RE: why should down mean up?
 

Like everyone else has said, it matches the control movements of a full scale aircraft. Instead of thinkign about it as moving the stick down to make the plane go up, think about what the plane is actually doing. The plane basically changes pitch. Moving the control stick to the rear, makes it pitch up or rotate to the rear (nose up, tail down) and moving the stick forward has the opposite affect. Also, there has to be standards. Look at cars. You can hop into any make of car sold here in the US and find a familiar steering wheel, common brake pedal location, etc. Someone could dream up countless ways to control a car but this sort of standardization makes things safer and easier to learn. Also, the "standard" has usually evolved over the years to something that works well for the largest group of people.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Just a point of order.

For a beginner, I think it's best not to confuse pulling the elevator stick with "up". Yes the nose pitches up when you do that, but if you pitch the nose up the plane will only go up with airspeed. As a student, you should be learning that elevator controls pitch, not altitude.

You will go farther much faster in the learning process if you keep to convention, listen to experienced people and shun the advice of people who simply can't fly.....even if they have been doing it badly for 30 years.

Good Luck!!

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Hi All,

Just to confuse matters, when i was learning i had problems with Mode 2 (aileron and elevator on right stick) for aerobatics. My brain just isnt wired the correct way for that mode, as i was unconfident that my elevator inputs weren't effecting the roll attitude (ailerons). SO i went to mode 1.....which splits the elevator out on the left stick...and immediately i found inverted was alot easier....

All that said...I'm afraid its practice, practice, practice...Also with mode 1, its a real pain to find someone to teach you, as mode 2 is by far the most popular, over here anyway...

Hope that helps?

Wavy

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Why has everybody got their horse trained to respond to gee and haw? Is it ok if I train my horse to go just the opposite?

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Yes you can, and it will make it harder for people to steal your horse! [X(]

RE: why should down mean up?
 

And you probably won't be able to sell the nag to any other farmer in his right mind even for what she's worth, and she won't be worth much to anybody else.

And you'll never be able to get your hired hand, nor anybody else, to work that horse worth spit.

And you'll probably never be able to work anybody else's horse worth spit.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Yeh, you're the only one.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

As a total newb who has never flown an RC plane but have some time in real planes it sounds like i will have to over ride natural instinct when it comes time to control a plane by pushing forward to go up!!! and pushing the stick to the left to go right!!! This setup makes no logical sense to me and i,m with the original poster about re wiring the control to exhibit a more natural response,

RE: why should down mean up?
 

What's not natural about the planes we fly. In your full scale you pull back to nose up (climb), push forward to nose down (dive), move the stick to right to go right, and move the stick to the left to go left. It's EXACTLY the same thing in an RC plane. The movements of the stick to the exact thing for the RC plane. What you are referring to is what we call stick reversal, and this probably THE biggest reason why full scale pilots have difficulties when learning to fly RC. When a full scale pilot is sitting in the plane and moves the stick to the right the plane turns right, and the same for going left. Now on an RC plane flying away from you it's the same thing, stick to the right move the plane to the right which is your right. But when the plane it coming towards you the it's opposite. You move the stick right and the plane moves to its right, but now this is your left because the plane is coming towards you. This is what you referring to. But trust me, the controls for an RC plane aren't "wired backwards".

Ken

RE: why should down mean up?
 

I am not sure what you mean, but the RC radio stick setup is the same as full scale. You pull the elevator radio gimble to add up elevator, push to add down elevator. For ailerons, left stick is left aileron up and right aileron down. You would only push forward to go up if you were inverted. What full scale is opposite to this?[sm=72_72.gif] Just curious.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

In case you guys haven't noticed, he already said he would do it the right way.

You're beating a dead horse.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

YOU ARE NOT ALONE:
The fact that I will not be flying in a RC restricted field means that I can (and do) reverse the hookup and/or servo to accept the UP=UP & DOWN=DOWN.
I will be the only one flying my planes so I will be the only one that needs to be comfortable with the directions of the sticks, and the configuration I do is easier on me and less confusing.

Maybe I am wrong to teach myself to fly (OK, I am WRONG to learn without an instructor) but I learned computer on my own, I learned horses on my own (and consider myself [and others have told me] have become somewhat professional) so it looks like I will learn RC on my own:eek:

EDIT: Unless someone gives me real good reason why my thinking is wrong. If I hear that it is bad way of thinking I will do it the CORRECT way.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

This entire discussion is kind of interesting. To me, the mode 2 setup is perfectly natural. You pull back to rotate backward, you push forward to rotate forward, left to rotate left and so on. Maybe it's because my first flying experience was in a full scale plane and this is basically how the controls work or maybe it's just because it matches the way me brain is wired (what's left of it anyhow). I just can't see how anyone doesn't find the standard stick layout normal. I guess peoples perceptions all vary. I also think a few people may have the up, down thing a little confused. Actually, once you start doing any sort of aerobatics, up, down, left and right all become relative. If the plane is traveling toward you and it is inverted, everything is backward. That's why you have to think about it from the plane's perspective, not yours. It works for me anyhow.

As for learning to fly without an instructor, I did it. I think I did OK too but I sorta regret it. I probably would have learned quicker, and with one or two less crashed airplanes if I'd joined a club sooner and learned from some experienced people. Wherever you fly, make sure that there are no club fields within a few miles. You could easily take down someones expensive airplane if you are on the same channel. Trust me, it can happen.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Sorry Minn, thought this was a different horse.[sm=lol.gif]

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Nothing wrong with teaching yourself to fly. Many have done it. And set up your controls any way you like.

What we have expressed here, except for the fooling around, is that these are the standard way of doing things and there are reasons why they are the standards. Standards, norms, usual manner simply means that that is the way the vast majority of people will do things. If you choose to be different, to follow your own path, that is your choice and you are free to make it.

Just realize that you isolate your self from the the rest of the community in this respect.

Clear Skies and safe flying.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

What if Boeing, Northrup, Cessna, Airbus and all the others just set things up any old way they felt like. It would be impossible for for pilots to SAFELY move from plane to plane. It's not that they couldn't learn the various systems but because in an emergency REFLEX actions need to kick in and need to be correct. There has to be some conventions in the world.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Trust all of us who have tried to discourage you from attempting to go it "your way", as that's a sure fire way to grief and pain. Save yourself the needless hurt....don't do it.

Karol

RE: why should down mean up?
 

If thats the case then what is the original poster referring to when he says "Why should up mean down"
[:o]

RE: why should down mean up?
 

The original poster was discussing the movement of the stick IF the transmitter was held straight up and dn instead of with it held low with the antenna more parallel to the ground. When held UPRIGHT moving the stick up (away from the ground) would result in the plane diving in a conventionally set up TX. When the TX is held with the antenna more parralel to the ground pushing the stick (like in full scale) results in a dive.

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Jambo, when you flew a full scale plane did you push or pull the stick/yoke to cause the nose to pitch down? Push of course. This isn't any different. I've flown a variety of full scale planes and have never pulled the nose up to initiate a dive unless I intended to do it by stalling the plane first. (That doesn't count an aerobatic entry to the dive BTW like a 3/4 loop):D Done those - fun.:)

RE: why should down mean up?
 

Here's a good way to get the idea of your sticks on the transmitter. Go down to the local small airport and usually for 25 to 50 dollars you can get an introductory ride in a small Cessna. It usually lasts about an hour and the instructor will let you fly "hands on" for a little while. I remember my first ride. I had been building planes for years and knew what everything did and pretty much how it operated. He actually let me take off and I flew the plane for almost the entire time, of course with his coaching. He then landed the plane and I think I could have done even that. This will give you the relationship of real controls and R/C controls. Give it a try.