Hello, I have been looking around at planes, for about a week, And first I decided to get a 300 dollar wood plane, but I do not want to spend that much money and crash it write away. Im asking anyone to help me in my search, I want an electric plane that can do some tricks, Right now I have about 230.00 dollars, Can you guys please help, thanks. And I really don't like foam that much but if you reccomend one then I might want to change my mind.

I have foun an airplane called the Hobbico SuperStar EP ARF w/Ailerons 48.75" from this site http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXGVZ3&P=ML , but I would need help because i dont know what to get for the required componenets, If you can help me please respond.

So you want to crash a $230 electric plane?

Find a local club. Go watch them fly. Talk to the members. Find one that flies electrics. Find an instructor before you fly. Its not as easy as it looks the first time out.

As for what you need vs what you may want in the future, the list goes on and on.

If you must fly without any instruction, consider one of the Hobbyzone Park Flyers. The Firebird II and the Aerobird series are good flyers, but they don't deal well with wind, control is pretty limited, and they still crash with beginners. Initial investment is RTF for $125-$175.

Read through this forum. There is PLENTY of advice already given on how to get started.

Good Luck
Brad

"So you want to crash a $230 electric plane? " -- Yes, im sure thats exactly what he wants to do...great detective skills there...

You can say, "It would be wise to get an instructer" without being a ***** about it....

Sorry. Not trying to be a p***k, merely trying to use a little humor to point out that going electric is not going cheap.

Reading the reviews, I'm not sure I'd recommend this for a trainer. While electric motors are reliable (little worry about dead-sticking), from an instructors point of view, having the power of a glow-engine when getting out of trouble is a plus. You'll notice that the list price of $109.00 for the plane does not include the radio gear, so tack on another $125.00. Add a second battery, a quick field charger, and you're in the $300 range. And its Balsa, just like the glow versions. Flight times on the battery look like 6-10 minutes, depending on your use of throttle. Then you have a delay time to recharge batteries or replace batteries.

If you want a Balsa Trainer, I'd recommend the Hanger 9 Alpha Trainer RTF. At $289, it comes with everything you need, except fuel, glow starter, and chicken stick. The Evolution engine runs reliably, and will tick over with the flywheel installed at 1500 rpm, making landing easier. When carefully assembled, it flys with almost no trim adjustment. With the glow powered plane, you'll get more flying time (10-12 minutes per tank, few minutes to refuel). I had a student last night with the Alpha trainer, and he found it very easy and calm, even with some pretty significant thermals around the field. But of course, glow powered planes are noisier and you have to clean the gunk off the plane when your done. The alpha trainer is also larger than the Superstar, making it easier to see.

If you want to go cheaper but have a very durable plane, and have a few basic skills, try building a Spad Debonair (www.spadtothebone.com). Its a simple build, but the plane flies incredibly well, and its built like a sherman tank. With a 60" wing span, its larger than the Superstar, so again its easier to see. Cost of plastic and accessories can have you in the air, but again its going to run close to $300 (Plastic is cheap, but things like landing gear, and other startup stuff build up). I learned on the Debonair, and it survived many hard landings, a couple meetings with trees, and a couple cartwheels. On the plus side, when I purchased my plastic, I had enough left over for 3 more planes.

Hopefully you find this helpful.

Brad

Test dummy:--- As stated above , go to a local club and just watch and visit with the folks there. They will be more help then you can imagine and you SHOULD go to them for help learning to fly or it's going to cost you a lot more then the $300.
Take your time and do it right, VISIT A CLUB. ENJOY !!! RED

the local club might have a member willing to sell some used equipment to you cheap for flying

IMO here... dont bother with the electric... by the time you get the battery pack... the gear box the speed controll and the motor you coulda bought a glow engine and been 10X happier...

get the kadet LT 25 (or the lt 40 depends how much space you have to play with) its a easy building plane thats sturdy... VERY sturdy... and total if you get a cheap radio you not looking at that much money here... maybe 300-350 but the electrics gonna be about the same once you get all the radio for that too... burnt nitro is just a nice way to start the morning though...

and yes... i would recomend a trainer at the risk of invoking rjm1982 's wrath...

also if you go to the clubs some 1 there may be willing to sell you their handmydown plane with radio cheap esp if you dont have ne grand expectations of flying ne thing with retracts soon

Why is it that every time someone posts to this forum saying they want to learn with an electric a few people feel they need to help them see the error of their ways and convince them that glow is the only way to go? For those who haven't noticed, electrics are here to stay. Many of them have as much power as a glow plane. If you doubt this, take a look at some of the top levels of aerobatic competition to see what people are running. Flight times are also comparable, as long as one picks the right motor/battery combination.

As for the assertion that a glow engine powered plane inherently has enough power to get out of trouble, I have several things to say. First, a good instructor will teach students how to stay out of such situations. Second, it's just as easy to end up with an underpowered glow plane as an underpowered electric. And finally, overpowered planes allow too many students to develop sloppy flying habits because they fail to learn the concept of flying on the wing. Students should be taught on low powered planes so they learn about maintaining airspeed rather than having the plane follow the prop around.

Edit: in case anyone thinks I'm one of those lekker bigots, there's 6 flyable planes in my shop right now, 8 ARFs waiting to be assembled, and 15 kits waiting to be built. Of these, only 1 is an electric. Oh, I've also got somewhere around 25 engines.

I agree. However, in the process, students sometimes get themselves in situations where the instructor needs the power to get them out of trouble, particularly as they advance in their training, such as working on setting up for approaches, learning how to recover from a stall, or simply losing perspective on the plane. I don't think anyone said the electric was bad. I and others were simply pointing out some comparative advantages and disadvantages.

As for the top level aerobatic competitions, I'd be remiss if I recommended a beginner shell out the resources necessary to obtain that level of performance.

Again I agree. That's why I first teach students to fly the plane at half throttle or less. Enough air speed to keep the plane up without stalling, but slow enough that the plane doesn't behave badly when there's too much stick. At the same time, I keep the instructors box at about 3/4 throttle. When I have to take the plane back from the student for what ever reason, it immediately powers up. Once they've managed to learn to control the plane, then we work on throttle management.

I think the primary advantage of glow over electric for beginners is the size of the plane. A larger plane is easier to see, and in general they tend to react a little slower. Cost over the life of the planes is probably comparable when you factor in fuel costs vs batteries.

So its back to my initial recommendation. Visit a club. You'll learn more in a couple hours than you will trying to sort through the multiple, varied, and justified opinions found here.

Brad

Thanks for the advice but i still want to start with an electric plane, once my plane arrives I will start saving up for a gas one if im good at flying, Thanks Again

You want to start for $250 and get into the hobby????. I'm new to the hobby and have already spent over $900. Simulator, plane (which I crashed already) repairs, fuel, etc. and I'm still learning. My advice..... get an instructor and learn the basics first.

test dummy.... When I started, I was going with the electrics because of $$$$...
But after adding what I needed to match the Glow... I went with the glow....
Good luck on your choice.... And the main thing.... have fun!!

I bought the superstar EP RTF(no ail.) for the grandson.... Still have it... You
will learn on it.....But it's not the eaisest... And flt. times are not that long with
stock setup....

Test... I posted the above without reading all.... It'll go good... But I agree...
Find a club.... You can never have too much help and assistance + deals!!
Have fun and keep us updated!!

Here area some options - Easily within your budget

RTF

If you are going to try and teach yourself, foam and plastic is a better choice than wood. These are great flyers, can do some simple aerobatics, are easy to fly and both have great glides so you can fly them very slowly. Later if you want, you can hop them up with bigger motors, batteries, etc.

T-Hawk - RTF - Excellent Value - $170 -
Add a third battery pack for about $25
Comes with extra wing, tail and battery
Flies well and stands up to hard landings
Can be flown on 27 MHz or 72 MHz
http://www.toytx.com/thawk3chrtf.html
T-Hawk - Without Radio - add your radio and receiver
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/wittran.html
T-Hawk Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...ighlight=THawk
Videos
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawkvideos.html


Easy Star - RTF - $180 -
Add two 7 cell battery packs for about $50 total.
Believe this goes easily back in the box to keep in the car
Super tough foam. Comes with 72 MHz radio in the US.
Good parkflyer and a good glider
Radio in RTF package can be used to fly other planes
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240025.asp
Easy Star - ARF - Add you own radio gear
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240009.asp
Discussion Thread on Easy Star
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=258656
Video - touch and gos
http://plawner.org/video/easygo.wmv
Video - Testing the plane's behavior
http://plawner.org/video/easystar.wmv



FOUR CHANNEL AILERON TRAINERS - ARF and Kits + Computer radio, batteries and charger. Over your budget, but a better investment.

If you feel confident, you can start with one of these. The Smooth-E has two wings available and would make a great wood kit trainer. You would need a radio to go with it.


Magpie - with both wing kits - $55
Easy to build Foam kit -
Has trainer wing AND and aileron sport wing
Master the first, then advance to the second.
They offer a complete package with both wings and all the electroncis for $160
http://www.mountainmodels.com/magpie.php
discussion threads
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...51#post3502851
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...=SmoothE+build
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...51#post3502851
Video - slow fly wing
http://www.mountainmodels.com/Magpie.wmv
Sport wing
http://www.mountainmodels.com/MagpieSP.wmv

SmoothE - $50
Easy to build Balsa and foam
4 channel aileron trainer
http://www.mountainmodels.com/smoothe.php
Discussion Threads
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...=SmoothE+build
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...&page=19&pp=15
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=276761
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=295225
Funny video
http://www.mountainmodels.com/SmoothEsmall.WMV

Models Dandy Sport - $45
http://www.mountainmodels.com/dandysport.php
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=295225
Complete Package $155
Video
http://www.mountainmodels.com/ds1.wmv

GWS E-starter 400 - Simple Foam Kit - $50
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_inf...roducts_id=551
Available as a ARF complete package kit with radio - $150
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_inf...roducts_id=611

GWS Tiger Moth 400 - Simple Foam Kit - $70
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_inf...roducts_id=203
Complete kit including Radio - $175
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_inf...roducts_id=658
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=345
Video
http://67.18.81.100/rcuvideos/magazi...345/TM400m.wmv


If you go the kit/ARF path, you will need a radio - here are some good starter computer radio set-ups that would be approrpiate for these planes.


Futaba EXAS -
http://www.futaba-rc.com/radios/futk55.html
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...=LXJUV7**&P=ML
review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/a...article_id=556
6 channels, 6-model memory, Prop Flaps on ch 6, Flapperon using 1/6, 1 user
defined mix. The particular package I have listed at tower comes with micro
servos and receiver suitable for parkflyers

Airtronics VG 6000
http://www.airtronics.net/VG6000.htm
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...I=LXEUY5**&P=7
This particular package is very attractive for small electrics. Comes with two
small servos and a 20 amp ESC. 6 channels, 4 model memories, 6 standard
mixes, no user definable mix capability listed. I can't find any info on the
range of the receiver in this package so I must assume it is around 1000 feet.
Suitable for low speed parkflyers.

Low cost DC peak battery charger - $20
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Shop/ByC...ProdID=HBZ1026
HobbyZone Peak Charger for 4-7 cells from 300 mah to 1.2 Amps.
Plugs in to car cig lighter/power port

Two batteries, about $25 each. = $50

$50 + 20 + 160 +$50 = $290 approx, depending on combo of options. But you have a much better and reusable computer radio system.

Just some options.

Electric is fine to learn on. If you wanna do electric, starting simple and light may be your best bet. A stock GWS Pico Moth or Pico Cub flown over some very high grass in calm conditions(like 3ft) will hold up very well and buy you time to learn the concepts of flight and control of flight. When you perfect your skills then you can start flying over hard surfaces like pavement, ball diamonds, or short grass. Once you master this Plane you can step up into a larger GWS Tiger Moth 400, or PT-17 which is a 4 channel Plane, and flys more similar to larger 4 channel nitro powered Planes. If something along these lines interest you, you can either look at these at Tower Hobbies www.towerhobbies.com or www.gwsexpert.com
Good luck on whatever you decide to go with!

Something else to think about is what kind of flying you want to do. If you realy want to fly and advance in your skills then I sugest staying away from the small park flyers. And this is IMO.

The smaller the plane the less it is able to handle the wind. That's not to say that a large plane feels no effects, but 8-10mph to a small park flyer is a gail-force. A larger plane can fly and you can learn how to adjust for it. Ive flown Aerobirds and a scout and faced the frustration. But a did a few minutes on a LT-40 that a friend had in some decent wind and it was actually fun.

Again, IMO sometimes the parkflyers make better second planes than first ones.

I know the Aerobird/Scout setup is quite different from the standard elevator and rudder setup but the weight and wing load concept is the same.

Also, I disagree with the runtime statements abot electrics. Many electric planes large and small can get up to 15-20 minute realistic flying. (Hotdogging aside.)

I don't think electric vs. glow is really the issue here, the issue is what kind of electric. From your statement, you're wanting to buy one of those cheap foamies, with an underpowered electric motor on the front, that wouldn't fly in any wind over five mph, and probably won't fly very good in any condition. Those "cheap" electric foamies are mostly that--cheap and electric. My brother started out with one, and, a year later, I'd dare say most of us would still have a hard time flying that POS. Now, if you're wanting to get a nice four channel (or three) trainer with a good sized electric motor to learn on, then that's another story. I still think balsa is the way to go. If you really want electric, get a balsa kit or arf, and convert it to electric. You'll be better off in the long run. Balsa can be fixed, re-built, and so on. Foam usually becomes unfixable over time--especially if it gets crushed.
JMO

There are a million different ways to get started. $230 is barely enough to get started with decent equipment. Cost of repairs, club dues, etc will drive up the cost even higher very quickly. Think about buying a computer simulator first. It will save you money in the long run. Simple Plastic Airplanes Designs has foam electrics, and plastic designs that are the absolute cheapest way to go. Especially if you can get good used equipment at a local flying field. I taught myself to fly with a Cox . 049 on a two channel trainer glider, and landed in the weeds that were 5 feet high so the plane never hit the ground. I eventually moved on to joining a club and using an instructor with buddy box. Most of the cheap electric trainers will not last long enough to learn to fly. Stay away from the Lithium batteries. If charged improperly or damaged, causing an internal short, they can catch fire and burn down you car or house. IT HAS HAPPENED. In addition, if you discharge them too low, just one time, they are ruined. The absolute best way to learn is get to a regular flying field, somebody will help you.

Lithium Batteries come in two sorts, Lithium Ion (L-ion) and Lithium Polymer (Li-Poly, LiPo). The Lithium Ion batteries can be prone to overheating and exploding if not watched and monitored carefully. But it's usually the fault of improper charging or a lax approach. This is due to their being held in an organic solvent and it is flammable.

LiPoly batteries are in a solid polymer composite. The solid polymer (electrolyte) isn't flammable and aren't as dangerous if mishandled. There is also something to the way the cell is built that makes them more stable but I forget what that is.

I often see the "sky is falling" Lithium comments and think them a bit over the top. It's just like handling nitro fuel htere are safetey precautions to take. Not that I am doing a smack-down on former spad I just though this info pertinant.

I mention the dangers of Lithium batteries just as a safety consideration. I had several electric planes with lithium batteries, but quit using them after having to kick one out of the garage because it went off like a smoke bomb and caught fire. It had crash damage, and when I squeezed it to remove it from the plane, it shorted out internally. If it had gone off while still in the back seat of my car, the car would have burned down. Lithium batteries do have the best power to weight, and are very popular, but people new to the hobby must be informed about proper handling and charging techniques to minimize the danger.

Which type of Lithium was if off-hand?

I won't mention the brand name, it was the folded foil type.

I think you need to study up on this subject a bit more. Both Lithium Ion and Poly can, and have, caused fires. The "sky is falling" comments are entirely justified. If you were one of the people who had a plane burn up, or even worse, your automobile, shop, or entire house, I don't think you'd be dismissing the warnings so quickly.

If he wants to get into gas then I think I saw a add in the for sale forums that I think will suite him well.
This one:http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemId=127799 , is 150 bux and is pretty much RTF plane. he will need to make a trip to teh hobby store after consulting his club instructor.
It includes 1 tower hobbies trainer
1 full radio system
1 os 40 engine
1 hangar 9 starter
1 great planes glow plug liter
1 hangar 9 fuel pump

these are all good brands and appear in the pics still in there original wrapings. the seller has good rateings and is willing to box all this up and ship it.
I would be buying all this if I didn't allready have it, LOL.
He is still gona need a props (2 just in case you need a new one at the field), glow plugs (plural, 2 or more), a lawn mower battery (small 12v for the starter) , teh all important fuel, and a flight tote box to pull it all together.
fuel=15 bux
tote box=15-20 bux for kit, 40-50 for RTU ( go with the kit, it no take long to build)
props (10x5's probably)=6 buxs apeice x2
glow plugs=2 buxs per plug x2
battery= [&:] uhhh im not shure but it will probably be around 10-40 bux depending on brand and size. just remember, you have to cart all this out to the field so choose wisely.

What ya all think? it should get him alot of what he needs at a good price i think its inside of his price range.

P.S. I just noticed he will need fuel tubeing, a couple feet should suffice.

How are we doing? Do you feel you are getting the info you need? Have you made any decisions yet?

We must have scared him off.