I've been doing this for about a month with the ultimate goal of flying a Corsair. Currently I'm flying an Astro Trainer, before I can fly the wings off it I would like to find a low wing trainer to practice with on my way to the Corsair. The porblem is I haven't been able to find one. Any suggestions?

TIA
Maiden Voyage

I think the best first low-wing airplane is the Goldberg Tiger II or Tiger 60. I know of no other plane that is so easy to fly, yet is a low-wing. I have often thought that a student could use one as a first trainer. Of course, you should still have an instuctor with you until you solo.

A regular high-wing trainer is still going to be your best bet as your first airplane though.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ho2zoo
[B]I think the best first low-wing airplane is the Goldberg Tiger II or Tiger 60. I know of no other plane that is so easy to fly, yet is a low-wing. I have often thought that a student could use one as a first trainer. Of course, you should still have an instuctor with you until you solo.



I'll go along with a Tiger 60. Keep this in mind. Choos your engine for the Tiger that you may want to use in your Corsair. Can save you a little $$$$$$$

I went from a Sig LT40 to a Phoenix Scanner you can see on this page

http://www.djgadget.com/dubairc/revi...es/phoenix.htm

I personal don't see what the big deal is, at least the low wing goes were you point it.

The scanner is a 46 size plane and only 150 bucks here in Australia very cheap plane and flys very well....

TIGER 60 with a .91 4stroker! Gonna have 3 of these flying in our club very soon all with .91 4 strokers.

MV,

You might want to add a Sig 4 Star 60 to your list of planes to consider. Low stall speed, reasonably aerobatic, and you get the tailwheel to boot. I don't have any experience with the Tiger 60, but I've been told it's similar.

Larry

Thanks for the inputs, I'll check em out.

I would recommend a SIG 4 Star 60. You can build it or buy an ARF and it has great recovery and slow speed characteristics.

If there is one thing I can't understand, its the itty bitty steps people take with this hobby. I personally went from a Tower 40 Trainer to a GP Extra 300 40 and never had a day of problems.

BUT. I did have another person with me to take it up on its first run. I did have that same person there to guide me throught he first number of flights, and I did spend a stupid amount of time with the flight sims to get the thumbs for the speed.

Where am I at now you may ask. Well, I'm just about ready to get my TF P-51 60 up in the air. The Extra had an unfortunate battle with the neighbors K9 so, I'm repairing the wing right now but the trainer has the skies on it, and its seeing a lot of sky.

After about 6 flights with the Extra I was well on my way. Its an easy plane to fly (watch the throws though and don't put a huge engine in it). Its a great feeling to fly something that you know you will have for a long time and can't wait to try something new with. I'm not going to say that my step was for everybody but talk to the people at the club and see what they think. It is a hobby and it is your money. Do with it as you wish.

If you're working your way up to a Corsair, why not consider the GP Corsair 40? It's basically a sport plane disguised as a scale ship but it will challenge you a little more than a Tiger or 4*.
Those planes are truly great designs but they are so easy to fly that you probably won't be whole lot closer to flying a scale Corsair than when you've completely mastered your trainer.

By "itty-bitty" I assume you mean beginner, intermediate, advanced?

Gee, what a waste of time.

MinnFlyer: Your sarcasim is noted, but that wasn't what I was trying to bring out in the topic. I think most with an opinion have flown the high wing trainer, the low wing trainer, the extra's and probably a few things beyond. In the circle I fly with, there are very few people that build low wing trainers due to the simple fact that for MOST people, the second step isn't needed. A low wing trainer is a beginner plane, A extra is an intermediate to advanced depending on what you do with it.
With my personal experiance, people that buy the low wing trainer after having a high wing one are quite dissapointed and really wish they had made a bigger step. Once again, I say, this is not for everyone but I find that it is for most people 35 and below. We played a lot more nintendo
There are also the people that come out and are flying there high wing with a instructor for 3 months and still haven't figured it out. Thats great, these people have an amazing amount of vigilance and the fact is that ey are having as much fun as any of us. For these people, maybe a second beginner plane is needed.

The only reason I really even said anything is that most poeple I know that have gone this route consider it a waste of money and time because they are bored of the thing after 5 flights.

Dig it: point taken. I have also considered skipping the low wing trainer in lew of something a bit more aggressive, but being new to flying I felt it was a question worth asking especially since my wife is also interested (she wants to shoot for a P51) and hasn't played anywhere close to the computer games I have

Thanks everyone for your experienced inputs.
MV

Maiden Voyage: Let me also say this. I don't know where you live but a low wing trainer is an excellent plane to take out for a first flight of the day. If you crash the thing after you have a couple other planes, who cares. Another thing you could do with a plane such as that in the long run is put floats on it for at the lake or skies in the winter. A plane that you can not care about is a good thing and if your wife is getting into it as well, it might be the better idea to have a couple of easier to fly aircraft around, as one of you may make a mistake. I probably won't every buy a low wing trainer but I will build a scale Cessna one of these days, just to put floats on it. The hobby is what you want and what you make it. Above all else, have fun, and if you want to take the long road, so be it, it is, afterall, your road.

I think Dig it needs to try hovering lol.

Just to set the record straight, someone suggested a Great Planes Corsair. Great Planes actually makes 2 entirely different Corsairs, one an ARF and the other a kit. I'm sure the person who made the suggestion was refering to the kit, which is a relatively tame warbird. The ARF version tho, is NOT for the beginner (or for the experienced, in my opinion). It has a much higher wing loading, even higher than the larger Top Flight 60 size Corsairs.
But, my first pick would be the Sig 4*40, which was I learned to fly with.

Another 2 cents worth for the intermediate level trainer, if that's what we want to call it. They don't have to be boring. The 4* and Tiger can teach a lot about flying, and still not bite too quickly.
As well as the small steps, you learn something with each one that is useful at the next one.

Your mileage may vary.

Larry

I would just like to mention that I enjoy all types of R/C flying. I have been flying for 14 years now and my favorite plane is my Pica 1/6 scale Spitfire. Looks so cool on a high speed pass. I also have a VQ Zero that I started flying last fall. I have been teaching R/C for the last ten years too, and that never gets boring.

But sometimes I take my Goldberg Eagle II Trainer out for the day. Oh, my gosh, not a simple, boring, Trainer ! How dull! No, not at all. It's very relaxing. I never worry about dead-sticks, cause it will just float on down. I can slow it down and almost make it hover in a headwind. It's always a blast to fly it inverted or a knife-edge. Plus if there's an interested observer there, I plug in the buddy box and let him give it a try.

So I say, keep your trainer! All R/C is fun!

(BTW- I'm 42. Not just some old fart who don't know better. At least I think so. )

Absolutely...I've not flown the ARF version but I know that I have never heard or read one good thing about it...

BTW, I suggested the GP Corsair not becuase I think flying a trainer or anything else is boring but becuase I think it would be a great way to get on the fast track to your ultimate goal, which I believe is flying scale warbirds. The GP Corsair kit would be a great second plane with minimal coaching for the first few flights, mainly getting used to orientation issues and getting used to the higher speed.
I myself fly several different kinds of planes ranging from scale, to a Soarstar park flyer and my original 15 year old PT-40 trainer. It's good to have planes for every mood.

Sorry, i didn't mean to be sarcastic...

Ok, yes I did, but I didn't mean to be rude.

I agree that the Nintendo generation has a big advantage over non hand/eye coordinated individuals, but there are still many of those who don't have the skills (let's face it, not ALL 25yr olds play Nintendo)

I a perfect world here's how I see the learning curve:

Trainer: A high, flat-bottom wing plane. This is generally the most stable platform. The wing provides a lot of lift so that the plane can fly slowly to give the novice more reaction time, and the high wing means that the plane is "bottom heavy" so it tends to want to fly straight and level.

With this plane the student learns straight and level flight, basic turns, flying toward yourself (when some controls are reversed), Flying a rectangle around the field, and eventually, take-offs and landings. They can even start to try some loops.

Advanced Trainer (or Intermediate): Now we have (typically) a high, or shoulder wing with a semi-symmetrical airfoil (there are a few low wing intermediate trainers also, but they are still INTERMEDIATE TRAINERS). This plane is faster than a trainer, and more capable of basic aerobatics.

With this plane, the student learns basic aerobatics, i.e., loops, rolls, stall turns, inverted flight, split-S, etc.. plus, he (or she) learns to take-off and land with a hotter plane.

Advanced: Once you have MASTERED the two previous planes, the choice is yours. Do you want to fly Pattern? If so, go out and get a BEGINNING Pattern plane, or a BEGINNING War Bird, or whatever.

If you wanted to fly TOC planes, would you (after mastering your intermediate trainer) go out and spend $5000 on the Type of thing that Chip Hyde flies? I don't think so.

There are steps ALL along the way. Some can be skipped, and some can not. What can be skipped is as individual as the person learning.

So when I give advice, I try not to assume that the person I'm talking to has my abilities. If I did, I would say something stupid like:

"Don't waste your time with a trainer, because I find them boring".

MinnFlyer,

Your post was excellent!

As one who is looking for my 2nd plane I found your descriptions informative and now I have a good idea of what I want next but more importantly, why.

Thank you,
CyberPilot

Maiden Voyage,

Many, many years ago my first low wing was a 60 sized Koas. You can still find them around today and let me tell ya, this plane is gentle in turns and landings, or just about as hot as you want it to be, therefore, it'll grow with you.

The Kaos is not one of the easiest kits to build, but done right it's a great transitional plane from high to low wing.

The Sun Fli V also falls into this category. (both planes by BRIDI)

ED

MinnFlyer:

Well, ok fine. I tell you what, I'm pritty dam sure that you have more experiance in this field than I do, so I'm going to step aside and say your correct.

At the root, I think we are along the same lines with a slight wave on the definition of a few things. The method I was taught was different than the one you were and etc etc. So be it.

All I hope is that everyone enjoys what they are flyin. I mean, hey, thats what its all about right.

Now, I'm going to the engine thread to see if someone can't help me out.

Everyone is taught differently. What works for some may not work for others. And no two people have the same learning curve. I had one (1) student that soloed his first day out. I also know fliers that have been in the hobby for 20+ years and still need a buddy box.

If I tell 10 people to get a trainer, followed by an intermediate plane, probably one of them will tire of the trainer quickly. Does that mean I was wrong about telling him to go that route? The other 9 guys would say "no".

I'm not trying to be a smart *****, I'm just trying to keep most beginners out of trouble. At my club, we keep a Club Trainer on hand that we let newbies try. If they're really good and pick it up quickly, I usually tell them to start with an intermediate trainer. But every case is different, so in a forum like RCU, it's unwise to make blanket statements regarding how quickly someone should progress. We don't have a "trainer" here to see how quickly someone will pick it up. So I would rather err on the side of safety than tell someone to get a plane that is more advanced than he is ready for.

MinnFlyer, You hit the nail on thead! Some people can skip steps, but most shouldn't or can't as you have pointed out. I progressed through levels of planes and am glad I did. When I instruct, I lay these steps so that people know which way to go. Some people fly their trainer until it is ragged (lots of stick time) therfore they can skip a level. Others want to move more quickly and progess through more levels of planes. I just remember seeing a brand new (2nd flight) SIG Cap 231EX come out of the air because of an inexperienced pilot that wouldn't listen to others. The money this guy lost in 15 seconds could have bought several intermediate planes that may still be around. Like you said every one is different.