RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

AEAJR hit the nail on the head with starting with an electric powered plane ! But he made a mistake mentioning the aerobird lol , I have the perfect plane and price for you ! Go to [link=http://www.littleracers.com]Freedom Flyer[/link] and buy yourself the most durable plane I have ever owned , the sticks for lift and tail are seperate but if you can keep this plane in the air then you definitely can keep an OS plane in the air . I own 6 planes and this is the only one that I can actually fly comfortably . If you need any info on this plane feel free to email me and I will totally fill you in on it ......oh yea a flight simulater might help , try [link=http://www.fms.com]free flight simulator[/link] this is how I got started and man are you in for some fun ! good luck and practice hard [8D]

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

That Freedom Flyer package looks pretty good. I find the Aerobird wing bashing funny since I fly loops with mine all the time. Sometimes 3 or three in a row, but I just find it funny. Really.

RC-FIEND

You say you have one of these. Maybe you can fill in some details that are left out on the web site.

3 Channel - R/E/T I presume - Fully proportional throttle?

27 MHZ radio ? What is the range?

What kind of batteries does it fly and how long a flight can you expect? For comparison. The Aerobird flies 900 mah and gets about 6-7 mintues at full throttle and about 12-15 at half throttle. These are real life times that I have clocked. No bashing here, just interested.

If the plane is good, for $99, it may give me another plane to recommend to other people.

The one thing I don't like is it comes with an AC charger so you can't charge at the field. Of course I see they have a 12 V charger option available. If it is less than $15, the package is on parity with the Aerobird and you get two wings and two tails and two batteries.

Nice package. Please fill in the details.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

aeajr , this plane doesnt have a throttle, just arming switch with on of switch on radio.
as far as the range of 500m and climbs at a rate of 30 seconds per 450ft .
you get two batts with the plane and they are 8.4 volt 600mah batts, will last 6 min continuos power.
as far as the charger if you own a skyliner by megatech or similar park flyer you should have a feild charger , besides chargers are cheap these days.
the biggest advantage is this plane is the most durable plane made and it ist a stick fuselage.
If you are contiplating buying it because it doesnt have throttle im working on converting mine now , all you need is a receiver and radio with esc, I took my esc out of my sky vector and it work finr , so all I need now is the radio and receiver which i wanted to get a 4c anyway for future use.
any more questions i will be glad to respond ...


p.s. doesnt the aero bird climb depending on how fast you travel ?

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

I am not contemplating buying the plane myself. We are trying to help Skitchen8 find a suitable plane wihtin his budget.

I was looking to understand what it did and did not have for $99 and, of course I am comparing it to the Aerobird since that is my point of reference.

So, it is on/off throttle only. Not my preference for a parkflyer. OK for a e-glider, since the goal is to get it up there and then cut the power. Skitchen8 will have to decide if this is what he wants.

Radio range is 500M or about 1600 feet. OK, but not great. Aerobird is 2500'.

Unless you are thermaling, either should do for normal flying. However, our field is larger than most and is more than 1600'. If I were to fly it at our field I could not fly out over the trees with the freedom flyer without risking losing control.


Thanks for the clarifications

What size motor is in the plane. I don't think it said.

ALL planes climb with increasing speed. The greater the speed, to a point, the greater the lift the wing generates which results in a climb. This is generally true of all wings/planes, both model and full scale. They only differ in degree.

The undercambered wing of the Aerobird generates a lot of lift, so it will climb more readily on moderate increases in speed. However it has a fully proportional throttle, so you can set it to what ever speed you like, then adjust the trim or move the stick, to hold level flight.

I spend most of my powered flying time at about half throttle. Gives me 12-15 minute flight times when I am not thermaling. That is one of the reasons I prefer a proportional throttle.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

aeajr you asked alot of questions to help this guy but let me clarify something :
I met a guy in here that literally destroyed his aerobird in one week , then I showed him the FF and he bought one,and has been thanking me ever since , also you didnt answer how does the aerobird gain height , its the speed right ? fly faster go higher concept ?


blah blah blah now I know you are just rambling on . I coverted 500m into yards by multiplying it by 1.0940 (500*1.0940 = 547 yards ) [:-] this the length of five football fields ! and then some


what kind trees do you have there GIGANTIC RED WOODS ! besides im sure they are not tall as five football feilds ! :) and I have flown my FF well above trees with out even worrying about losing control.
in my oppinion as a beginner plane an on off switch with folding prop is the best way to learn, do to the fact a crash will result in less damage even from very high heights, Im proof of that. and also once a begginer learns to fly there always hop ups you can do to your plane which may involve changing receiver and control for 4c with throttle .


the motor is a 380 power.

can you even get to the servos in the aerobird ? the servos in the FF are clearly seen under main wing which already came handy when Changed the arming switch and pcb for it .

good luck and practice hard.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

The Aerobird has an elevator for pitch control (climbs), but as he said, will climb when power is added. (Which IS true of many airplanes, but not all.)

I'm assuming that the FF is rudder, elevator, and a motor on off switch (even if it's on a transmitter stick). Is this correct?

By the way, don't go getting all dfensive here. aeajr has his opinions and preferences, just as you do. Your last post sounded like you were getting worked up because he made some comparisons. The FF website DID directly bash the Aerobird, but I can certainly see where the FF has faults that the Aerobird doesn't.

we're all here because the hobby is fun. We also come here to help new guys. Pi$$ing at each other won't accomplish anything, and ISN'T fun. ;)
Dennis-

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Thanks for filling me in on the FF. I am not trying to bash the plane, I am trying to understand it. There are several beginner RTFs I recommend to people, not just he Aerobird.

The Sky Scooter Pro II is one of them. At $160 RTF with the radio, it is a great value. My buddy flys one. I have flown it as well. Fun plane!

multiplex has a new one for $199 that looks like a good package as well.

If anyone is interested in the Sky Scooter Pro II
http://www.hitecrcd.com/Funtec/Pro2.htm
Videos
http://www.hitecrcd.com/Funtec/videos.htm

Actually I think the Freedom Flyer looks like a good value for the price, especially with all the extra parts you get, but the web site left a lot of info out. Since you have the plane I asked you. I already have 6 planes, three of which I haven't flown yet. I don't need any more planes, thanks. Ask my wife. Ha Ha.

However you asked me some questions let me try to answer.

Of course, that is how all planes gain height. The Aerobird, the FF, the Boeing 747, gain height through lift from the wings generayed by the speed of the air over the wings. I am sure you know this. Go faster generate more lift and the plane will go up. I just don't understand your question.

Give the Aerobird some power and it will climb. Add some up elevator and it will climb at a steeper angle till it hits stall angle. Give it power and a little down elevator or down trim and it will stay level and fly faster. This would be true of any three channel plane, as far as I know.

Can you clarify your question? I feel I don't understand what you are asking.


OK, you got me, it isn't 1600 feet it is 1641 feet (547 yards X 3) Your point?

I fly in an open field that is longer than 5 football fields. Perhaps that was not clear. I regularly fly my plane further away from me than 1641 feet. In addition to this open space, our field is surrounded by anywhere from 100 yards on one side and a half mile of trees on another. (typical height of trees I would guess at 75-125 feet) By flying over the trees that surround the field, I can get over 2000 feet away and still be within the range of my tranmitter/receiver combo. I do this often.

When I am thermaling, I can be 1500 feet away and 1000 feet in the air. Actually I am not sure how high the plane is, but it gets pretty hard to see. So effective range is important to me. It might not be as important to you based on where you fly.

If you doubt me, visit www.lisf.org and click on the photo of the field. You will see what I mean. We fly lots of sailplanes at this field.

OK, you are entitled to your opinion. I prefer throttle contol. When I was learning to fly I would turn the throttle off if I was going to crash. And if I did crash, the prop is on the back of mine, so the motor/prop never hit the ground.

When performing certain aerobatic manauvers, throttle control helps the manauer work better. It also allows me to maintain powered flight while extending the battery life. It is also nice to have 1/4 throttle on when I make my final approach for landing.

Frankly lack of throttle control was one of the reasons I didn't buy the T-hawk or a couple of the other RTF planes when I bought the Aerobird. The T-Hawk has throttle control now. Just my preference.

Sure! Here are some shots of the control board out of the Aerobird taken out of the plane. You will see the servos very clearly. They can be seen easily without taking them out of the plane. If you ever have the chance to see an Aerobird, just open the hatch and there is the control system. The servos are on the right side. four screws and it all slides out.

If you have any other questions about the plane, I will do my best to answer them.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Skitchen8,

Have you been to GJ's hobby shop in Vestal. I used to go there when I went to SUNYB they had good prices and knew of most of the local clubs, They should be able to help you find a club and or instructor.

One note of caution concerning the cheap electrics mentioned. Some of them fly so poorly that a newbie like yourself may get the wrong idea of what R/C flying is really like.

I would suggest looking into SPADS also. With a SPAD your major costs are engine and radio. Look in the spad forum here and maybe PM a member named Tatto he seems to be the leading authority on the subject.

Also if considering electrics look at the GWS line of parkflyers. they are kits requiring the components to be purchased seperatly, however this may be a good thing since it is a good bet that you won't be able to do much flying till spring anyway... This will give you time to buy the items you need a little at a time.

Most important thing to do on a limited budget is not to rush out and grab the first plane within your budget. Ask around see if of the clubs are having swap meets. You might be surprised at what you can get.

Most modelers in the colder climates like the northeast spend the winters building and summers flying. Building a SPAD or kit is a great way to learn about this hobby and flight in general.

As you can see these forums provide a lot of differing opinions its important for you to weigh each option and go with the one that best suits your particular needs.

One other important issue with some of the inexpensive RTF electrics like the horizon 'bird series of planes is that the components cannot be used in other models. This can make upgrading from plane to plane more expensive since you need to buy a motor and engine for each model. I personnally am using radios that are anywhere from 3-10 yrs old and the same engines some are almost 20 years old. The components have been in many airframes. Most people once they learn to fly a trainer want a low or mid wing sport plane for their next plane if you are on a tight budget and don't think ahead you may end up spending more money on plane 2 then you would need to... Just food for thought



Good luck

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Thanks Crashem. I have been following this forum, and have to agree with you. I bought an electric first and was bored with it the first day and found it unable to be upgraded. Maybe some people are more creative with the electrics, but that is my point of view. I recommend building a spad if you are on a tight budget. http://www.spadtothebone.com/SPAD/

Look at the Debonair or the LC-40. I have all of the parts for either and could build it cheaply for you, however shipping could drive up the cost. Like Crashem, I also use radios that are 3-10 years old. I have a futaba AM that works just fine. The key to finding this stuff is luck. And knowing what you are looking for. I bought them on ebay, did get some junk the first few times, but now can easily spot a deal. Find someone to help you with that. Some of the people have suggested finding your local club or even a fellow RC hobbyist. I wish you were my neighbor, I would love to help get you going. I just sold a small engine that would work great on the Spad Deb for $30. I have also purchased good used complete radios for $75. And I built my first spad for $85. You also need additional flight supporting gear that would cost you around $50. I think that is right on your budget. I would suggest you start at your local hobby shop and see if they can get you in touch with a modeler or club in your area. This person should be able to help get you started and may have some extras for you at a good cost. Good luck, and enjoy.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Skitchen8,

If I were you I wouldn't let the range of the radio factor too much in your decision 500m 2500ft it doesn't really matter these types of parkflyer models are small and are designed to be flown closer and in smaller then larger glow or electric models. the simple reason being is that they are typically very small models wingspans around 29"-45" inches and become hard to see at long distances or altitudes. Rule number one in R/C is if you can't see the model you can't control it. (I know before everybody jumps in and tells how high they fly their parkflyer that it can de done)

When picking a radio I would look for one in the 72mhz freq range as opposed to the 27mhz. 72mhz radios are dedicated for aircraft only use where as the 27mhz freq range is for ground/air usuage what this means is that you could be shot down by a toy R/C car or boat that somebody bought at Toys-R-Us.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

I looked at both planes, and I must say im undecided now. I do like throttle control, but I'm not sure which one to get, both have good and bad points.

Then i was looking at the SPAD site, and I decided maybe a 3rd or 4th plane I'll build myself a SPAD, cuz with that kind of material I can dream up my own design and put my hand into engineering a bit.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

The Spad stuff is really cool. :) I have a green foam board plane sitting half done just waiting for me to get finished wiht my two sailplanes and fixing the electrical problem on the electrajet.

[8D] Whichever you get, I am sure you will enjoy it.

The point is ot get flying! :D

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

I will just keep tossing out ideas here until you get something. You need to be flying!

Here is a used Sky Scooter pro, complete with radio

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...gory=2563&rd=1

Currnet bid it $42.

I have no idea how ot judge its condition, but if you get it for $55, you get a 3 channel hi-tec radio, receiver, 2 hs-55 servos, a speed control and a speed 400 motor. The radio, new, costs more than that.

If the plane flies great, you're set. If not, you take the stuff out and put it in you SPAD or something else.

Just another idea.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Here are some reports on the Aerobird Challenger, including a crash story.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/Seek...1177224/tm.htm

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Im going to be breif since what I typed earlier was wiped clean .

1 mile = 5280 ft ... Ok 5280 / 2 = 2640 ft WoW .....dude if you can see this far more power to you ! because I know I cant .

nice pic of components but it looks like the servos are soldered to the PCB , am I right ?

Crashem , My thoughts exactly I have park flyer no need to fly far away I like to see my aerobatics when I do pulle do pull them off [:-] , ( nice flying field aeajr ) If I could fly at a feid this nice ,park fiers, at least, small EP planes would not be in budget , only OS and scale would be what I would purchase HEY! I live in Jersey do you think I can come out to LI and test the feild ? :)

and DBcherry , If I thought I was being attack I wouldnt be getting defensive it would be offensive and Im not , this just common rethoric between men , so I apologize if I came off like a jerk

thanks again for responses , good luck and practice hard !

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Crashmen, let me know when you want to come for a visit. I would love to host you.

The entrance to the field is locked. Club members have the key and we drive our cars right out to the field, so bring your 12V chargers. Let's find a date when we can fly togehter.

Only sailplanes and parkflyers allowed. Speed 400 and 8 Cells max. e-gliders can have more. No fuel permitted.

You have ot have an AMA card - no exceptions

Should have a Nassau count permit, but this is a one day guest thing, no problem.

If you have a sailplane or e-glider bring it! Lots of room to launch, although the weather is getting cold for hi-starts. Winches don't care about cold. We have 4.

And yes, I fly that far out, because I can, and I can see it fine. You would be surprised.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

that wasnt crash men writing it was RC-Fiend , and my 2 meter sailplane will fit just fine on that field , so probably next spring will be the best time for me to visit if Im invited :eek:.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

You can find a good, used RTF trainer for under for under $200. You need look every day on this web page. But lots of guts to watch your plane smash into the ground.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Skitchen8 I agree with alot of other posters on this thread. Don't get in too much of a hurry to buy something. Get in touch with your local club and visit them. Most likley they have a club trainer that you can fly on a buddy box. Someone will probaoly have a trainer that they will sell you at a great price and help you get started. I have been flying for about 3 years and have had many planes. I started flying with a firebird 2. I got tired of this plane pretty fast. I started flying gliders and electric planes. I had a blast doing that. The friend that I flew gliders with gave me a 60 size trainer and I have never looked back. Electric planes are fun but once you fly a glow plane you will be hooked. It took my friend about 6 months to talk me into flying a glow plane now its all I fly. If I would have read this thread two weeks ago I could have given you the firebird (gave it to a friend). Or a Spad trainer that I donated to my club for a trainer. I will keep my eyes open and if I come across something I will pm you. Good luck picking something out and have fun.

Rick

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

It definately looks like I'm going to purchase electric, if i don't order it online this weekend then I'll find a ride down to GJ's and see what they can tell me, and what prices they can offer (although lately their prices have been outrageous because there is no competition in the area, anyone wanna open up a hobby shop here??). I think im going to just stick with the aerobird for now, because just about everything i've heard about it is either good, or criticism that is personal based. And as far as holding it just above the ground at high speeds couldn't you give it a little down elevator at high speeds to maintain level flight??

Im now in contact with the owner of a club, and he said he'd be willing to help me out as much as he can, so hopefully by next flying season i'll be posting video's of me flying a 40% extra landing it in a harrier :D

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

all right, I was reading that page more in depth about the freedome flyer, and I'm almost thinking about changing my mind. The one thing I don't like is the non-proportional throttle, but If I save up money I could easily buy a 4 channel radio and servo's, receiver, and ESC and modify the FF to make it fly with proportional throttle, and then when I get another plane I can swap out the new equipment, put the old stuff back in, and keep the plane as something to beat on when im bored and don't have a big field.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

You are right about flying low and level with the aerobid. Works fine!

If you want to be doing harriers, why not in front of the house. Check out one of these!

The I.F.O. Aerobatic R/C Slowflyer -

As I understand it, this can be flown indoors in a gym, or outside in moderate winds. With the right flight pack, it can hover on its prop and is almost
indestructable. You could sit on your back porch and fly this around your
girl friend.

http://www.hobby-lobby.com/ifo.htm

IFO Demo at the 2000 Tournament of Champions
http://www.wildrc.com/htmlpages/movies/toc2000.mpg
Flying Combat in a gym
http://www.wildrc.com/htmlpages/movies/mk3combat.mpg

A bunch of IFO Flight videos including one inside a 15X25' office
http://www.wildrc.com/htmlpages/flightvideos.html


You can even pack this is a suitcase and take it on trips. So cool! I want one for Christmas.

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

wow that plane looks real cool lol, being able to fly it in my front yard and making cars crash cuz they stopped paying attention to the road to watch me sounds fun lol. Right now doing any sort of maneuvers is far beyond me, im sure that within the first week of flying I will be able to do flips but that will be about all as far as aerobatic flying. Doing harriers seems awefully dangerous and must take a lot of practice to get the throttle control just right, and then a gust of wind comes and I'd imagine could easily just knock your plane out of the sky (of course if your landing in a harrier you probably wouldn't care much, because even if it landed upside down its falling from about 2 feet) but it would be cool seeing a little electric like that do it. The more I read and the more I fly in FMS, and the more I think about how much fun real flying would be, the more I think im going to end up having a small hobby shop in my basement, and the more I think that I'm going to end up with a stockpile of different radios. Im one of those highly engineering minded people who like to expiriment, which means soon after I learn how to fly I will be designing a SPAD, so I can truly have a plane I can call my own :D

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

oh ! I already have a mini hobby shop. :D
so what you are dreaming of will come true

good luck and pratice hard.


PS FMS is how I learned to fly , its not as good or realistic as Real Flight but it taught me the basics !

RE: Complete Beginner Under Tight Budget, please help
 

Yep! Hobby shop in the basement.

I said it before. I started in march:

2 Electrics that have been flying, one SPAD waiting for electronics, and one set of plans for an electric.

1 Sailplane I have flown, 1 I am about to finish preparing for flight. One that needs electronics and one that I am not ready for. To big and complex. Oh, and another sailplane kit on the shelf that I plane to modify rather than build stock.

Yep, we have a lot in common.

Oh, and dozens of RC magazines scattered all over the house. I may have spent more on magazines than I have on the planes. Ha Ha!

( now, where is that article on laminar air flow....?)