Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Hello everybody,

I was browsing over e-bay and came across a seller who is selling TOWER PRO Brushless ESC's 30 amp. model no. BMC30-N.

The price is very attractive however, I am having second thoughts if this will be a "GOOD BUY" or "GOOD BYE" for me. Anybody there who have experience about the performance and durability of this ESC ?

Thanks and I will appreciate all your inputs.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

To me, buying name brand proven ESC's and receivers is like buying insurance for your plane. Is it worth saving twenty or thirty bucks only to find that you've lost your whole plane due to the failure of a "cheap" component. Those two components are critical. Buy proven products.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Thanks for your "sagacious" advice, Jacket, but Allan (and I) want to know if anyone has any experience with Tower Pro bl esc's. Just because you don't know the brand does not mean the product is inferior. Castle Creations was an unknown once. I for one am willing to invest a few bucks on what may be some welcome competition to the "big boys" who are taking advantage of a situation where there is little competition.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Agreed - Name brand doesn't mean insurance. I paid top $$$ for a Castle Creations Phoenix 25 and it got toasted. Almost lost my plane in the process. I checked the CC posts at RCGroups.com and found over 600 posts on the P25 problems. I didn't even think to check before I bought.[>:]

CC is a great company but Tower Pro may be good also. Don't knock them because they don't have a name for themselves. Or if you haven't any experience with them.;)

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

OK heres my 2 cents worth. Been buying Hitec HS55 seervos for my foamies at around $14-$15 bucks apiece. Tried the Tower Pro servos (same specs as Hitec) and they work great. No problems for about 3 months flying them about 2 times a week, 3-4 battery packs each night. The Price.....get them off Ebay for $7.99 each plus a flat $5.00 shipping for as many as you order. I just ordered 10 more so total cost per servo is $8.49 each shipped. And it only took 4 days to get them shipped from Hong Kong. My next will be a Tower Pro just to try it but I assume it will probally work fine.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

TowerPro Esc works good for me. I was leary about carring this product at my store so I bought one of the 15A ones to test. I am happy with it so far. I only really pull 10-12 amps on my 300 Xmotor, but it the ESC doesn't even get hot! The BEC seems to work properly with 2 or 3 cells.

2dogrc
2dogrc.com

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I believe all the responses have its point. However, I feell that prices of some branded ESC and motors are overkill. A price consious person like me would prefer to look for alternatives that will do the job well at a resonable price but of course, I have to take the risk. If you are not too picky, I will go for an alternative, If you have the money to burn, then go ahead with your preference.

I also feel that those branded components are only "Re-Badged" OEM components (Made in China). Eventhough those non-branded or unknown brand are made overseas (China/Taiwan), their quality would be at "PAR" or possibly better then those branded ones at a competitive price. Take for example when you are buying a Honda branded Oil Filter of your old Honda car, the Honda dealer will charge you $ xx.xx, while you can buy another brand for the same model possibly better in quality from other automotive supplies at $ x.xx, what I mean is, the market should be open to competition so consumers will have a choice. In this case, I perfectly agree to joeystat, flyingflipper, badbradgraphics, sonic_sparrow, as for the rest, sorry, I disagree with you.........[:o]

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I have one of the TowerPro 30A ESC's that you are considering and I'm looking for a little help with it. I have it installed in an Ultrafly Ultimate Bipe along with a 1050KV, 30A Max Brushless outrunner and a 2200 Mah 12C, 16C burst LiPo. My question is about heat. It seems like the speed controller is getting way too hot. I have run the motor for only a few seconds and it is pretty warm and when I was setting up my control surfaces and activating the servos alot it also got pretty hot. There were portions of the ESC that were almost too hot to touch. Is this normal or do I have a bum ESC? Any advice would be appreciated especially from 2dogRC.

Thanks

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Were you running the motor at full or partial throttle? Partial throttle actually works the esc harder and hence gets it hotter. Possibility?

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Troy-RCU,


I was running it mostly on high as I wanted to determine if the combination was powerfull enough to pull the plane up when I was on full throttle and pointing the plane skyward. Also, I could see the ESC getting hot when running the motor due to amp draw but why would it get hot when actuating the servos? Seems a bit odd to me but then again this is only my second electric plane.

Thanks

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Well the BEC is seperate from the FETs that run the motor so if you notice a certain spot getting hot, it could be that you are close to the limits of the BEC. How many servos are you running and what kind?

I found this on XUS's website:
4 servos can be used when the voltage is lower than 7.4V (2 cells Li-poly); and 3 servos only recommanded when the voltage is 11.1V (3 cells Li-poly) to prevent overheat of BEC system.

Note: When using economical class micro servos, it is necessary to reduce the number of servos by one.
I guess that means cheap servos that draw a lot of current!!??

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Thanks Tony,


That answers my question. I was begining to suspect that I could not run 4 servos while using a 3S Lipo. I guess I'll need to disable the BEC and install an RX battery. I checked the operation again and found that if I just ran the motor a few times for 5 to 10 seconds the ESC did not get very warm but if I actuated the servos it would get hot and especially in a certain area which is probably the BEC circuit you had mentioned.

Thanks Again

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Hey guys,

I have one of the 30A towerpro brushless ESCs and it works tops! I couldn't believe the massive increase in performance going brushless would make! In all I spent under $50AU for the esc and motor and I couldn't be happier. The esc is very simple to use (plug and play) and I've had nothing but success with it. As you say, the electronics from any manufacturer is made in china anyway, why not cut out the several middle-men and buy directly from the source? My advice, go it. You won't be dissapointed.

Also, with eBay, those Chinese blokes bend over backwards to make sure you're happy with the deal. As well as that the airmail is super-quick from HK - quicker than most national deliveries. Give it a try - the stakes are much much lower :)

Jim

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

i use tower pro escs and they work just as well as castle creations but without the huge price tag, albeit they are bigger in size

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I'm using the BP30 amp speed control from Balsa Products with the BP21 brushless motor and couldn't be happier with them. I think this may be the same speed control. You can get them bought as a combo from Balsa for like $56 shipped. You can also get this motor and speed control off Ebay for about $40 total. I've put it through all kinds of abuse and the ESC still works fine. I too feel that the "brand" name companies are raiking us over the coals when it comes to speed controls, brushless motors, and even lipos. Most of this stuff is made in China and sold to us under some clever marketing by a US company for a huge markup. If you guys are looking for cheap lipos try Dymond Motorsports or Common Sense RC.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

anyone know if i can run one of these im my micro car (mini-t)

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Tower Pro ESC's work very well for their price. Their quality IS lacking, however, compared to better brand names. It's obvious if you look at the soldering and manufacturing of the components. Precision doesn't look as if it was a main consideration during production. However, regardless of that, they work, and very well at that. I've used two Tower Pro ESC's and they both worked fawlessly.

As for their servos, they work well but their resolution isn't very impressive. As I mostly fly helicopters, the servos are simply not smooth enough in their control for my purposes. I do use them in my park flyers though where smooth precise control isn't as important and they work great there.

As a side note, (may aswell add a shameless plug here :D) I will be carrying both Tower Pro and Dynam speed controllers, (Both are very cheap, Dynam ones look much better in quality though). I've got Dynam in stock right now, TP will be in stock in a few weeks. Currently i'm one of the few retailers in Canada carrying them, so if any of you Canucks (or yankees!) don't want to order from Overseas, let me know ;).

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Alot of business plugging going on considering all the guy wanted was some user experiences!!

Most ESC's are made in China, as far as I know to manufacture this sort of component requires decent robotic board loaders and specialised solder baths.

The TP esc's are very good, they are well made and strong. I use the 30's in everything, the only downside I have found is the throttle doesnt seem to have as many steps as I would like, I am going to swap over to the 15A units for my smaller planes to see if it makes a difference.

Yes they are heavier than CC, they have a heatsink though! also an Rx lead that is too long, and the wire used for bat and motor is very average quality. BUT, if you have reasonable skills you can remove the heatshrink, replace the wire with high quality, much lighter wiring, trim the heatsink so it doesnt sit so close to the input capacitor, and use a lightweight high temp heatshrink. I did this to mine and took them from 30 grams with Deans and bullets, down to 22.5 grams with the same plugs and same length of wires except for the Rx which I shortened.

With the Gen2 TowerPro's they have a seperate BEC board, comprised of 7805 transistors in parallel to provide 3A. I removed one of these boards when setting up dual ESC's in my A10's and plan to use the board to make a seperate BEC for something else.

When it comes to BEC I think most ESC's are being pushed harder than they should, alot of these chinese servos pull way too much current as they get near their travel limit.

Another thing to take note of, All current TP esc's need to be programmed! The TP15AG2 and 30AG2 along with the 40 and 60, all have program menus for cell number, brake, timing, and cell cutoff voltage/PWM frequency (this last menu item is being hotly debated, noone seems to know for sure if the 4th menu option is for cell voltage or PWM frequency)

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

What are you moccaoz, the business-plug police?? There's no rule against telling the bloke where the bit of kit was bought from, in fact I expect it would help. No need to get all PC on us.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

You feeling guilty or something?? :D LOL. Are you a business? no? then why get upset, I never said anything about the people actually using the products telling us where they got them from, when someone says, "I got this from here and it worked great for me" thats good info to store away. When someone says "We stock these and think they are good" Thats a business plug... nuthin to do with being PC.

I never used to mind businesses plugging things when someone could not find it, but there are some who flood every forum with plugs, every reply they seem to make is a plug for their business (and I am not talking about any Canadians here :))

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Hey, easy there! :).

As you can see from both my join date and post count, i'm an active member of the RCU community and have been for some time. I rarely plug posts about the products I sell. I only made mention because I know alot of folks don't like to order from overseas. I also thought that the people who use Tower Pro products (usually people on a budget) would like to know about other products which are slightly better in quality at roughly the same price. If I can help people get the products they want at a local level and make a buck on the side while i'm at it, well, it's win-win, isn't it?

Just wanted to let people know that there are local sources for this stuff, that's all. :) If it bothered you, i'm sorry.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

As I said, not talking about any Canadians in here! :) Should be easy to figure out...[8D]

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Sorry, took what you said as sarcasm. ;)

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I purchased a TP60A a few weeks ago for my Somthin Extra conversion. Using a Himax 3528/1000 and a 12/6E prop. I hooked it up to my Watts Up meter before taking to the air and everything checked out well below 60amps. At WOT it was pulling around 50A staticly. Maidened it this past Monday, pushed it to full throttle right after take off for around 5 to 6 seconds then flew around for the next 5 minutes at just over or just under 1/2 throttle. Then it happened, "POP" and no more motor. Tried to rearm the TP60A 3 or 4 times until I got to low and had to land.
Came in dead stick down wind without a problem. Checked out everything, battery was cool, motor was cool, TP60A was HOT. Got it home and removed the TP60A and hooked it up to my little 400xt I use for testing, the TP60A armed and the motor started, ran real bad for a few seconds then quit. A little wiff of smoke came out ot the end where the motor wires are. I had the TP60A mounted to get maximum cooling so that is not an issue. I don't think I will trust any more of their higher amp units. I'll just pay the extra $60 for the added security.
[img][/img]
Best Regards,
Nuts

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

NUTS: That's a real shame about your speed controller dying like that. I suppose it can be a slightly hit and miss affair with the cheaper components they use on these lower priced controllers. I use a 30A model on a motor that would only consume half that current so in a way I'm safeguarding myself a little bit. I know my controller is still basically cold when I come in for land so it should be putting less stress on the controller than a 30A motor would.

I wonder if the different timing and mode of the speed controller had anything to do with it? Does anyone know what these functions actually do?

Jim

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I'm curious as to wether you were using the BEC when this happened? I've heard of these ESC's going up in flames very fast when BEC is enabled.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Running the ESC at half throttle for the entire flight until it went would have been the contributing factor. When you run below full throttle with brushless ESC's, from what I understand you use only one bank or so of FET's, causing overheating in many of the cheaper models. Varying throttle load throughout the flight will utilise the entire ESC and minimise heat build up in one section.

If you were pulling 50A static, you are getting close to the ESC's limit, regardless what the specs are most experienced E flyers will recommend you use an ESC well over rated to your application. Personally if I was pulling 50A I would have used a 70-80A ESC minimum. I have the TP60A and intend to use it in a 35-40A application.

I use two TP30AG2 ESC's with cut down heatsinks and much higher quality wiring, and am drawing 17A through each of them in parallel. My ESC's are always under 40 degrees after a full flight of 50% WOT.

As for settings, timing is important if you want to maximise the efficiency of your motor, timing works on the number of poles the motor has, usually the greater timing advance is used for say inrunners with 2 poles, with lower timing advance for motors with large numbers of poles like outrunners, IE 2 pole EDF motor would be set to greatest advance, usually 20-30 degrees.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I was using a Park BEC along with the TP60. Have used this combination on a few other planes of similar size with no problem. As for the 50A staticly, you have to remember that the amps will drop by 10 to 15% when in flite. The prop unloads quite a bit once airborn. If I buy somthing that is rated at 60A and with an 80A burst it better hold up at at least 50A or the company will get no more of my business. I got a name brand 60A BEC a few days ago and have flown the Somthin Extra 3 times with no problems.
I have used a few of the smaller rated ESC from TP and have had great success with them. I just feel that from the looks of their workmanship and design of the larger units they just won't stand up to what they are rated for. TP uses a single circuit board with all of their FET'S in three rows. The name brand ones I have use three circuit boards with spacing between them. Also when compairing the quality of the TP's and the name brand, there is no comparison. Like I said before, when using a set up that requires a higher amp rating I will use the name brand. To me it's now like insurannce.

Best Regards,
Nuts

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I have to agree that using a slightly over-rated ESC (running at, say 80% of it's max continuous amps) for RC electric motors is probably wise, to protect your investment. This is more important if the quality of the unit is suspect or as yet unproven.

Brushless motors have been around for a long time, so nothing new. They have been used in many consumer and industrial applications over the years. The "motor drive" controllers used in industrial applications offer excellent protection against many types of faults and over-loads, but these controllers are large and expensive. They measure amongst others, input/output currents, voltages, motor temperature, controller temperature and have elaborate protection schemes to save the controller and the motor alike.

Our RC systems don't have nearly as many features. We need a lightweight solution, incredibly high power density and low cost for our applications to work, and so the engineers that design ESC's must compromise on protection due to size, weight and cost.
For example, many ESC's rely on temperature sensing as an indirect method to detect current overload or abuse, but heat takes time to build (relative to direct current measurement). By the time the ESC detects a fault it may be too late to save the ESC or motor.
So you have the power, but minimal protection. It places more responsibility on the user to manage their particular setup. In other words, the ESC must be able to deliver more power than the motor will demand (keep some in reserve), for a given battery size and motor load. Managing heat is a part of that.
These ESC's almost always require cooling airflow, so mounting arrangements will determine how much power you can make - as a function of heat dissipation. Same thing applies to the integral BEC that most of these units come with. For example, if you mount inside a fuselage, don't expect the same power capability as an external mounting.

So, if you can keep the ESC cool, and you trust the brand to deliver on their claims, then it should be OK to run the ESC motor combo at the max continuous limit. But for most users it's advisable to use a little less power than the stated specs of a particular ESC. That means choosing the right combo of ESC, motor, prop-size.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

NUTS I dont agree, the TP esc's are well made, I have stripped and modified 4 of them and other than the wire being fairly cheap and the filtering cap being chinese manufacture, the ESC board itself is fine. Everyone talks about unloading in the air, and the theory is sound, but I have yet to see actual logged data showing a 10-15% drop in amp draw over static running.

The TP30AG2's that I use have seperate BEC boards and are very well made, the TP60A is older generation using a couple of regs on the backside of the board to provide BEC, again it is quite capable of doing its job if you dont push it too hard. One thing I do think is incorrect is the LiPo number, I am sure these ESC's are rated to 3 or 4 cell only, most sellers quote 4s max, the label on the TP60 is IMO incorrect.

A friend uses CC10's at 7 amps static, and the things get stinking hot and shut off all the time. Someone else I know uses Hyperion 30A esc on a 25A static draw and gets shutdowns 3-4 times during a flight even on the outside of the fuse. Both these ESC's are expensive items...

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Well now! If they are so well made then why do you have to strip and modify them?

Nuts

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

If you had read the reply more carefully you would have seen exactly why. Weight was the issue in this case, and I saved 7.5 grams by removing the cheap heavy wire, heatshrink etc, and fitting light teflon wire and hi temp lightweight heatshrink. I also shortened the Rx lead as its way too long, I saved over 3 grams with it alone. My TP esc's work perfectly, in all 4 installations.

Facts are still facts, industrial speed controllers for 3 phase motors are large, complex and heavy, the speed controllers we are using perform extremely well considering their size and what is asked of them. You have a row of FETs for each phase, made up of 4,5,6 or more transistors. When you run below WOT you are pushing only a few FETs out of each row, they are having to handle the current load. These things were never designed to run at one mid throttle setting permanently. End result is the centre FETs usually overheat and blow from the load. It happens with all ESC's if they are being run close to their recommended limits.

As a direct opposite, many flyers of competiton gliders are pulling well over their ESC's max cont' ratings with WOT and experiencing no failures, but then they hit WOT for 10+ seconds and shut down.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Can anyone help me on this: do TP 30A ESC's have soft start function?
Thanks

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Being located in OZ, you should be aware that some fine ESC's are made in Kansas;) I think a lady named Dorothy is in charge of customer sevice:D
All kidding aside , CC has great customer support, but you pay a bit more.
Regards,
Pete

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Lol @ Pilotpete2! The sad thing is there are people who actually believe Kansas is a state of Australia and that pensylvania is where dracula lives!

stradivari: There's no soft-start function I'm aware of on the TP ESCs. That said, the wind-up on a brushless motor is less violent than the brushed equivalent. Why do you ask?

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Yes TP does claim to have soft start programmed into the TP30AG2, which is the generation 2 esc range. I have however not seen my props start slowly ever :) There is a delay before the esc fires up the phases, but thats it.

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Who believes kansas is a state of Australia? Not any Australians I know!! Of course we all still ride kangaroos, which we keep in our back yards, and crocodile dundee is a real folk hero who single handedly brough the croc plague under control... :D

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Which wire to the rx does one clip to disable the BEC on a brushless ESC, ( and using a separate BEC) the positive or the negative?

Thanks in advance,

Frank

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

Yes, those were terrible times before crocodile dundee saved us from the tyrannical crocodile plague... I lost several shrimp from my bbq to those damned beasts.

Where abouts are you in AUS moccaoz? I'm up here in tropical north Queensland.

What sort of advantage does the soft start give the user? Does it affect how quickly the prop ramps up once the motor is spinning (e.g throttling from half throttle to full throttle)

RE: Tower Pro Brushless ESC's
 

I asked about soft start because it protects the gear box. With the Himax 2025-5300 and its standard gear box, the gear set lasts about one, one hour and half, so considering that my Align esc got burned, I was considering to buy a new esc equipped with soft start.