Hello, most of you will probably think me crazy for asking this but I am looking into buying a rc plane (i have never had one before) Would it be possible to fly any of these GreatPlanes airplanes for a first plane?
1. Piper J-3 Cub 20 Size
2. T-Craft .20 Kit
3. Cessna 182 Skylane ARF

I am familiar with airplane dynamics and do very well on sims. I do well in other radio control hobbys as well.

If any of you think this is impossible and I should get a trainer first, which ones are recomended?
Thanks!

Possible yes? recommended No.

You will get more enjoyment if you learn on a plane that is designed for that specific purpose! Just my .02

I agree with Crashem.....and make sure you get help!!! A trainer won't last long (about 10 seconds, actually) if you try to fly it without experienced help!!

Mike

Dont know what a T-craft is but the piper and Cessna are really nice scale planes (also expensive) and learning on these can be risky i really wouldnt want to crash one of those planes and id never get the guts to have my first landing with a Cessna.
Having a trainer allows you to get the basics of flying wihtout much difficulty. And youll hear this 100 times get an instructor i couldnt even imagine me flying without someone to help me trim and take control when i get to far or in the sun, etc..

Welcome to the hobby/sport/drug/disease, whatever, so far in my 2 months in RC flying its been a blast already got to 2 planes cant even fly one.

Papa

What do you guys think of this tower hobbies trainer, http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXJA29&P=0 or is there a better one you would recommend?
Thanks!

There are so many good trainers and so many times has the Post What Trainer should I Get gone buy in RCU. (Do i search ill youll find alot of information). Im not sure what size and kit/ARF you want but from your post you probably want a .40 kit. The Tower kit is nice but its not as good as it looks read the requirements in the tech notes and ull see why its only $50. Ive heard great things about the tower trainer but ive also heard great things about Eagle 2, PT-40, and the Kadet LT-40. In the ARFs great review on the Avistar and Tiger trainer. My first plane was the Kadet LT-40 and i highly suggest this plane. Although it is slightly more expensive than most trainer it comes with everything so u dont have to buy anything extra for your plane accept covering, building tools etc..
I had no building experience at all with anything and was able to build this kit very well. It has a huge manual that gives a picture at almost every step. The Kadet flew very smoothly and was easy to control. I used a .40 LA on it which flew it very well but there was no added power (That can be good and bad on a trainer).
As a first plane pick up a trainer learn to fly then go on to your prize beauty plane like the Cessna (Very nice plane) and the Piper (Also nice).

Hope this helps,

Papa

The Avistar might be the one for you. It has the trike gear which is helpfull for takeoff and landing, it has a semi semetrical airfoil so it is aerobatically capable (flat bottomed wings fall out of the sky when you go inverted),

Best of all, it is a quality plane for low bucks. Covered in real Monocoat, not some cheap junky covering, so it will be tougher, easyer to fix, and will look a lot better for a longer time. the only thing you will need to do is reenforce the main landing gear. After a few landings the tail tends to sag. It is a fantastic trainer that thinks it is a sport plane. perfect for an advanced beginner.

PS. Go for a good .46 engine. 40 is barely enough for most "40 sized" planes. you will be glad you did. take offs are easy, tuning is more forgiving..... Far better to use throtle or prop choice to controll speed, than to limit engine size. My favorites are Irvine and OS. A little more expensive than the rest, but keep in mind it may end up on 2 or 3 planes over its life time, amd there is nothing more frustrating than an engine that dies a lot or delivers inconsistent power.

Good luck and welcome to the greatest sport in the galaxy!

spiff

Porsche, are you more interested in a kit or an ARF?

For a trainer I dont really care if its a ARF or Kit but for my 2nd one I'd prefer it to be a kit.

I looked at all the planes you guys suggested and the one PaPa-NeGeorgeo said sounds the best.

The combo for the kit, engine and radio is $268
PaPa-NeGeorgeo is this the same kit you are talking about?
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXFG11&P=7

Also one more general question: If I am planning to have a gas plane for my 2nd kit I should get a gas trainer right? not an electric one?
Thanks for all your guys help.

I got an LT-40 trainer for Christmas. I've never flown, or built a plane ever, but I've read the manuel 4 times front to back, and it seems to explain each step very thoroughly!

First of all thats the plane im talking about, its not the nicest looking plane but it flies so smooth for a beginner and builds really nice (Most pieces are already shaped ie leading edge elevator airleons etc..)
I really suggest getting a kit over an ARF for a trainer for many reasons.
1) Cheaper
2) You learn so much from building a kit and it will definetly help you if u plan to build the Piper as a second plane. (Or if you want to go with a Top flite Cessna.
3) It gives you a reason to be proud of your plane. (with an ARF you can say i can fly an RC, with a kit you can say i can build/fly an RC). It also gives you an understanding of the aerodynamics of the plane.

Im not sure but by gas do you mean glow?

If so i would suggest getting a glow trainer like ones i suggested. My opinion id probably alot of people would agree with me (some might not) but glow planes are just overall better planes theyre bigger faster and run for longer periods of time.

If your a little short on cash and not sure if this is the hobby for you go with the OS .40 LA engine and 4 channel radio.
I wouldnt suggest getting i cheap engine because they can just get plain annoying OS is a good manufactuer. If you got a little more spending money and know this is our hobby i would go with a .40 FX the LA will fly the trainer very nice but theres no added power and a FX will be nice to transfer to your sport plane of whatever. A .46 LA will be ok to and a little cheaper the FX.
For the radio Futaba is usually the best for beginners for the simple fact that everyone has it and hooking up a buddy box to it wouldnt be a problem.


Hope this helps,

Papa

P.S. Most of these points are my suggestions and opinions some people will agree some people wont. I personally have all these items and ive been very happy with all of them.

Papa makes a lot of good points however he is in correct on a few points.


ARF vs Kit

1 Cheaper

This is incorrect when you factor in the cost of all the items required to build and finish the kit the kit will typically be more expensive then the ARF. (I'm not advocating ARF over Kits)

2 but glow planes are just overall better planes theyre bigger faster and run for longer periods of time.

The glow/electric planes of the same TYPE are comparable in terms of performance and flight duration. (Cost is another matter high performance electric plans are more expensive in some respects and require expensive support equipment i.e. extra batteries chargers cyclers etc..)
Let your budget and taste determine what type of power plant to use.

3 For the radio Futaba is usually the best for beginners for the simple fact that everyone has it and hooking up a buddy box to it wouldnt be a problem.

Your choice of radio should be influenced by what brands are most popular at the club you plan on training at UNLESS you purchase your own buddy box and cord..

Engine choice - this is not so cut and dry. as I see it there are two schools of thought.

1 Buy a cheaper engine like the OS .40 LA or TT GP-.42 with the clear understanding that it will be used on your trainer and your next plane will require another engine. The pros are saving a few bucks initially and possibly in the event of a mishap while learning only destroying/damaging a less expensive engine

2 Buy a more expensive engine that can be used in your second third etc plane, Like a OS .46FX or TT.46 Pro or Saito .56
Pros you initially cost outlay can be spread over multiple planes.

My Opinion- I factor into the cost of every plane I own the cost of both an engine and Flight pak. I do this simply because I find it a pain to swap components.

Your choice of equipment should also be weighed agianst your desire to be in this hobby. If you think this might be fun but aren't sure if you will stick with it buying economy radio and engine will limit your cash exposure. If you feel confident that this is something that you will stick with buying more expensive radio gear and engines may limit the need to trade up between trainer and second or third plane.


Hope this doesn't confuse you more then help
Also remember to take this and other posts for what it is opinion.
I remember a couple of months ago when Papa was asking some of the very same question himself

Crashem one thing is that if you read Porche's post he says he wants to build a kit as a second plane. All tools can be used on both planes which means getting the tools now and building the kit as a first plane will give him the education and tools needed on building his scale beauty that he wants. When you compare two ARFs to two kits and tools i think the kits come out a little cheaper. (If you have some normal tools drill screw driver ruler it should)
A TT engine is good value for your money and if you might not stay in this hobby for that long this can be a good engine. But for the extra $$$ its worth getting a better engine like an OS, Irvine, Super T, Cox, etc..
By the way like Crashem said about 3 months ago i didnt know a thing aobut this hobby (thanks to RCU) ive learned alot. GO back and youll see my stupid questions. lol

Thanks, I have a couple more questions,
do you think it would be the extra $30 to upgrade from this Tower Radio http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...1p?&I=LXJB50** to this Futaba radio? http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...1p?&I=LXVW08**

Also what is a buddy box?

Buy as much radio as you can afford if you think you will stay with the hobby. If not it really doesn't matter. Having a radio with exponential really helps the beginner with the tendency to overcontrol as it softens the control feel around center. Particularly useful on landing. Look at the Hitec radios as they give more for the money invested. The receivers are compatable with Futaba if you get a better radio (transmitter) later and the servos can be used as well.

A buddy box is a second transmitter that is linked by a cable to the transmitting radio. Control is given to the student and can be taken back when the student gets into trouble. The problem with some buddy box systems is the main transmitter may have expo however the buddy box doesn't which makes it bad for the student. I fly a computer radio and the buddy box just gives the control inputs to the student. All mixes and settings come from the transmitting radio.

All the plane choices you had in the orignal post are good ones. I would recommend a larger craft however as the smaller "tail draggers" can be a handful on the ground. I did have one student with the 20 size cub and it is a rather large plane for the size engine. It would fly for half an hour on 4 oz of fuel.

EXCAP232

Would putting a O.S. .46 ( http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXBY20 ) engine in the Kadet LT-40 ( http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXFG11&P=0 ) be recomendable so I could use it in the piper for my second plane?

Or would the .46 be to powerfull for the trainer? The Kadet says for the engine to be a .30-.40 2-stroke or .40-.50 4-stroke Engine

A .46 LA would be more then recommened from my point of view you will be able to put on a larger prop 11-6 which would generate more power. For a trainer a would just get a 2-stroke, 4-stroke are really pricey.

So you think the .46 would be just fine on the trainer? I wouldn't have any trouble controlling it or anything?

Make sure you have an instructor to help you out and make sure the CG is in the right place and it will fly great.

Whats CG, Sorry for my stupid questions

CG is center of gravity, or balance point. It controlls how the plane sits in the air. If you get the ballance right it will take off and land much easier, and general flight will be much better. The book always makes a suggestion fo right ballance point, but more often than not, the book is specifying a slightly nose heavy condition. For most planes best flight is achieved having a CG moved a tiny bit farther back than the book suggests. The rule is, make it like the book says, try it, tweek it a little, try it again.. you instructor may be able to guide you.

I teach with an irvine 53 powered Avistar. We fly around half throttle most of the time, suprizingly the big motor at half throttle gets 25 minutes or more. i don't actually recommend the 53 for your first plane, but it sure is a heck of a lot of fun to run that stick up all the way watch her go! Too much is just enough!

I have built a couple kits. in my experience they have not been cheaper than the ARFs, they take a very long time, and mine don't turn out as well as ARFs. Do what makes you happy. the only reason to build is because you enjoy it, and lots of people do, but most of us are flying ARFs, there is a reason for that.


PS thats not a stupid question. Airplanes are complicated, and there is a lot of unusuall language to learn

Spaceman Spiff, I second everything you just said.

Find a club and hook up with a trainer.

Bill

Thanks Red,

I second what you said too!

c-g ceter of gravity