Talking about flying RC airplane skills.

What is considered Beginner flying abilities?

what is considered Intermediate flying abilities?

what is considered Advanced flyhing abilities?

just curious. I'm thinking of buying the Blue Nose P51 from Hanger 9. They suggest upper intermediate skills.

I can fly my Seagull Decathlon w/ os fs70 just fine. I'm practicing knife edge right now. I can do Barrel rolls and loops. Funnel and hammer head no problem. I can now finally control the plane on the ground. I figured out how to land the plane and grease it every time. I also fly an Avistar converted to tail dragger. I can fly the escapade just fine - what a fun airplane that is. so, I'm just wondering what skill level do I need to fly my first War Bird.

Based upon your self-assessment: Go get that warbird.

Yes Ditto's

what kind of flying is intermediate?

I think I will go get that war bird.

I think it varies, the definitions depending on where in the world you are.

In the US beginner would be considered "Still flying with an instructor"

Intermediate would be considered "able to fly basic aerobatics" like you currently can. Typically you will be able to handle most sport type aircraft fairly comfortably. I find Hangar 9 warbirds to be sort of sport like in performance ,i.e fairly easy to fly if you can take off and land with a degree of confidence.

Advanced would be considered being competant at flying the more complicated moves and being avble to handle an aerocraft with little separation between Centre of Pressure and Centre of gravity and those with high wingloading.

There are warbirds that will fall into both the sports or intermediate ability catagory and those that will fall into the advanced category i.e. they have high wingloading,require longer take off runs and being flown to the ground on landing.

If you stickto the warbirds that fall into the sport flyer category you'll have lots of fun. Of course you could make them more challenging later on with higher weight or reduced engine power.

I know many folks who fly scale warbirds and have them powered up like 3d aerobatic planes....each to their own

You advance as you are prepared to crash more expensive airplanes

Unfortunately, there is no black & white description for what determines a level of experience. Case in point: I know a young man who is an outstanding 3D flier. He has only been flying for a few years, but he will astound you with an aerial show that will leave no doubt in your mind that he is an "Expert" flier.

But one day, he did a pass over the runway, then nosed up, and as the plane climbed, the engine quit. As the engine died, I thought to myself, "No problem, just nose it over, dive to regain speed, level out and set her down on the runway." but instead, he nosed it over and immediately began cranking on the elevator to level the plane out! You could actually see that huge elevator flipping from neutral to full up several times before he pancaked it into the ground.

It was then that I realized that without power, he had no concept of how an airplane flies.

It sounds like you can easily "Fly" the bluenose. It's a very stable plane and has no bad habits - BUT... IF you get in trouble, can you get it back under control? That to me is the definition of a better pilot - When he has the confidence that WHEN something goes wrong, he KNOWS he can deal with it!

Here's another little test. Which catagory do you fall into?

Beginner: Has someone else maiden his plane

Intermediate: Maidens his own planes

Expert: Maidens other people's planes for them

Good one.

You have a point MinnFlyer but not necessarily. I don't call myself even a intermediate flier but I have been flying 3D airplanes for a couple of years now including Topstar (UCD clone) and GP Reactor 46. I prefer to have an experienced flier maiden my airplane. I also have someone help me put it together. I mainly worry that I will mess up my expensive kit while building and I dont want to lose it on the first flight. Agreed, I need to get over to building things so I can built the way I want but I am getting there slowly.

However, once its put together and test flown, I spend a lot of time (sometimes more than spent on putting it together) getting the setup the way I want (I dont have anything to worry about then). Also repairing damage is no issue...its just the first flight nerves. Once I have flown it for some amount of time, I am able to take a lot of "risks". In the Topstar I had a lot of issues with the engine cutting repeatedly and I did a lot of dead-stick glides (from less than 20 feet of the ground when the engine cut in a hover) without damage.

Ameyam

In the UK the British Model Flying Association BMFA has three tests A,B and C.

You can read the standards required here [link=http://www.bmfa.org/achievement/index.html]CLICKY[/link]

In many clubs the A test is mandatory for independent flying ie without an experienced pilot standing by.

The B test is mandatory for flying at shows and some competitons.

The C test is very controversial as it requires the flying of a range of advanced pattern style manouvres such as

(h.9) Knife edge 45 degree climb with one positive snap roll from knife edge to knife
edge in either direction.

This should be flown from standard height and line and the initial pull up from level flight to
45 degrees should be performed approximately 80 metres before the model crosses in front
of the pilot and the quarter roll to knife edge (either way) should be performed immediately
after the pull up.
The positive snap roll should be performed as the model crosses in front of the pilot and the
45 degree knife edge climb should then continue and be approximately the same length as
the climb before the snap. The model then quarter rolls to upright and then pushes back to
level flight on the standard line but obviously at a higher level than the start..
Throughout the climbing manoeuvre, the heading of the model should not deviate
substantially although minor deviations are acceptable. The snap roll may affect the line of
the upper climb but this should be immediately corrected by the pilot.

I ws doing a lot of 3D flying, turbine flying, pylon racing and RC combat with a 1/4 scale bipe for relaxation at the time this was bought in and realised that I really needed a pattern style model for the C test. I could easliy do all the manouvres with my hack 3D Sledge but was told unoficially that using a 3D model was frowned upon.

Flying the pattern style model a Bravo 303 certainly gave me a chance to be a smoother pilot and I got to the point where I could run the schedule but at the time was moving abroad so never took the test.

However at club level I am not sure it made me a more expert pilot IE one that would be approached to maiden something out of the ordinary or take over the TX from someone in trouble.

My point exactly. To some people, you look like an expert, yet you know deep down that you are not.

On the other hand, there are many people with your capabilities who THINK that they are experts, until they have a mishap and don't know what to do to prevent a crash.

It's like something that I remember from many years ago (Note: This was before anti-lock breaks): A woman who lived next door to me had a minor car accident. It was raining and a car in front of her stopped and she rear-ended him.

She said, "I don't understand it. I slammed on the breaks, but I was sliding right into him. So I tried to swerve around him, but the car just kept going straight." and then she topped it off by saying. "And I'm such a good driver. I've never had an accident in 25 years!"

Well, obviously she was NOT a good driver. A good driver would know to allow more room from the car in front if the roads are wet, and that you can't turn when you have your breaks locked up. She wasn't a "Good" driver, she was a "Lucky" driver in that she had never been in a situation where an accident was imminent unless she took the correct preventative actions.

I agree with Mike.

I fly with many experts that have one crash, one mechanical failure or one bad landing per flying session.

I fly with experts that stay grounded if the wind is blowing hard, or get blinded by the Sun.

How expert are them? I am not sure.

In our case, we are designers, drafters, builders (some), test pilots, maintenance mechanics and pilots at once.

In my book, an expert pilot is not necessarily an expert and integral aeromodeler.

I like those!

For the earlier comment about knowing how to deal with emergencies - It's not necessarily the knowledge of how to correct a situation so much as the ability to think calmly through the situation fast enough to survive it. Some reactions are reflexive through practice and repitition (learned reflexiveness). A 17 year old has better reaction time than me (now) for sure . . . but I mostly know the proper inputs so I save much more time in doing it correctly the first time. Doesn't help much to quickly make the wrong move.

Mechanical "episodes" can be alarming, also. I recently switched out a 72mHz system for a 2.4gHz system in an Ultimate biplane and, because I am stupid, reversed servo wires on a split elevator servo mixer. They still went up & down as they should, and were neutral as they should be, but one side had 20º more motion than the other. At the first banked turn after liftoff I thought I had lost contact wit hthe model. Then I suspected I had reversed the aileron wires. Finally, after the flight from hell, I landed and no harm was done. She survived because my first rection was to get height until I could figure out the problem. If I had tried to land immediately it probably would have been a short, ugly event.

Hi!
An expert pilot is somebody that can fly any plane, in any weather and land it safely on the runway even if the engine stops at the most unconvenient position /hight imaginable.

Ok, the LT40 is flying with a 30mph tailwind at 10 feet high.

Just as you pass the runway, the engine quits.

Not even an expert is bringing that one back!

[/quote]
Ok, the LT40 is flying with a 30mph tailwind at 10 feet high.

Just as you pass the runway, the engine quits.

Not even an expert is bringing that one back!
[/quote]

I second that. There are situations where even the most experienced pilot cannot prevent damage. A good pilot would be one who would be able to salvage the most from the situation, either by making the correct decisions or by reacting at the correct time.

On one day I saw, my instructor was teaching a newbie how to hover a 60 size heli. They were standing a few feet downwing from it making final trims in the hover when a sudden strong gust (we fly near the sea) pushed the heli back towards them. He reacted just in tome pitching the nose down so that the rotor did not cut them up. It passed at eye level less than half a foot from them but by that time the thing had already pitched over. Needless to say there was damage but there was no damage to the fliers. It could have been very ugly had he not reacted in time. Everyone thought that was excellent piloting

Ameyam

No problem. Even the intermediate poilot would have know to and how to taxi downwind to the far end of the runway. Then, in 30 mph headwind having taken off in 40 feet, he'd have the remaining 80% of the runway to nose down and land without banking to either side and getting into trouble. ;-)

I self taught how to fly an RC helicopter. It was a long journey. But, I took baby steps and for me it worked. I now own a half a dozen helicopters and all in perfect condition. With the introduction of airplanes for the last (I don't know) 5 -6 month I have been taking baby steps in learning to fly airplanes. I thought I did great with the first flight with an escapade. With the addition of the Avistar (modified to a tail dragger) to learn approaches and flying left to right and right to left - right turn - left turn. Finally I had the nerves to bring out the Seagull Decathlon. With no instructor and a bunch of friends with trash bags and video camera to witness the crash ( No faith ) I flew the plane all by myself. Greased the landing. I played smart - just like my other planes - keep it high - keep forward speed - and listen to what others say on RCUniverse. I've put about 80 + flights on the Decathlon, over a 100 on the Avistar and 80 + for the Escapade. In all I have dead sticked the Escapade 5 times and landed 4 of them safely. one of them I was too low and no air speed so I plopped in heavy weeds ( no damage ). I then severely crashed the Escapade ( still in repairs ) due to a rooky mistake. Plane bounced on landing - I gunned the throttle - the plane pitched right, inverted and nose dived into the runway. No incident with the Avistar yet. And only a few bouncy landings with the Decathlon ( I still have to figure this plane out). Inside I'm itching to try out a war bird. I have been Eying on the H9 P-51 Blue Nose 60 size for some time. I think I can do it. I just need you guys approval. Ya or Na?

There a'int but one way to find out. I think you can myself.

thats happened to me. Only choice is to ride the glide and get her down softly. At our field if you miss the runway you're in the bush and there WILL be damage. All the "experts"said I did well but I ran it through over nd over in my mind and I could have attempted a turn into wind. I would hav risked a stall but I still think there is a way out of that mess.

Beginner: Shows up at the field, feels the 30 mph crosswind and is afraid to fly.

Intermediate: Shows up at the field, feels the 30 mph crosswind and decides to fly anyway.

Expert: Looks at the weather forecast, sees the 30 mph crosswind predicted, and stays home and works on another plane.



Brad

I second bkdavy.

I think its all personal preferance. Some learn faster than others. Its the self confidence to what airplane you fly. For example, if you have been flying the sig lt 40 for a year, and are very comfortable, and want to move to a sig four star 40, but your don't think you can fly it, don't. Not only is it unsafe to not fly an airplane you don't think you can fly, but not very fun. We should have fun flying these airplane, not scared up to our ears because we don't think we can fly it. Theres a guy at my old field who flew 1 solo on his lt 40, and came to the field with an astro hog the next day. I looked over when he was ready to take off, and he was shaking like crazy, because he was nervous about flying it. He wasn't going to enjoy flying it, because he was so nervous about fly it.

All Personal Preferance.

We have added another level in this thread; "Expert"

IMHO this is the people that get paid well to fly and/or compete at the highest levels. If you can fly most airplanes in most normal encountered conditions you may very well be advanced. Intermediate flys well, lands well but avoids gusting winds and maiden flights. Beginner, from on the box to a little rough finding the runway at times, can't do basic radio programming without help.

My 2 cents...
Steve

A "beginner", like myself, still finds their hands shaking and the butterflies in their stomach after yesterdays first flight with their 60 sized nitro trainer. It was almost as bad as when I first flew my first 6ch CP electric heli back in Xmas 2008, you know you have to do it, but it still gives you the willy's !!

I'm less nervous with my 50 nitro heli, and that thing is worth like five times as much as my trainer!