How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I'm about to start my training, and went to the air field recently. I asked a few people how long did it take them to solo. The answers varied obviously, but one guy said in only 2 flights. I asked how did he accomplish this so quick, and he said that for a month he'd been working out on nexstar's flight sim, and that it kept him from crashing as well.

Do these simulators translate into better pilots, and cut down your learning curve significantly??? I'll get one if you guys thinks so. Look forward to your opinions.

Noir

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

The answer is YES!!!!!!! YES,YES,YES!!!!!!

I have a guy at my field who has been on a buddy box for 6 months. I have a Nexstar and used the sim for a month before flying. My instructor never took the controls from day one. Im not saying everyone will pick it up this fast, but it will DRAMATICALLY cut your learning curve.

Get the sim, it will be the best money you will ever spend!!!!!! Or buy the Nexstar and you will have one already.(sim limited to only the Nexstar)

Sean

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I have been flying planes for 14 yrs. and I really like my Great Planes simulator I just bought. The hardest part to learn about flying r/g planes is getting the eye hand coordination .It is exactly the same on a simulator when flying from a view from the ground. You will have to focus on thinking you are in the plane to adjust which way to react.I got a little rusty myself because I have not been able to fly last year,so I wanted to freshen up myself.I think it's well worth the money

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I have flown flight simulators for years to practice full scale flight techniques. One of the things I used to do when I was bored was fly the plane from an external view point on the runway, so it was like R/C flying. Funny trying to land a 757 from an r/c perspective. Anyway, the biggest help for me towards real r/c flying is the practicing of dealing with right/left reversal when the plane is comming at you, as well as lining up with the runway while standing off to the side.

This type of practice can be done in x-plane (i d/l'ed the demo at www.x-plane.com), MS flightsim, and of course the specific r/c sims out there. I've never used any of the specific r/c sims, but i guess their advantage over full scale simware is that it is designer for r/c flying, including using your own radio rather than a joystick.

If you do have a full scale sim on your computer, select the stationary outside view (not the outside view that chases the plane) and try that out.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I've only been flying for a year. Realflight is great. It helps to connect your thumbs to your brain. At the field you maybe get 40 minutes max of airtime. If you only go once per week - it is not enough to really improve. It really does work. I've tried all the free ones and they arent up to the task. Too fake.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I have been flying for about 6 years now and have never owned a simulator. I have used one several times, and my brother owns real flight G2 which I borrowed for a couple months once, but it was not something I would put down $200 for.

I agree that if you don't have much/any rc experience, then it would help as it does teach you the control movements that are needed to fly. But in my experience, the planes on the simulator do not fly the same as they do in real life.

Thus, it is my opinion that you are better off applying the money you would spend on a simulator towards a real plane and go at it.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

If you can comfortably afford both the plane and necessary gear and a flight simulator the I'd say go for it. If you can't then get the plane and gear.

One of my pet peeves is the guy that comes to field with the most expensive radio engine and no flight gear what so ever. Then proceeds to walk up and down the pitts borrowing the essentials.

Before anybody flames me I'm not talking about the average beginner I'm talking about the beginner with the with the 400.00 radio and 200.00 engine mounted in his trainer that then crys poor when asked why they don't go out and get there own hot shot and spare props etc...

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Flight sims are very helpful at learning how to FLY. Not so good at learning how to take off or land.

There is a problem with maintaining your orientation as to where the plane is compared to the runway. The Flight sim puts you in a tunnel vision mode and you have no way to use peripheral vision or even body orientation (it automaticly swivels you like you were on a turntable) to judge WHERE the airplane is. You just have a passable idea of if its high and if its close to you or not.

Its impossible to hit yourself with the simulator. this is FAR from reality with the model.

The simulator never has a problem starting the engine.

I have seen a couple of simulators that scattered pieces when you crashed, and one even used to give a repair cost estimate. (the scattering pieces... I used to see how big a debris field I could make :) )

The simulatrs don't properly reperesent grond turbulence. Ground turbulence is a minor factor in winds under 5 mph... but here in TX, it you can't handle 10 to 20 (gsts to 30) you don't fly much.

****

RE the field equipment: Untill you solo, you don't need to own a glow ignitor. If the instructor isn't there, you shouldn't be running the engine (because then you'll be temted to taxi... then taxi fast... then suddenly you have the darn thing in the air... 5 to 30 sec and you have toothpicks.)

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

It helped me a lot. I bought a used lite version of G2.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Sim are an enourmous help. Not only for beginners but experienced pilots as well. I used a sim when I was learning how to fly. It gave me stick time that is critical to learning. Later, I used it to correct a bad habit I had after exiting spins which caused my real plane to crash. I also used it to learn slow rolls, rolling circles, rolling loops and torque rolling. The sim isn't perfect, and it doesn't alwasy properly represent what a real plane would do, but it is close enough that it represents a great tool every pilot should have.

G2 is good, but there are other sims available, such as Ikarus, Dave Brown, etc. I think there are even some free ones if you hunt around. Even a free, not totally realistic sim will offer useful stick time.

Cheers!

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Ok, a flight Sim is good however...
I'm currently contemplating a NexStar or a Xtra Easy II.
The big advantage of the NexStar is the Flight Simulator package. However you must buy the whole thing, can't buy the Transmitter and Simulator alone.
I don't see Xtra Easy II on the Real Flight list of aircraft. What on their list is similar? How similar is similar?
The Xtra probably has a more versitile radio, the engine I'm not sure, OS Max used to be the best, a looong time ago.
The NexStar sounds like a no brainer, but you gotta spend $400 to try out the F. S..
I'd love to spend an hour a day on the F. S. but the $400..........................

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I started on this hobby in the winter, so no one available to be my instructor.
I used the FMS sim for a month after trying to fly three times and almost crashing. I can't say the date I soloed, since all flights since the first were by myself, but after the sim, my coordination was so improved that I flew nice, even hadling dead stick very often. Just the landing need to be improved right now.
I strongly recomend you use a simulator and a instructor as well, if available.

FMS is for free at http://n.ethz.ch/student/mmoeller/fms/index_e.html

I just bought an interface from my TX to USB port($50 for JR radio).

Nilo

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

In my opinion Real FLight is really the way to go. I have spent countless hours on it and my flying is all the better. My first two flight I crashed, then I bought the simulator and since using it I have yet to even come close to a crash. In fact after a few weeks of flying my trainer I am already getting board with it and wishing that I had a cap 232 or the Ryan that I enjoy flying so much on the simulator. In fact, after having Real Flight for a few months I can even do some pretty fancy 3D manuevers. Of course there is a little difference betwen the simulaotr and the real thing, but they sure are close! For Real Flight you are talking $120 for the lite and $200 for the full but I promise you your flying will be much more rewarding and it will probably save you money in the long run on fixing planes.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

They are not so realistic that you need to worry about a particular trainer model not being included in the sim. The one I have has a high wing trainer (they call it a pt40) but it doesn't matter. Trainers don't fly that much different anyway. That's what everyone says anyway.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Even the MicroSoft Flight Simulator (full scale) can be useful. The Cessna 182 flies a lot like a trainer. Fly from tower view.

Most trainers fly close enough to the same that you can use the simulator's GP PT-40 or the Kadet LT-40 or any other .40 size trainer (whatever it has, doesn't matter), and consider it the same as that Nextar.

REalizim of the sims is really not bad. For example i downloaded a Tiger Moth aircraft profile for the Microsoft Flight Sim 97... and it reacted at full throtle exactly as my GeeBee tiger moth (kit, .25-.40 size) reacted at 3/4 throttle.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

No doubt, Realflight is a very valuble learning tool. as someone stated earlier it really helps the eye - hand coordination. I had agreat instructor but the time spent on realflight helped me to solo much quicker.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I love the sim. I can tell you I would never have learned to fly inverted without the sim. At the field, I'd roll over, and immediately panic and roll back. So I spent maybe an hour or so with the sim, until the panic eased. When I got to the field, the plane behaved almost exactly like it did on the sim. Personally, I'd rather practice out on the field with a real plane, but if you have the patience and dedication to stay with the sim (which I find very boring), you can definitely learn a lot.

I agree with FHHuber that the sim is less useful for landings and take-off, which is really what a beginner should be concentrating on. For those skills, you need to learn to estimate air speed, ground speed, and orient the plane with the runway, none of which the sim helps much with. Another thing the sim doesn't help much with is seeing the plane. At the fields where I fly, the sun can hit the plane in a way that makes appear to reverse orientation (I call it the Escher effect). This is REALLY disconcerting for a beginner, and the sim doesn't really help with it.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Absolutly.

In fact it has saved me from thousands of dollard worth of crashes, of course you STILL need to have an instructor or someone to help you on your first couple of flights. That along with the software should make it a great day at the field.

Lefty[sm=thumbup.gif]

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Very effective.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

iv actually never flown before but im pretty sure i could fly pretty well on my own iv been playin realflight G2 for atleast 3 months now ... im not sure tho hehe

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

You probably could.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

nitrobasher, I would bet as much as you want that G2 is NOT going to turn you into a pilot.

That computer program is really great, but there is nothing better than being attached to a buddy cord with a pilot that knows what he's doing.

I have seen time and time again many newbies that show up at the field that say they've been on the simulator, and they can't fly for a hill of beans. I've never used a sim and I'm glad I didn't spend $250 on one. Learn the old fashioned way. DO IT YOURSELF. That simulator is never going to teach you how to land, I guarantee it!!!!!!!

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Which is it, not worth a hill of beans or great? It taught me how to fly. I may not be qualified to talk about many things on here but if there is anything I am qualified to post a follow up on, it's this. You don't have to spend 250.00. I paid 85.00 for a used g2 lite. Some are free. Your guarantee doesn't hold up.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I have been flying for about 6 months now and have had a sim for 5 months. My opinion is that it is a great supplement to the art of r/c flying, but nothing really comes close to smelling that exhaust, taxiing out, and getting her up in the air for real. My one piece of advice (I can't stress this enough) is if you are using a sim (I have G2) experiment with the wind settings and practice taking off in a crosswind, flying in gusts, etc. I find that this is one area that the sims seem to really stray from reality. With no wind setting, you can feel like a pro on a sim, but I was quickly aware of crosswinds and such at the field that the sim's default settings did not prepare me for. Whenever I am between flights at the field now, I'll just watch the wind socks, and see what they do to those who are in the air. The veterans at my field could tell you where the wind is coming from and how fast, just by the time of day(they don't even have to be at the field!) One area that the sim really outshines reality.....hitting the space bar is easier than playing pick-up sticks after a crash.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Noir! a flight simulator is like an expensive video game for kids. I learned to fly without a simulator and an instructor. I have flown both glow and electric planes for five years and I didn't crash any of my planes yet. My three year-old Falcon Cessna Ready is still in one piece. If you are a beginner to R/C model flight, the first thing you should do is to learn the basic aerodynamic. Know the basics of turning and landing an aircraft by reading some physic books instead of playing a video game. A radio control airplane flies much like an actual aircraft. Learning to fly will be much more easier and enjoyable if you obey the law of physics. As for me, the only advantage of a flight simulator is that it helps you to be familiar with the control reversal. But it doesn't teach you the real physics of flight, such as stall speed, level off from a climb or descent...etc. Finally, once you are well acquainted with ground lessons, you should find an instructor. A flight simulator may be optional.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I wondered why I was successful on my first try. All this time I thought it was the sim but it was actually the 2 semesters of physics I took. :D

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I messed with the g2 lite at my lhs for about a month
went to the field with my mom's ex/instructor
soloed and now I just sit on the patio
pull prop hangs in the back yard and go to the field 1 a week

I am 15 and fly sport
I started flying electrics 4 years ago
started flying gas 1 year ago
and now into sport and pylon racing

good luck to all of you
Matt

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

The sim helps! And I guarantee you that pilots using the sims will advance quicker than those who don't use it. Just because it's not an exact experience, doesn't mean that it can't be useful in learning technique, and building confidence. That's what I think.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I learned to fly without a sim--Bought one for my son as a present to suppliment some of his shoot um up computer games--He used it with his electric Zaggi and learned to fly in a short time--My landings got sorry-not crash sorry -just eratic-overshots-prop busting-etc--Got on his sim for 30 minutes and next day landings improved--Now use sim for airobatics-invertered-rolls-etc---Great learning tool--If your flying has a problem you can't seem to click--Try a sim to straighten it out--Oodles

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Use a sim? Absofrigginlutely!!! :D

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

they are VERY effective. BUT it all depends on how you go about it. you can make it an expensive "video game" or you can be serious and make it an invaluable learning tool. i wish i had one when i first started out. i had nothing but me and a plane. i think i would be at a higher caliber if i had one at first. Realflight taught me to fly helicopters. i never had an insturctor standing there with me when i first started them. but i did however, have massive hours flying the helis on there. the only help i needed was to get the setup right. so, they ARE very effective, it all depends on your attitude on them. whether you want them to help or you cant swallow your pride and let them help you, its all on you.

2 questions???
 

My 2 questions are; is there a difference from say the Nexstar simulator and the G2 simulator? I mean do all the controls work the exact same in making the planes do the same things?

Also, when you get the G2 and it has a transmitter how many channels is that transmitter that comes with the sim? Will it react as my actual transmitter I would use for real flying?

Can you hook up your real plane transmitter to a simulator i.e. G2? If so will the G2 be able to use all different kinds of transmitters i.e. futaba, JR, etc?

Sorry I guess it turned out I had more then just 2 questions.

Thanks

RE: 2 questions???
 

yes

like 6 or 7 but there a a ton of parameters on the program for your own tx

yes its the same thing only it doesnt transmit.


yes it comes with the cords to do so.

Simulators and RC Sim Syllabus
 

Agree [sm=thumbup.gif][sm=thumbup.gif] - Would have saved a ton of money by having a sim when I began eons ago... (but then I wouldn't have room for my recently acquired stable of kits and ARFs;)) Since getting FSM, at about $200 per crash, I've saved about $100k :D

The sim's greatest feature from a learning perspective is that you can get the general feel for the controls and get the "coming atcha" responses nailed before you risk your pride and joy... The more repetitions you get in the sim with the airplane flying at you, the easier it will be when the adrenaline is pumping as your real life model is bearing down on you at what appears to be warp speed. Those reactions take time and repetition to become instinctive, and I am convinced they must become instinctive for your airplane to survive for long....

With the sim, you can lawn dart virtual planes with abandon and practice without the concern that your several hundred dollar, dozens of hours project will become a permanent monument to your first flying attempts :D

Am unaware of any "RC simulator syllabus", but would suggest the following sequence, adapted from a FS flight syllabus -

High Altitude - (Get the airplane airborne at an altitude that gives you some room and where you can still clearly see the airplane)
Effect of the controls - how much of which control does what to the airplane?
Interaction of pitch, throttle and trim - trimming the airplane to fly hands off
Constant altitude turns - bank and pitch inputs required
Climbs, turns to a specific direction
Glides - partial power, power off, trim change required to maintain desired descent or airspeed
Slow flight at a constant altitude - straight and turning
Stalls and recoveries
Keeping oriented to the airplane, especially when it is at a distance
Flight towards and away from pilot.
Recovery from unusual attitudes.

Low Altitude - 5-10 feet off the ground (eye level or so)
Flying in a straight line at a constant altitude (over or adjacent to the runway)
Flying rectangular patterns at a constant altitude (over and away from the runway)
Flying S-turns at a constant altitude (linked 180 degree turns, alternating right and left)
Flying the airplane close to the ground without landing (over the runway)
Flying the airplane towards and away from you

Traffic Patterns
Takeoffs, climb out, rectangular pattern to approach, landing
Landing flare timing and rollout
Deadstick landings


Cheers!

Jim

RE: Simulators and RC Sim Syllabus
 

Is there a website that a person can download other planes that other people have made? That way you dont need the add on packs for other planes.

RE: Simulators and RC Sim Syllabus
 

you will still need the add on packs to fly diffrent planes. however you can get variations to your current planes .[link]http://realflight.com/swap/index.html[/link]

RE: Simulators and RC Sim Syllabus
 

Thanks that is just the thing I was looking for.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

I don't know about cut down on your training time,but I flew on a flight sim for about a month before going to the field. My first day out I solo and also flew inverted,landed and took off. I did have an expert pilot buddy box with me but he let me go solo after a few minutes. Do they work? You bet they do and they save on planes. They are not exact or real world feel but they are close enough. Elements such as wind and heat have effects on it in real world. Take the dive!

A man who learns from his mistakes is wise. A man who learns from other men's mistakes has wisdom.

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

Worked for me, who soloed 6 days after getting airplane, trained in sim for a week...

RE: How effective are Flight Simulators...
 

SIMS HELP 100%!