I want an all in one starter, battery connected to starter motor. I don't have enough power to start my YS 1.10. I tried the Sullivan all in one thing with the 13 c cells. I have tried the 12 volt gel battery with C-clamps, still not really enough. I saw a guy at the field with some mount and he had like 2 or 3, 7 cell RC car packs all connected to his starter. I forgot to ask where he got it.

What are some better options for starting my YS 1.10? I would rather not drag out a car battery and my starter to the flight line.

Thanks

G

Its likely not he power source. The starter itself MAY not being rated for your size engine.
Look around for one of the geared rigs.

I use a geared starter running on 4cell LiPo, no problem starting a Satio 300TDP or any thing else I have thrown it at.

Cheers

What's common is to take several of the 7.2v car packs and wire them in series then tape the packs together. You can get them at www.all-battery.com for a good price. Fully charged it would be around 24v.

voltage is not important is starting, its amperage.
the smaller lead acid batteries wont have a chance at starting bigger engines, they cant supply the amps needed, your car batt is 12v, same as the other lead acid batts, it can just deliver a whole lot more amps. one thing you could try it hooking you starter to your car batt and see if it can turn the ys over, if not you may need a bigger starter or you need 24v
some of the car batteries still cant deliver the amps for bigger engines
the solution it lipo or a123 batts, just make sure you dont over discharge them or your in trouble.

Is the 110 new? Ihad a little trouble starting mine when it was new, but my cheap Hobbico 12v and 7amp gel battery have no trouble with it now. How does your setup turn the engine with the glow plug driver off?

FWIW,


I'm using a 4cell 3200 mAh 30c lipo.


Bob

Not really true. You can not increase the current that the motor receives until you increase the voltage to the motor. What is true is that different batteries have different internal resistances which drop the open circuit voltage of the source when under load. The speed of the motor is proportional to the voltage applied, but the power of the starter is proportional to the voltage applied to it squared.

So you want more voltage and a low internal resistance in the battery.

It's not the battery as much as the starter. They are rated for different sizes of engines. My old starter was rated for up to a 1.80 and worked great on my little 7 amp gell cell flight box battery. I have a cheap heavy duty starter now rated for up to 1.40 engines and it fires up my YS 1.10s and 1.20s without problems. I can even roll over my 1.40 gasser with it on a 7 amp battery as long as the battery is charged up. Make sure your engine is making that squishy squishy sound before you try to fire it up too, YS wants the pressure pumped up first and they roll over easier when wet, that squishy sound.

well you need some voltage or you arnt going to spin the starter at any decent rpm, but what a lot of people overlook is that their batteries cant deliver the amps needed to turn over bigger engines,
to my understanding
voltage controls the rpm of the motor/starter
amps control the amount of resistance that the motor can take at a certain voltage
for example i can start 40 sized engine on a 6 cell, 7.2v, nimh high current pack. this is due to the fact the starter can draw a ton of amps from the battery
i then tried a 14.4 old drill battery pack when i was starting .91 sized engines, it couldnt turn it over (or the .40 sized) because it couldnt deliver the amps needed, it would spin the starter like a top but once you applied some resistance it stopped rather quick.

now if you want to increase the power of the starter you may need to increase the volts, but dont bother increasing the volts until you maxed out the amps aka try a car battery if that doesnt work go to a 5 or 6 cel lipo, or 2 deep discharge batteries.
make sure your battery contacts are clean or your wasteing your time w/ the car battery.


some starters arnt strong enough so you will need to buy a bigger/better one, but a lot of the time it is the battery

i use a TorqMaster 90 Starter and 2 12 volt batteries(hobbico ) wired in parallel which still give me 12 volts but more amperage for more torque...i can easily start my biggest glow engine a saito 150...anything bigger would be my gassers and those i hand start...for kicks i tried my starting setup on my DL-50 and in turned it over nicely when fully charged

You need to understand the internal resistance of batteries. That combined with the internal resistance of the starter limits the current of any voltage source. You can not increase the amps to the motor without increasing the voltage at the terminals of the starter.

If you have to 12 volt batteries, one with an internal resistance of 0.1 ohm and the other with an internal resistance of 0.5 Ohms and attempt to pull 10 amps from each battery. The first battery would supply 11 Volts while the second would only supply 7 Volts.

i really didnt understand what you just said....im not all there when it comes to technical stuff like that.... all i know was when i ran only one 12v hobby battery, fully charged it would barely turn my 150 4 stroke...i gave that battery to a friend and bought 2 identical 12v hobby batteries and wired them in a parallel and it made a huge difference in the torque...my starter has the grunt to start large glow engines

=

It's the starter not the power source.....If for example your stater draws 2 amps max at 12 volts. Then it's only going to draw 2 amps at a higher voltage....remember electricity is lazy its only going to give what the starter asks for no more......Upping the voltage as in connecting batteries in series can let out the magic smoke...once you see the magic smoke the starter is done......I had a gent tell me his new starter was bad....I asked him to bring in his starter and power source....He tells me that the switch was intermittent.....he had a homemade battery case as a power source.....I check the battery's voltage and low and behold it was 25 volts.....he had 2 12 volt batteries in series instead of parallel.....the increase in voltage caused excessive arcing of the switch contacts......
He meant to have the batteries in parallel which would have increased the available amps and kept the voltage the same.....but increasing the available amps does no good if you go above what the starter can draw......
Some starter as in the Sullivans can go up to 24 volts....now that will draw more current....
There are greared staters that can start the biggest gassers.....
Good luck

Gary I suspect you are or are getting ready to fly the RC Pro warbird races with your 110 here in AZ. Anyway You can use the cheapest of starters and you do not have to go the geared starter route.

For that particular engine especially in the racing environment where everything has to be right with one minute to start your engine and get airborn voltage is king! I recomend running your starter at 16.8 volts, this increases starter RPM dramatically and is exactly what your 110 needs. The cheap starters handle the voltage just fine. Sometimes the very cheapest the switch contacts will burn and stick so its simple to replace the switch externally with an automotive starter switch. If you use the heavy duty switch the starter becomes a two handed starter. You should never start your 110 single handed, that engine demands your respect especially when running short stack and very high nitro fuels.


Here are my starters all using two Seven cell packs wired in series The two larger ones I put together specifically for the 91 and 110 YS's and they are ideal. The mondo has 5000 Nimh packs and the smaller just 1600 to 3000Nimh

I do not use Lipo because my starters are always being borrowed and there is no way to track usage to avoid dumping the batteries to much and destroying them.


John

Thanks John! Very intuitive on your part. I am getting a warbird ready! :-) Now, I like your set up, although I don't have a nice band or scroll saw to make a custom deal. I saw the guy that owned the black twin engine warbird (that crashed last year in a race) who had bought a battery mount to use two RC car packs. Can't find it on the internet.

Thanks
G

Gary,



Check out radio shack, the have project boxes
of different sizes. There cheap too.


Bob

Gary that would be Tony P. who owns the Valley Hobbie shop in Chino Valley near Prescott.

There Is a 14.4 volt geared unit on the commercial market but I prefer 16.8. Thats probably the one you saw. Most of us now just use a cheap starter and the thin plywood legs are easy to whack out with almost any kind of tool. Its a big advantage to use just about any kind of pack whenever you want. Boxs are unnessasary weight and complexity.

Sorry I answered earlier but the morning server at this site always times me out without time to think and type.

What you guys don't know or understand is interesting. Yet you feel that you should offer advise based on a total lack of knowledge on the subject. Perhaps in this politically correct world, I should just let you continue to spew total crap and ignore this thread. What I say in this post is just venting at this point. But good information on almost any subject is available on the web. And then there are posts like the one I quoted from. It's hopeless.

Here's what I've done, very similar to what JohnBuckner has.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_24...tm.htm#8108331

To the original poster: It easily turns over my YS 1.10

Knock yourself out!!
Paul

Thanx high plains for the polite and informative way of letting me know I made an error...I don't know what I was trying to say in that line....at times things get jumbled between thoughts and keyboard...if you had of bothered to have read further down you would have seen I said just the opposite........thanx again

Yup I did what John shows in his picture above.... two packs wired in series for more voltage on a Heavy Duty Hobbico starter.

BTW: Some guys take these starters up to 22v w/o problems...


This works great starting 50CC engines and most of my gassers that are of that size or smaller.

It is ESSENTIAL that you also increase the cone size for the larger engines.

A small metal and rubber cone does not exert the leverage needed even with the increased voltage.

A larger cone has a longer lever moment making it possible to turn over the larger engines.

Fortunately Hobbico sells larger cones for their starters.

Yep, I've been using 2 3s 2200 lipos (22v) on my regular torqmaster 90 for awhile now with no ill effects. It can start anything I've got with authority. Granted I only do short bursts, but that's all I need.

Question for John. I burnt out one of my old starters using 24 volt car batteries, two 12s in series. I'm talking smoking!!! That's why I just got a higher rated starter. Have you or anyone else tried using one of the 18volt batteries from one of the cordless drills?? Those I can get cheap and they come with a charger.

GB I have not gone over 16.8 But trying the 18v tool packs if you can find a way to attach them is certainly something I would not be afraid to try.

The cheap starters the one with the hard yellow plastic switch housing and a yellow plastic button has a much smaller contacts than either the heavyduty hobbico or the sullivan (the ones with the flexible rubber over the contact plates.

The switch is more likely than anything to give up and the way it fails is simply pushing the switch and the motor runs but keeps on running when you let go. The little contactor just welds itself together. This happened on the one with 5000 batterys and the setup that could potentially pull the most current. Adding a nine dollor tractor press start, starter switch solved that problem.

John