Ace-Maker

Hello I am brand new to the world of RC and would like to get into Airplanes. I especially would like to build/fly WWII replicas like the P51 Mustang. [hr]

Any suggestions on a good place to start?

What is a good beginner plane that I can get started with? [8D]

Fastsky

Hi, its great that you are asking questions before you buy anything! Some beginner facts for you: RC airplanes trainer airplanes weigh around 5-6 lbs. and fly around 40 mph. This means that you need lots of airspace away from cars/houses/people and you will need a decent sized runway to takeoff/land. This means that you should find an RC club and go visit them. You can find one by phoneing the local RC stores that sell RC airplanes and asking them for contact numbers. Find the closest club and see when you can get out for a visit. Some club instructors may prefer a specific brand trainer and radio so its best to visit before you buy anything. Some clubs even have a club trainer that you try flying for a flight or 2 to see if you really like it before you spend your money. Training on a buddy box is the safest and most common way to learn and will save your plane dozens of times while you learn how to fly. Training is also free when you join the RC club so its well worth it. So my advise, visit an RC club before you do anything else. [8D]

rwright142

Welcome!

First tip: Heed Fastsky's advice!

I have only been in the hobby for a few months and have seen a lot of new people jump right in and want to fly right away. Take your time. I will save you money and you will learn more. Join a club.

With a club and an instructor you will learn to fly, but more importantly, you will leard to fly safe.

Best wishes!

britbrat

Follow what Fastsky said --- to the letter!

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

Don't buy that hanger9 p51 trainer junk, either. Get a real trainer, and learn to fly. I've been flying for quite a while now, and have 7 planes in my hanger. Two are warbirds. One T-6 that I built from a kit, and snapped on maiden--have to rebuild the firewall. Another is the Dinaflite PT 19 kit with 90 inch wingspan. I can proficiently fly just about any sport mode out there--including a lot of biplanes. However, warbirds are another story. I'm getting training on the PT 19 so that I don't end up crashing it. Moral of the story--fly, fly, fly, before you even think about warbirds. Then, get help with your first warbird or you'll be replacing it.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

Like Fastsky said, "Find a club." !!!

Warbirds have a bad reputation that they don't deserve. It's the model, not the type. A good warbird will fly like any other sport plane if done right. But, that's for your second or third airplane. It's still quite a ways down the road. If you really want to, go ahead and buy the one you want. I recommend a kit. It will give an understanding that will help in repairs and in many other ways. (do NOT try to fly it until you've been trained!)

For your trainer, take a look at the "duraplanes" type. You can smack the h*ll out of those things and repairs are fast and cheap. You can't say that about any other trainer.

BTW, the P51 is an excellent airplane. If you stay away from cheap, imported arf's! Check out the Top Flite kits.

Ace-Maker

Thanks FaskSky (and everyone else) for your excelent advice..

There are a couple hobby shops here in the area. I'll give them a visit and ask some questions about any local clubs I could join.

I see that it could be some time before I'm getting my "dream" plane but I'll be better off not destroying them in the learning process...[:@]

Then again I could still get my "dream" plane/s and at least assemble/paint them so that I get the experience.

[hr]
A side note:

I am experienced with fiberglass and have even thrown up the idea of completely building my own plane from scratch (A BIG ONE)
Any good resources I could use for such a project?

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

Jeesh,
I have to disagree with Ptulmer,
Top flight kits are definitely not for the first time builder, and warbirds are (by type) harder to fly than other sport models. Sure, the sport arfs are a little easier to control, but true warbirds built scale from a kit are a handful. With polyhedral wings swept to a short chord on the end, they can be tough to fly slow. The outter, thinner portion of the wing tends to stall first, causing the dreaded tip stall everyone talks about. This doesn't even mention the poor ground handeling of most warbirds. Remember, the planes these things were modeled after were inherently unstable. They had to be to pull off the stunts they had to in order to survive the air to air, and close ground support missions they were designed for. Warbirds--leave them alone for a while. Learn to fly proficiently, then learn to fly a low wing proficiently, then learn to ground-handle a tail dragger proficiently. Then, have someone help you with your first warbird.

Of course, there is no law against you going out and getting a P51 right now, and putting it into the air. But, it won't last long, and you'll be disappointed, and probably out of the hobby as fast as you got in.

BTW, the whole "hanger9 p51 trainer junk" statement from my previous post was directed at your screen name. Maybe it's a coincidence, and that is perfectly fine, and I appologize for it. but, I'm thinking maybe you're a rep from H9 trying to sell your new product.....
Just curious--those guys hang out here too, you know...

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

2slow, you want a hard warbird kit, get a PICA! The new "gold edition" kits are a huge step forward. I would not have specified those if it was too much. It's not quick to build any warbird kit. If he starts it now, it would be ready about the same time he is!
As far as how hard it is to fly... you remind me of the ad with a rock w/insignia and engine. You can't make a 100% scale model of anything fly good. The good manufacturers take that into account. I wouldn't include any cheap, foreign made ARF in that category. Another good one was Midwest. Their ME109 was an excellent flier and took about a week to frame up.

P51, check out the composites forum here on RCU for more info on making a fiberglass airplane. And you can download the Top Flite P-51 manual here to see if it's what you want.
http://www.top-flite.com/manuals/topa0110-manual.pdf

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

It's not the time involved with the top flight kits that would make it difficult for a first timer, it's the lack of instructions. They assume that you know enough to fill in lots of gaps. Top flight has a reputation of being one of the harder kits to build (of the average, "everyday" kits). I've built two of them, a contender and an AT-6. The contender was easy, the warbird was not. that is my experience personally.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

I have to wonder since you keep calling them "top flight". Maybe you are buying a different brand. The FW190 ain't missing anything. I also don't believe in talking down to other people. Since he's got experience with 'glass, I assume he's pretty handy with tools and wants an exciting building experience. Sticks and other similar kits are enjoyable, but if that's not what you want...don't build it. If you can follow instructions and ask questions, you can build just about any kit out there. (except the big PICA's!)

I do have to wonder about the rather inappropiate use of smileys in P51's last post.

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

Maybe I'm buying a different brand. I can post pictures of both planes that I've built that are top FLITE (sorry to confuse you). Sometimes my instinctive spelling gets in the way of brand names. Is that all you got? I'm out of this shouting match. Go ahead and get a warbird and get her in the air. I'm sure they are as easy to fly as my sticks and contender, I'm just a sorry pilot and can't handle one yet. Don't worry, though, someday maybe I'll match up to the standards.
There are a couple of forums for first time pilots who fly warbirds. One is called warbirds and warplanes, and the other is called crash and discussion.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

?Is what all I've got?
I'm not shouting at or with anybody. I just don't believe in discouraging people. I also don't believe I'm better than others. Experience with model airplanes isn't all that important to building your first model. Whether it's a warbird or trainer. There are many skills required by many different hobbies/professions that can be brought to the workbench. 2slow, your experience with the Top Flite kits would be valuable, but you never said whether it was an old kit or the new "gold edition" kits. That is an important difference! They were updated with better cutting and instructions. Isn't that what you complained about?

BTW, I never said anything about your piloting skills. Your remarks were immature and misleading. I'll repeat it for you though, build a model while you are training. Simple enough? That way, when you reach a level of proficiency, you can fly it. I stayed on a trainer for about a month. Then moved on. The most important thing is the support that a club and instructor will give you for both. Having an experienced flier make the maiden flight on your second airplane and trim it out can make all the difference.

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

This is what I would consider sarcastic and inmature. If you didn't mean it that way, then I appologize. both of the top flite kits I've built were gold editions. The contender wasn't hard at all. The Texan, on the other hand, was terrible. However, had I have built the Texan with fixed trailing edge and fixed gear, it probably would have been a no-brainer. When you get into flaps (especially the split flaps on the Texan) and retracts, instructions start getting very vague. I'm not for one second saying that I'm any better of a builder than anyone else. I just know that if the Top Flite Gold edition warbird that I built would have been my first attpemt, it would definitely have been my last. I'm pretty good with tools and working with my hands--always have been. Thinkgs don't tend to intimidate me. However, these instructions were misleading, confusing, and missing a bunch of information. I would recommend building an easier kit at first just to get the hang of building over plans, terminology, and so on. Also, it would be a plane that he could fly as soon as it was finished--like a four star. If he buys a trainer, and flies it while building the four star 40, all of the stuff (radio, motor, etc) out of the trainer could go right into the four star. He'd be out just the money on the kit and have a great little low wing, tail dragger trainer. Then, he'd be getting valuable experience flying that, while at the same time have honed some of his building skills--time to tackle a warbird. Just my opinion. I know some people are impatient (I'm kind of that way myself), but jumping in over one's head is not the way to build longevity in this hobby. Like I said, if the Texan would have been my first kit, it would have been my last as well. I will most likely build another kit at some time in the future (I now have more planes than I really need). I will also entertain ARF's as well when appropriate.

Ace-Maker

Wow I didn't realize there was going to be a war in this thread?[sm=punching.gif]

Regardless, this forum seems to be a pretty good resource for model airplanes.

Here, I'll lay down on the table what I would "like" to be able to do someday.

I eventually would like to build my own hangar. [link=http://www.mooneymite.com/concreteaug2003/night-hangar.jpg]Hangar example[/link]
And fill it with a whole military aeronautical arsenal.

Build Wish List:
[link=http://www.acepilots.com/planes/helldiver.html]SB2C[/link] - Curtiss's "beastly" Dive Bomber
[link=http://www.acepilots.com/planes/b25.html]B-25 Mitchell[/link] - Doolittle Raid on Tokyo

[link=http://www.acepilots.com/planes/p51_mustang.html]P-51 Mustang[/link] - The Best Fighter of WWII
[link=http://www.acepilots.com/planes/p38_lightning.html]Lockheed P-38 Lightning[/link] - The Fork-Tailed Devil

[link=http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/ac-130u-19990803ac130a.jpg]AC-130U[/link] <<- This one I want to build from scratch myself out of Fiberglass with a 12 foot wingspan. (I know this is a bit crazy sounding but I want to do it.) With a working cargo door and possibly also be able to drop a tank w/drag shute in low ground flight ([link=http://fromtheinside.us/multi-media/videos/AirdropMishaps1.wmv]Video[/link] <-blooper reel but still gives you the idea.).
Many others too lengthy to list.

I also was a bit puzzled by this post?

rjm1982

And as far as the Hanger 9 P51 PTS (trainer)...give it a try...again,

as its not been released yet....unless is already august and i missed my alarm clock for 30-someodd days...

Buy what you want...and learn on it...short of jets and pattern ships, you can learn on anything...it just might take longer...

Find a club if possible, and an instructor if possible...if not, be safe and take your time..and be ready to make repairs and replace stuff...im not being negative, just saying that if you cant find an instructor, thats ok, but you will probably break stuff more (which is part of learning anyways)

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

I don't start wars. however, I do have experience that beginners do not. Just trying to be the voice of reason, that is all. I'll take your post for what it's worth.


BTW, I believe that he could learn on a good jet or pattern ship--seems like the way to go to me. P51-on-the-horizon, buy yourself something real nice. Dont worry about how hard it will be to fly, because that will come later. Don't mess with those ugly old trainers, I don't know why they are around anymore anyhow. they have no use in our hobby. Forget everything I've said, because I know nothing. I will not be negative anymore--buy what you want and fly it. I'm sure you'll find an able and willing body to spend the hours, and hours, and hours it will take to learn how to take off and land that big beautiful doll!

rjm1982

Voice of reason?
...


and btw, i watched that 4* post...

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

2slow, in the distant past, either top flite went by top flight or there was another brand. Or, I saw a misspelling on ebay. I wasn't being sarcastic, and didn't know I was in a "war". And please note that I'm not saying to fly the warbird before he's capable. Look's like a pretty long list of "I wants". I say get started as soon as possible. The four-star would be a terrific plane. As mad as you are/were, we agree on that. But, you can also use an instructor on the warbird to get used to it AFTER flying the trainer for many,many hours. If you joined the club, he's a flying buddy by now.
It sounds like your experience with the stuff in the Top Flite boxes was pretty good, but there wasn't enough support for the aftermarket stuff. That's pretty similar to what I saw in the FW190. Of course, alot of help can be found here and at a local club.

P51, the winking smiley looked a little like you were just repeating what we said in a mocking manner. If that's not what you meant.... well, why else would you wink?
That's a pretty big list you got there! That's several years worth of work. Have fun with it! If you really want to make some long term finishes, check out www.airfieldmodels.com for info on fiberglassing. I know you're familiar with the stuff, but he's got some pretty good methods there for making a light weight fiberglass finish.

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

ptulmer
I was unaware of the top flite/top flight issue. I think we can agree on most issues, and agree to disagree on others. No harm/no foul. I'm cool....

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

Ok, hold on guys. Before we continue, let me make a comment or two...

P-51, While it's true that some Manufacturer's kits are easier to build than others, it is ALSO true that some airplane designs are easier to build than others.

If you have the desire to build (As opposed to flying ARF's) I would suggest that you start building a Trainer now. Later, you can build an advanced trainer, and eventually, you can build anything you want - including that beautiful Mustang (My dad was Crew Chief on a P-51, so it's my favorite too)

But just as more advanced designs are harder to fly, they are also harder to build. Plus, there are skills and techniques in building that you will need to learn, and practice before you become proficient at them. There's no point in building that "Dream Plane" now if it's going to come out all crooked and wrinkly.

So start building - A Sig Kadet LT-40 is an excellent place to start. Get those building skills honed, and then start thinking about that dream plane!

Fastsky

I agree with Minn, the LT40 is one of the better trainers for lots of reasons. The kit is quality and the instructions are first rate. They assume that you know nothing about building and walks you through it step by step. It has pictures of the parts you need as you go along and the parts are also labeled. It even eplains things like what glue to use where, and why. You check off numbered instructions as you go along so you know where you left off. The plane is big but light enough to fly on a 40 size engine. The size makes it easy to tell exactly what the plane is doing at all times. It also has the best ground handlying of any trainer I have had experience with. It flys gentle and will land at a walk when you get low on fuel. Sport planes or 3d type planes have general instructions such as "now install the fuel tank". It is assumed that you learned how to install the fuel tank fittings and fuel clunk and pack foam around the tank from when you built your trainer so the instructions won't even mention that part. The same goes for other things such as the servo tray. Flyers that "don't want to bother" building their trainer miss out on a lot of basic knowlege because of this and if the plane needs minor repairs or adjustments they are "stuck" as to how to proceed. Leave building a warbird until your third kit and by then you "may" be ready for it![8D]

kerrydel

My Feedback: (2)

I'll second that about the LT 40 instructions (it was my first plane). There's a lot of good info in them, and they go beyond most others. Most kits just say something to the effect of "cover the plane however you like", and "use the appropriate hinges". The LT 40 kit gives tips on how to use iron-on covering, and how to install CA hinges"

Kerry

Edit: Forgot to say, don't let the flame war going on discourage you. Most people around here are very helpful.

ptulmer

My Feedback: (5)

No flame war that I see. Just a discussion. If my communication skills lack, you must forgive me. But, in my defense, most instruction manuals that I've seen tell you what glue to use and where. Covering instructions come with the covering and there are other places to get that info. Including asking here. The first kit I built was one of the most difficult kits I've put together. It didn't put me off or give me too much trouble.
IF someone wants to build their trainer from a kit, they will get alot of great experience from it. It's not that much easier than building any other good kit though. Just less sanding and shaping. They build quick and get you into the air. You also get a really bad case of the jitters when you fly your first kit built airplane. Better to get that out of the way.

If you haven't guessed yet, I really believe what I say and am NOT trying to anger anybody. To make it simple- If you're patient enough to build the trainer, do it! It's good experience and you'll be proud of your efforts when it's making circles over your head. If you are NOT that patient, go ahead and find a GOOD kit that you want to build. I know several guys that build and never fly.(they simply don't care about flying) If you want to build something, do it! If you want to build and fly, give the trainer kit serious thought. That's the best starting place. But no two people are alike. You just gotta decide for yourself.

SoonerAce

My Feedback: (1)

The LT 40 kit gave me a great start in RC. It also helped that I had built it and knew how to rebuild it when it kissed the ground abit too hard on more than one occassion. I have moved on to more challenging kits, and have yet to touch an ARF. Nothing wrong with them, just not my personal favorite. I have gleaned volumes of great information from RCU, as well as the older members of my club. I have been in the addiction for abit over one year and have currently 12 planes at my disposal. 5 of them will be built in the next two years. I just completed an Goldberg Ultimate 10-300 Bipe and will Maiden it within the Month, I regularly fly a Kadet 40LT, a Swizzlestick, a Uproar 40, and a Patty Wagstaff 300L Extra. Oh and BTW, I too love the Warbirds and one of the 5 to be built is a 1/5th scale TopFlite Gold Edition P51D Mustang! It will be an awesome bird, when Im ready for it!