what about these?
08-13-2009 | 11:31 AM
#1
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From: green bay,
WI
what about these?
what does everyone have to say about super tigre engines? I have the chance to get a brand new .61 size 2 stroke for super cheap.
08-13-2009 | 11:57 AM
#2
RE: what about these?
I have a couple of GS-40's that have been good performers, and have seen the .61's which seem to be good engines also. Reliable and easy to start. I've found if you ditch that sock overweight power robbing muffler and go with a Macs muffler they run a whole lot better. Macs mufflers are well worth the extra expense!
Which version of the .61 do you have? Ringed or ABC? Follow their break-in instructions, especially if its a ringed engine.
Hogflyer
Which version of the .61 do you have? Ringed or ABC? Follow their break-in instructions, especially if its a ringed engine.
Hogflyer
08-13-2009 | 11:59 AM
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From: Nottingham,
PA
RE: what about these?
I've read good things about them, but never owned one. Key word here is "cheap". Which doesn't refer to much in this hobby. I would buy it
08-13-2009 | 12:13 PM
#4
RE: what about these?
I have a Super Tigre G-61 Ring engine I bought new from Tower a couple of years ago. It's on my Sig King Kobra and it's a wonderful engine. It's powerful, reliable, it starts easily, and it's only getting better and better (more power, less fuel consumption) as I continue to run it.
I do have two pieces of advice:
1) The engine will come with a gasket for the exhaust header - you should throw this away and bolt the exhaust header directly to the crank case. The gaskets fail every few flights and aren't needed in the first place.
2) Use thread lock on the exhaust header and muffler bolts and then double-nut them.
Keeping the exhaust bolted up to the engine has been my only issue, and it's easy enough to do if you follow my advice above. I also have an old ST Bull Ring .46 engine that runs like a really powerful Swiss watch. I will happily buy more Super Tigre engines in the future.
I do have two pieces of advice:
1) The engine will come with a gasket for the exhaust header - you should throw this away and bolt the exhaust header directly to the crank case. The gaskets fail every few flights and aren't needed in the first place.
2) Use thread lock on the exhaust header and muffler bolts and then double-nut them.
Keeping the exhaust bolted up to the engine has been my only issue, and it's easy enough to do if you follow my advice above. I also have an old ST Bull Ring .46 engine that runs like a really powerful Swiss watch. I will happily buy more Super Tigre engines in the future.
08-13-2009 | 01:11 PM
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From: Philadelphia,
PA
RE: what about these?
In my club the newcomers who buy Super Tigre engines eventually give up on them and buy easy to operate OS engines. Only the most expert guys can operate them after long periods of break-in and adjustment.
08-13-2009 | 01:35 PM
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From: Nutley,
NJ
RE: what about these?
Ive only owned one Super Tiger .45. Ive gotta say it was much more powerful than my OS 46. The only issue I see is you really need to break it in well on the ground. I prob ran half a gallon through it before I thought it was ready to fly as it was VERY tight when new. So tight I couldnt get it to turn over. If you run into this problem, remove the plug, drop a little fuel in the hole to lubricate. Then turn it over with your starter for a good 30 seconds or so. After a couple of times doing this, it should be nice and warm and allowed cyclinder to expand, replace plug and try and start it. Then break-in.
Despite the intial start-up / break-in process....I would buy again. Very strong motor, and inexpensive.
Despite the intial start-up / break-in process....I would buy again. Very strong motor, and inexpensive.
08-13-2009 | 01:39 PM
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From: Covington,
WA
RE: what about these?
If an ABC (non-ringed) engine is that tight, heat up the head first ( expand the cylinder), then start it up. It's easy and there is no damage to the piston, liner or con rod from forcing it around.
Jack
Jack
08-13-2009 | 02:07 PM
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From: Poolesville, MD
RE: what about these?
I have a bunch of SuperTigres and I like them... but there is a BIG caveat.
Some of the engines, and the .61 & .75 is prone to this, use the same size carbs for different displacements.
So the carb may be best matched to a particular size.
In turn this has made a percentage of the SuperTigres I've purchased somewhat problematic.
The problem manifests as an inability to get an accross the board smooth running engine.
You can tune the engine for a great idle, but then transitions will suffer.
You can tune the engine for a great transition and high end, but then the engine will bog down at idle as it will remain rich at idle to get the transition right.
SuperTigre advises you to turn the "cat-eye" opening in the carb to prevent this... and that suggestion only makes matters worst.
I've taken to grinding out a small half moon ( 2-3mm ) sliver on the closed part of the throttle opening to preven the idle problem when transition is adjusted properly.
The slightly enlarged opening permits more air to go in at idle, thereby richening the idle and preventing the engine from bogging down.
I've done this on three SuperTigre engines and I need to do it again on a fourth.
The fourth seems to be OK, but the idle is so rich that the engine continues to run with the barrel closed fully.
Yes air leaks around the barrel on all of the ST's it seems, which is why SuperTigres have that rubber boot below the needles.
Some of the engines, and the .61 & .75 is prone to this, use the same size carbs for different displacements.
So the carb may be best matched to a particular size.
In turn this has made a percentage of the SuperTigres I've purchased somewhat problematic.
The problem manifests as an inability to get an accross the board smooth running engine.
You can tune the engine for a great idle, but then transitions will suffer.
You can tune the engine for a great transition and high end, but then the engine will bog down at idle as it will remain rich at idle to get the transition right.
SuperTigre advises you to turn the "cat-eye" opening in the carb to prevent this... and that suggestion only makes matters worst.
I've taken to grinding out a small half moon ( 2-3mm ) sliver on the closed part of the throttle opening to preven the idle problem when transition is adjusted properly.
The slightly enlarged opening permits more air to go in at idle, thereby richening the idle and preventing the engine from bogging down.
I've done this on three SuperTigre engines and I need to do it again on a fourth.
The fourth seems to be OK, but the idle is so rich that the engine continues to run with the barrel closed fully.
Yes air leaks around the barrel on all of the ST's it seems, which is why SuperTigres have that rubber boot below the needles.
08-13-2009 | 03:16 PM
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From: Iowa City,
IA
RE: what about these?
I have an ST .90 bought it spring of 07 I would guess I have about ten gallons through it. I'm horrible at tuning an engine. Fortuately, I have a club memeber that is good. it seems like we adjust the low end in the spring then again in the middle of winter. We fly every Saturday if it not raining, or snowing, and a few times in the snow. Otherwsie a click here or there on the top end at the begining of the day, and I'm ready to fly, I also have two OS it the same story with those engines. I would buy another ST if I need an engine without a second thought.
08-13-2009 | 04:45 PM
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From: Huntersville,
NC
RE: what about these?
Super Tigres, in a beginners hands, usually end up being a paper weight.
By the time you replace the carb and possibly the muffler you might as well have purchased something more reliable.
Cheers.
By the time you replace the carb and possibly the muffler you might as well have purchased something more reliable.
Cheers.
08-13-2009 | 06:28 PM
#13
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RE: what about these?
I love my tigre's they all run good, but the last one I got (china made) had been assembled with a piece of shaving between the cone and hub, this caused me to guess my spinner truness, but for $3 in parts, it was a cheap fix to buy a new drive cone and hub. Almost all of them after break-in require a quick prime and only a snap action on the spinner to fire off and run, good reliable engines once you get use to the tuning charicteristics of them.
08-13-2009 | 09:07 PM
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From: MCALISTERVILLE,
PA
RE: what about these?
I've also got a couple .90's and ......well,I have to say I love them. Not becuase their the best engine money can buy,but because their cheap,they run,they have power and CAAAAN be reliable. Thier just a beach to tune,and they dont transfer worth crap and they like to die sometimes at idle,lol. Sounds like a bad engine,but once you understand them,and know what to expect and dont expect them to run like an o.s........you'll love them becuase of their power and personally. Mine only deadsticked on me a couple times right after take off this one day until I got them tuned. Once you do get them tuned(and they'll likely never run like an o.s.).....DONT TOUCH THEM. Seems like once you put your finger on the needle,its gets totally out of wack. And its good practice to put fuel tubing over the needle to seal any air leaks and just to keep it from vibrating loose or somthing. So,yes....buy one and just make sure you(or someone) knows alot about engine tuning.
.....and most of what those other guys said couldnt be said any better!
oh.....and on a side note. I have a BIIIG super tigre G-4500 that is one of the best, smoothest engines I ever seen. And everyone says they are tempermental. I REALLY love it!
.....and most of what those other guys said couldnt be said any better!
oh.....and on a side note. I have a BIIIG super tigre G-4500 that is one of the best, smoothest engines I ever seen. And everyone says they are tempermental. I REALLY love it!
08-13-2009 | 09:24 PM
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From: Nutley,
NJ
RE: what about these?
What do you have that 4500 in?
ORIGINAL: Jester241
I've also got a couple .90's and ......well,I have to say I love them. Not becuase their the best engine money can buy,but because their cheap,they run,they have power and CAAAAN be reliable. Thier just a beach to tune,and they dont transfer worth crap and they like to die sometimes at idle,lol. Sounds like a bad engine,but once you understand them,and know what to expect and dont expect them to run like an o.s........you'll love them becuase of their power and personally. Mine only deadsticked on me a couple times right after take off this one day until I got them tuned. Once you do get them tuned(and they'll likely never run like an o.s.).....DONT TOUCH THEM. Seems like once you put your finger on the needle,its gets totally out of wack. And its good practice to put fuel tubing over the needle to seal any air leaks and just to keep it from vibrating loose or somthing. So,yes....buy one and just make sure you(or someone) knows alot about engine tuning.
.....and most of what those other guys said couldnt be said any better!
oh.....and on a side note. I have a BIIIG super tigre G-4500 that is one of the best, smoothest engines I ever seen. And everyone says they are tempermental. I REALLY love it!
I've also got a couple .90's and ......well,I have to say I love them. Not becuase their the best engine money can buy,but because their cheap,they run,they have power and CAAAAN be reliable. Thier just a beach to tune,and they dont transfer worth crap and they like to die sometimes at idle,lol. Sounds like a bad engine,but once you understand them,and know what to expect and dont expect them to run like an o.s........you'll love them becuase of their power and personally. Mine only deadsticked on me a couple times right after take off this one day until I got them tuned. Once you do get them tuned(and they'll likely never run like an o.s.).....DONT TOUCH THEM. Seems like once you put your finger on the needle,its gets totally out of wack. And its good practice to put fuel tubing over the needle to seal any air leaks and just to keep it from vibrating loose or somthing. So,yes....buy one and just make sure you(or someone) knows alot about engine tuning.
.....and most of what those other guys said couldnt be said any better!
oh.....and on a side note. I have a BIIIG super tigre G-4500 that is one of the best, smoothest engines I ever seen. And everyone says they are tempermental. I REALLY love it!
08-13-2009 | 10:12 PM
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From: MCALISTERVILLE,
PA
RE: what about these?
I have it in a 85.5" KMP Extra 330. I think I'm swinging a 23x8 prop,but I admit its a bit overpropped,but it runs so great I'm not changing anything. The plane flies well with it.....not overpowered,but not under.....just right for nice relaxing flying. I also use onboard glow which I'm sure helps alot.
08-13-2009 | 11:50 PM
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From: West Central , FL
RE: what about these?
I have had a number of ST's ... the old 45's from italy with a better carb (OS) were the best engines i have ever owned .
i have two recent , Chinese , .90 ringed , one in a TF 1/7 sea fury .. they both perform very well and have quickly become my favorite engines , they hand start with one flip almost always .
i have two recent , Chinese , .90 ringed , one in a TF 1/7 sea fury .. they both perform very well and have quickly become my favorite engines , they hand start with one flip almost always .
08-14-2009 | 09:16 AM
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From: Houston,
TX
RE: what about these?
Ah yes, yet another fine engine brand cheapened and brought down in quality. My first R/C engine was a ST G21 .40 back in 1977, and it was a precision instrument. The twin needle valve carb did take a little teaking, but it set up quickly and had a "tick-over" idle, perfect transition, and was quite powerful even though it was not Schernule ported. When ST went away from their familiar twin needle carb with the two needle valve which could be locked in position, the ability for the user to adjust and fine tune the engine went away. I had an Italian made G45 ABC which was flown five seasons before it needed the bearings replaced. The piston sleeve, which squeeked when new was still going strong. ST has become just another cheap Chinese import.....
08-14-2009 | 01:27 PM
#20
RE: what about these?
ORIGINAL: Gray Beard
The only two stroke glow engines I use now are the SK .91 costing about $100.00. If the ST users gave these engines a try I'm sure there would be a big drop in sales for the ST brand.
Just a thought!!
The only two stroke glow engines I use now are the SK .91 costing about $100.00. If the ST users gave these engines a try I'm sure there would be a big drop in sales for the ST brand.
Just a thought!!
I am regularly flying Thunder Tiger, Super Tigre (Heaven help you if you confuse the two), Magnum, Enya, and Saito engines right now. I also own and fly JBA, O.S. Max, MECOA, and HB engines. Each of these brands is unique with regard to how to best prop, tune, break-in, fuel, and maintain them.
Even different engines from the same manufacturer run and handle differently. My Magnum XLS .46A is a very smooth running engine that evenly delivers power throughout its rpm range, while my Magnum XLS .52A seems particularly happy while running wide open yet it drops off significantly as you back off of the throttle. The two are ported differently and they behave differently as you fly them.
Rest assured that any pilot who tells you, "Yep, you should have bought an O.S." doesn't know anything about engine tuning, and the reason they only fly O.S. is because they can get somebody to help them when they screw up their O.S. Max engine's tuning. I like my O.S. Max engines, but they're like IBM computers (nobody ever got fired for buying IBM) or Sony home electronics; there is better stuff available for less money, but they're "safe" brands that are normally reliable.
I've never owned a engine from SK, Webra, Moki, or VMax but I'm confident that I could get any brand of engine broken in and tuned correctly. I know how to test whether an engine is rich or lean on both the low and high ends and I know how changing things like nitro content, oil content, and plug temperature changes tuning dynamics. When you understand these basic concepts, you don't have to be locked in to only flying O.S. Max AX series engines with 15% nitro and either A3 or #8 glow plugs.
08-14-2009 | 01:41 PM
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From: Houston,
TX
RE: what about these?
ORIGINAL: bigedmustafa
I always joke that there are two kinds of glow pilots; those who only fly O.S. Max and those who actually know how to tune an engine. It seems like those of us who have successfully tried the occassional Super Tigre or Magnum engine will go on to try a lot of different brands and fly them all successfully. Those who try a different brand only to have trouble with it and then hear, ''Yep, you should have bought an O.S.'' often go back to flying O.S. Max and then never learn how to handle any other brand.
I am regularly flying Thunder Tiger, Super Tigre (Heaven help you if you confuse the two), Magnum, Enya, and Saito engines right now. I also own and fly JBA, O.S. Max, MECOA, and HB engines. Each of these brands is unique with regard to how to best prop, tune, break-in, fuel, and maintain them.
Even different engines from the same manufacturer run and handle differently. My Magnum XLS .46A is a very smooth running engine that evenly delivers power throughout its rpm range, while my Magnum XLS .52A seems particularly happy while running wide open yet it drops off significantly as you back off of the throttle. The two are ported differently and they behave differently as you fly them.
Rest assured that any pilot who tells you, ''Yep, you should have bought an O.S.'' doesn't know anything about engine tuning, and the reason they only fly O.S. is because they can get somebody to help them when they screw up their O.S. Max engine's tuning. I like my O.S. Max engines, but they're like IBM computers (nobody ever got fired for buying IBM) or Sony home electronics; there is better stuff available for less money, but they're ''safe'' brands that are normally reliable.
I've never owned a engine from SK, Webra, Moki, or VMax but I'm confident that I could get any brand of engine broken in and tuned correctly. I know how to test whether an engine is rich or lean on both the low and high ends and I know how changing things like nitro content, oil content, and plug temperature changes tuning dynamics. When you understand these basic concepts, you don't have to be locked in to only flying O.S. Max AX series engines with 15% nitro and either A3 or #8 glow plugs.
ORIGINAL: Gray Beard
The only two stroke glow engines I use now are the SK .91 costing about $100.00. If the ST users gave these engines a try I'm sure there would be a big drop in sales for the ST brand.
Just a thought!!
The only two stroke glow engines I use now are the SK .91 costing about $100.00. If the ST users gave these engines a try I'm sure there would be a big drop in sales for the ST brand.
Just a thought!!
I am regularly flying Thunder Tiger, Super Tigre (Heaven help you if you confuse the two), Magnum, Enya, and Saito engines right now. I also own and fly JBA, O.S. Max, MECOA, and HB engines. Each of these brands is unique with regard to how to best prop, tune, break-in, fuel, and maintain them.
Even different engines from the same manufacturer run and handle differently. My Magnum XLS .46A is a very smooth running engine that evenly delivers power throughout its rpm range, while my Magnum XLS .52A seems particularly happy while running wide open yet it drops off significantly as you back off of the throttle. The two are ported differently and they behave differently as you fly them.
Rest assured that any pilot who tells you, ''Yep, you should have bought an O.S.'' doesn't know anything about engine tuning, and the reason they only fly O.S. is because they can get somebody to help them when they screw up their O.S. Max engine's tuning. I like my O.S. Max engines, but they're like IBM computers (nobody ever got fired for buying IBM) or Sony home electronics; there is better stuff available for less money, but they're ''safe'' brands that are normally reliable.
I've never owned a engine from SK, Webra, Moki, or VMax but I'm confident that I could get any brand of engine broken in and tuned correctly. I know how to test whether an engine is rich or lean on both the low and high ends and I know how changing things like nitro content, oil content, and plug temperature changes tuning dynamics. When you understand these basic concepts, you don't have to be locked in to only flying O.S. Max AX series engines with 15% nitro and either A3 or #8 glow plugs.
And then there's FOX
[X(]
08-14-2009 | 05:00 PM
#22
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RE: what about these?
Big, I still have an OPS .60 with the slide carb, that's a fun one. I have a nice old ST .40 from Italy, the MECOA .46, several HP .25s and I think four MDS engines. One of the MDS .68s ran pretty well, the other one didn't and I went through three of the .58s and never got one to break in before the engine broke. The castings!! I still have one of the .58s in the box, I have three flights on it. Russia saw fit to try to get back at the U.S.A. with those.
There is nothing about the SK that is hard to tune, the break in is just different and must be done before flight. OS I just fire them up and go then break them in while in the air.
I like the SKs better then the OS engines so that's saying a lot, I really like the OS engines in two strokes. I was the pit man for a race pilot that used nothing but the Webras, another easy engine and I like them, we kept getting beat by a pilot using the Fox!! But the Fox was a Lee built engine!!
There are a lot of good engines out there, some are just better then others!!
There is nothing about the SK that is hard to tune, the break in is just different and must be done before flight. OS I just fire them up and go then break them in while in the air.
I like the SKs better then the OS engines so that's saying a lot, I really like the OS engines in two strokes. I was the pit man for a race pilot that used nothing but the Webras, another easy engine and I like them, we kept getting beat by a pilot using the Fox!! But the Fox was a Lee built engine!!
There are a lot of good engines out there, some are just better then others!!
08-14-2009 | 10:30 PM
#23
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From: Palm Bay, FL
RE: what about these?
ORIGINAL: bigedmustafa
Each of these brands is unique with regard to how to best prop, tune, break-in, fuel, and maintain them.
Even different engines from the same manufacturer run and handle differently.
Rest assured that any pilot who tells you, ''Yep, you should have bought an O.S.'' doesn't know anything about engine tuning,
Each of these brands is unique with regard to how to best prop, tune, break-in, fuel, and maintain them.
Even different engines from the same manufacturer run and handle differently.
Rest assured that any pilot who tells you, ''Yep, you should have bought an O.S.'' doesn't know anything about engine tuning,
Super Tigre performance is great for the money. I've never seen a China or Italian made Super Tigre differ in quality as some have commented. I regularly fly the ST .75, fits right in the .61 mount, so does the .90. Price an AX 75 lately? Forget it.
I enjoy using every engine I can find and rarely have issues. Oh, Fox baffles me how they continue to stay in business without a doubt. Never could get their carbs to work. The old days, you just tossed it and threw on a Perry replacement. I do use OS carbs on the G20, ASP, Magnums, when quality goes below average, you know, Monday A.M. and Friday P.M. production never is ideal.
08-14-2009 | 10:51 PM
#24
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From: Houston,
TX
RE: what about these?
Yes, Fox is an interesting engine brand. When I was a teen flying control line in the mid seventies, the Fox .35 and Combat .36 were fantastic engines. I never had a problem with them. Of course, that was when Duke was still running the business. Fox engines are very powerful, but their design is so dated and the internal fit has alot to be desired. That and there are so many places for a Fox to leak, particularly around that full length back plate. Their carb needle threads leak badly, too. I tried to get a NIB Fox .50 to run recently. Running 20% castor, 10% nitro, I could never get the engine to break in.... ran hot as a firecracker. Too much compression I suppose. I substituted a Magum .52 XL and away I went, no problems.
08-15-2009 | 07:54 PM
#25
RE: what about these?
ORIGINAL: bigedmustafa
...I always joke that there are two kinds of glow pilots; those who only fly O.S. Max and those who actually know how to tune an engine...
...I always joke that there are two kinds of glow pilots; those who only fly O.S. Max and those who actually know how to tune an engine...
I've found the Super Tigers to be long lived engines unless you get some bad fuel. I was running some fuel from the LHS that evidently the manufacturer lied about the oil content and had 3 engines burn up. The ST lasted the longest before the ring went while my OS .46 AX peeled the coating off the cylinder in about 25 - 30 flights. I'm now running fuel with 50/50 synthetic/castor. My last GS-40 took over a 1/2 gallon on the bench to break-in to the point where it could be flown and has been running stronger with more flight time. Best starting engine I have, goes on the first or second flip all the time!
A couple of tricks I've learned: to get a Super Tiger to tune and throttle good is to scavenge the exhaust from the cylinder (when I changed to a Macs Muffler on my GS 40 it started throttling reliably, no hesitation and slightly better top end), and to run fuel with 50% castor in the oil mixture.
Big Ed, have you tried a Macs muffler yet? If not, give one a try - I've had very good results with it.
Hogflyer
