and maybe look into a computer radio for it too. I hope to be able to buy the plane, get everything done on it so I can save up a lot of money, and then buy the engine and radio at the same time and hopefully be able to fly as soon as possible next year.

One major thing I've thought about when thinking about buying a kit is covering. From what I read there are so many tips and tricks to it and it sounds like a fairly hard thing to do, and to get right. I know if I screw up covering and a piece comes loose there's a real good chance a lot more pieces will come loose when it hits the ground. Plus I've also heard bad things bout hinging the elevators and ailerons and all that, and with so many things I could screw up on I'm almost scared to build it myself.

One last thing to add, I recently saw that the Tower radio's are compatible with buddy cords, now just to see if they are compatible with futaba radio's.

No, the Xtra Easy has a JR computer radio with it. It's not compatible with Fubuta. Building is good anyways. I can fly, and not build, but building my Ultra Stick 40 is keeping me off the streets, and gives me something cheap and harmless to cuss at.. It was way fun to get the Xtra Easy and fly right away though. Instant gratification and all that. As for getting a radio. Go cheap, or go big. I'd say go cheap for the first plane. That way you won't do what I did. Xtra Easy came with a 5 channel JR computer radio. Then I bought a 6 JR computer radio with FMS simulator and interface to practice with. Also a $10 buddy cable so I'd have the entire setup to learn on. Well, I bought the Ultra Stick 40 for my 2nd plane, and guess what? I need at least a 7 channel radio to take advantage of all it's features. So now I'm looking at a 3rd computer radio. If I had it to do again I'd buy cheap. Cheap trainer, radio, etc... Then after I knew how to fly, and knew what fit in at the local club, I'd go high class. Trying to buy a bunch of cool stuff, when you don't know what cool is yet, doesn't work. Have fun sir! - Joe

All ARF's a different. But the LT 40 ARF will require you to install all the hinges. It really isn't hard though. You just put the hinges in the slots, get it lined up then you add the glue last and the hinges soak the glue up. If you are careful you will have no problem.

I want to build my first kit over the winter also. I got the LT 40 as a ARF for two reasons. I wanted to get some flying time before it got cold (I got it in the beginning of Oct). And, like you I thought it had to be perfect in order to fly right. I want to emphasis that I don't claim to be an expert so take what I am telling you with a grain of salt. I think everything has to be pretty close, but not perfect. No plane is perfect that's why we have trims.

I, like you, am worried about covering it. I am not worried about it flying right, I am worried about it looking like crap when I'm done. I think if you get it attached good you shouldn't have a problem with it all coming off.

If I were buying the LT 40 now (November) and know what I know now, I would have went with the kit. But you mentioned you are getting mixed feedback. I think that is totally a personal preference you should decide what is best for you.

I love my LT 40, but I would be much more proud of it if I had build it.

The best of luck to you,

Wings,

You will do just fine building a kit. The sig LT-40 kit is pretty easy to build.
Dont know about the eagle 2. I built my first kit when i was eleven and it
turned out great.Kits now days are very easy to build compared to the
early 70'S. Dont let the task scare you a way from building cause its not
hard and it is very rewarding to see a kit come to life. Just rember if
you decide to go with a kit that this RCU site will help you through the
process. What ever you decide enjoy the moment.

I started with an RTF. Unless you feel you are a capable builder and have a good work bench, lots of space, and perhaps some advice from an experienced builder, I would recommend an ARF. There is still a bit of work to do with many of them, but at least you can have some degree of confidence that it is straight.

This way, wen you are learning, you don't have to wonder if you are having a problem because of your skills, the trim, or the plane being build crooked.

My two cents.

If you have an expereinced builder to guide you, go for the kit.

A couple things to think about. Buying a kit and the stuff needed to build it will begin to come close to the cost of an ARF. (Price the kit, add in a couple of rolls of covering at $12.00 to $15.00 per roll.) You'll eventually need the tools, the glue, the covering iron and heat gun anyway, so don't even count those.

Next, consider that as a newbie, the ARF will take you close to 40 hours to complete, while the kit could take 200 to 250 easily. With the schedule you described, if you (realistically) only spend 4 to 6 hours per week, that's 6 to 8 weeks for the ARF, but it's over 30 weeks for the kit. (Yes, more than 6 months.)

Now, if you watch, there are RTF's (with engine and radio) available once in awhile, in the $250 to $280 range, and I'm guessing you can get the needed field equipment for about $75. So you're looking at $225 to $250.

Another option; seeing that you're already in touch with a club, ask them if they have an annual auction or swap shop, or if they know of any in the area. Used equipment can usually be had at good prices, and for your trainer, new won't be new for long anyway. I helped a kid find a real nice used trainer (LT 40) with a TT 42 (I think it was), complete with 4 channel radio equipment all for $150. There were only two real problems with the equipment. One, the plane was covered in PINK and white ([X(]), and the radio gear was JR. (We use Futaba/Hitec almost exclusively.) BUT, I convinced the club member to let the kid keep a second JR transmitter to use as a buddy box while learning (along with the cord), with the understanding that the kid would give it back after he soloed.

There are many options available that will save you time and money. Just don't jump too quickly.

Good luck,
Dennis-

I agree with aeajr. Make your first one an ARF of RTF. You're going to have a decent amount of work to do just getting one assembled, balanced, radio & servos set up, etc. And while I also agree with Wings, you will be much prouder of the plane if you build it yourself, you will also be much that much more heartbroken if you crash it beyond repair. My $0.02 is to kit build your second or third aircraft, after you are a little more confident of your abilities.

Heck guys, the way the trainer kits are made today - you almost have to TRY and mess up! I'll still say he will be further along if he goes with a kit.

Jerry

I thought you just got an ARF? That one with all the cool stuff on it.

Wings, yep....but I'll take a kit over an ARF anyday.....well almost anyday :-)

Jerry

I agree: 200 to 250 hrs is not likely. Darn qutoes like that will scare anybody
away form a kit. We got a 12 yr old youngester in our club that built the LT-40
kit in less than 3 weeks and it looks good and flyies great and yes it was his
first kit and he did have some club help(Very little club help) He didnt
have anyyyy major problems and is as proud as a pecock. LOL

First off I'm not a skilled flyer but I've owned four planes and crashed them all. No clubs out where I used to live but now I live in Spokane so I'm going to get back into RC and learn to fly. But I've built two planes and owned two ARF's. The ARF's were some kinda plastic yellow cub, stalled while someone else was flying it on it's second flight and a tower .40 trainer ARF, ok but to heavy, then I built a GP some kinda symetrical wing plan, almost learned to fly it at a club then moved and crashed it later by myself, finally built a lazy bee, squirrely little bastrd, crash! My view on ARF's is that I don't really like them because the ones I've owned were to heavy and flew poorly. I just want to tell you that you don't need to invest much more than 40 hours or so in building a trainer. Build it straight but don't worry if it's a work of art, will probably take some lumps, Covering is easy if you cover with the idea that your going to bang it up and it will still look good. I like building planes and will be building a real trainer soon. LT-25 is what I'm thinking of.

I built the LT-40 as my first plane from a kit and it came out great. If I can go it so can you. Not nearly as hard as it seems. Great choice for a trainer also. The LT-40 is a real floater too. Had some engine problems with mine and got so good at dead sticks I almost had to relearn to land under power. Point is that plane is so easy to fly and build. I would go with the 46 engine because the 40 is just a little small for that large wing on takeoffs.

I say get an ARF most of the trainers that are out there are very good. I have had about 5 ARF planes and have had no trouble with them at all. They are built as good ar better than I could build them. I still think the best thing you could do is visit your local club. Someone there will have a used trainer that you can get cheap. We have trainers come up for sale all of the time. I just sold a new tower trainer 60 size plane that I got in a trade. I sold the plane ready to fly with a Thunder Tigre 61 and an airtronics 6 channel radio for 200 dollars. Club swap meets are great places to get stuff. I got a 7 channel Futaba radio for 25.00 at one. It was a older radio but came with everything plus 8 servo's. I still use it today. Do yourself a favor and visit a club.

Rick

And I repeat, if you have all winter, why buy an ARF that will be built in one or two weekends and then sit around all winter? As far as the ease of trainer kits, I once built a Goldberg Eagle II in one week. My son was visiting so I took the week off from work. We opened the box on Saturday, and flew the plane the following Friday.

ARF's are great if you're in a hurry, or just don't have the time or ability to build, but building is SO much more rewarding.

I agree with MinnFlyer. If you have all winter, build a kit. IF/when you crash you will have the plans and ability to make necessary repairs. You will appreciate the end result much more than with an ARF and you will learn a lot in the process.

I built a kit last winter and have been flying it this summer. It recently suffered a structural set back requiring a rebuild of the wing. To finish out the season, and while I am waiting on the wing kit to arrive, I bought an ARF (Hobbico Superstar) it took me no more than 10 hours to put it together. It went together well, but the quality of the wood and covering leave alot to be desired. Also, it would not have been so easy if I had not built a kit.

If you have the time, build a kit. There are plenty available that are relativly easy builds. Such as the SIG LT-40, and any Goldberg model.

If you run into trouble or have any questions, there are many people here that will help you.

Victor