My first experience with CEN was the Nemesis and just recently the GST. From what I read in magazine articles the Nemesis was an awesome truck and ran almost flawlessly. I learned rather quickly that by no means was it a beginner truck. The magazine articles boasted of an easy starting pull start engine. I found it to be the most difficult 2-stroke engine to start in my life (I had huge blisters to prove it.) This was due mainly in part to the insane compression it comes with from the factory. After break-in it was extremely inconsistent in two respects. For one, the engine would run beautifully one day and horribly the next. It seemed as if the tune had magically changed overnight somehow. As of late it runs very strange with what sounds to be a lean condition. It sounds like it’s running out of gas with that signature funky idle sound, but the temps won’t climb at all. Then out of nowhere it will just stall. To put it simply, it’s totally frustrating. What I think is DEFINITELY adding to this engines extreme inconsistency is a very very leaky front main bearing. It’s been like this from day one but for some stupid reason I never got it fixed under warranty. I’ve had this happen with other motors during break in since a lot of excess oil is drained back into the crankcase and naturally a bunch leaks out of the front main bearing. The problem is, the Nemesis hasn’t stopped leaking since. In comparison to my GST (which I talk about later), this thing leaks A LOT. Another problem with the engine in the Nemesis was the heat sink head. After breaking the motor in, the back of the engine was doused in fuel/air mixture and it was making a huge mess leaving my exhaust manifold permanently brown. I first thought it might just be from the exhaust since the exhaust fluid kind of makes a mess of the back of the truck during break in, but I’ve never had such a mess near the back of the engine before. Believe it or not, three of the heat sink head screws had cracked loose resulting in a huge compression leak. This also added to the engine’s inconsistency but tightening the head screws definitely didn’t fix the poor running problem since the engine still ran unpredictably just like it had before. Bottom line, I have NEVER had heat sink screws loosen EVER. Secondly the 2-speed is very finicky. After babying the adjustments in very small increments I could have the transmission shifting PERFECTLY. Then the inconsistency reared its ugly head and the shift point got lower and lower until it was shifting like a regular car driving down a city street. At first I thought possibly the adjustment screws had backed out or something, BUT I found a) the screws adjustment was held in place by locknuts and b) I could tell from where I had adjusted the screws that they hadn't backed out a bit. This was quite annoying. I also installed the CEN 3-speed, which was a mistake since, from what I read, flaws were found in the clutch shoes and the spacing between them. From what I remember, two washers were installed between the shoes which made shifting into third more consistent. All I can say is that it would have been nice to have these alterations made to the 3-speed kit before having it put into mass production since like the 2-speed, the 3-speed was even more difficult to adjust. And just like the 2-speed, the shift from 2nd to 3rd came earlier and earlier every full throttle pass. If it's one thing that was a huge disappointment (besides the inconsistency of the engine), it would definitely have to be the shifting mechanisms in the transmission. Another thing to say about the Nemesis in initial quality would have to be the shocks. It seemed the minute it was out of the box, the shocks were already leaking. After break-in, the lower control arms had a good covering of shock oil on them. Of course at first I thought the stuff on the lower control arms was just exhaust fluid, but I knew for sure that it was shock oil because when the trucked was pushed up and down, the shocks made that all too familiar noise; the noise of air bubbles squeezing their way through the holes in the shock pistons. After awhile they were drained pretty well and I opted for the aluminum CEN upgrade shocks. Another huge annoyance was brake fade. After about a gallon and a half of fuel (including break-in), the brakes got worse and worse, little by little. From the beginning I had my endpoint adjustments PERFECT for both throttle and brake. As time went on, I found myself almost *****g out the endpoint adjustment on my brakes until it could go no higher and I was left with poor braking. Naturally I set my endpoint to a more moderate adjustment and adjusted the brake linkage. I made perfectly sure that the brakes were not dragging, and with the throttle left alone the truck would move freely when I pushed it forward. My brakes were pretty good again, but the same problem occurred shortly thereafter in which they started to fade. Now, the brakes seem kind of jumpy, like a car with a warped set of rotors; just another thing to fine tune. Also, the gear mesh between the two speed clutch bell and spur gears from the factory was off. This is due mainly in part to the shear impossibility of getting the mesh perfect between these gears. Right from the get-go I tried to get a better mesh and it was still off to my standards. I could adjust it perfectly for the first gear but the engineering behind the engine and mount design prevents the engine from being perpendicularly aligned with the gears. This results in great mesh with the first gear, but too much lash with the second gear. Also adding to the torture of attaining perfect mesh is the fact that the clutch bell gears wear at an EXTREMELY fast rate! Every tank of gas, the teeth would just get more and more worn down to the point where I would be adjusting gear mesh very often. Another addition to the list of drive train problems would be the clutch springs. I broke a total of four springs on two different occasions. The first time I thought I just got a bad batch and was very careful when installing the four new springs, not over-stretching them or forcing them to be installed properly. Contrary to my optimism, two out of the four brand new springs snapped only about a half gallon later and out came the engine for the fiftieth time. To give the Nemesis credit where credit is due, when it ran to its full potential, shifting from first to second to third gear it was absolutely amazing. I have never seen such a heavy truck pick up so quickly and go so fast in top gear. Also, the Nemesis (aside from the flaws mentioned above) comes very beefy from the factory. The plastic parts are heavy, the overall chassis design is nice and solid, and most of the drive train parts stand up to the abuse of a 5 hp engine pretty well. But of course, they do wear out and need to be swapped out accordingly. That much I can TRULY and HONESTLY say about the CEN Nemesis.

As for the CEN GST I recently picked up, some improvements have been made but there have also been some obvious cutbacks in quality. The most noticeable difference is by far and most certainly the new power plant. Contrary to the painful experience I had breaking in the Nemesis engine, the new black heat sink 7.7 engine started very easily for me. Although it does have a ton of compression when new, it still started a lot easier than the Nemesis. I’m still in the process of breaking it in, so I will have to comment back at a later time to inform you all of the consistency after break-in and so on. I will also have to comment at a later time about the consistency of the updated 2-speed and 3-speed in the GST’s transmission. Some problems with the Nemesis have also showed up in the GST. For one the plastic shocks STILL have not been updated/reengineered and still leak, leaving silicone shock oil all over the lower control arms. As I mentioned I’m still breaking the truck in, so it’s not like the shocks are being brutally beaten on. Another recurring theme with the CEN line is the gear mesh. Just like the Nemesis, the engine issue STILL has not been resolved and the mesh STILL comes off from the factory. It is still utterly impossible to attain perfect gear mesh, since like the Nemesis, the engine and gears are not perpendicular to each other. The mesh of the first gear will be good, but since the engine is slightly tilted to the left side of the truck, there will be too much lash between the second gears. It should be mentioned that getting the engine and spur gears in a perpendicular, 90-degree square fashion is inconceivable and therefore the gear mesh issue will not be resolved until something is done at the engineering table. I see it this way. If the mesh doesn’t come perfect or at least close to it from the factory, something has to be off with how the engine and mount bolts to the chassis in relation to the transmission. Other small problems with the GST include wheel alignment. The camber on both front and rear wheels is great but the toe in on the front wheels is off by quite a bit. The left wheel could be pointing straight ahead while the right wheel would be off by AT LEAST + 5 degrees and that’s being modest. Another small problem was the throttle linkage not being setup properly from the factory. One of the locking collars was placed incorrectly and the throttle only opened less than half way. I know some people will read these last two problems and say I’m nitpicking, but for me it comes down to attention to detail and I just can’t buy the argument that “it’s a truck for advanced hobbyists and requires mechanical abilities”. If I’m paying over $500, I automatically expect I’m getting what I’m paying for. I think requesting a properly setup throttle linkage and aligned front wheels for a $550 price tag is reasonable. Don’t you? There is also an aspect of the new GST where it is evident that costs were cut in one area to beef up another. What I’m referring to would be the Skyion radio. The Airtronics MX-3 radio that came with the Nemesis was an EXCELLENT FM radio, even for a more advanced hobbyist. I have to say, I haven’t had ANY PROBLEMS WHATSOEVER with the Skyion system thus far, but it’s an obvious attempt by CEN to cut costs and in doing so they replaced a super high quality MX-3 with a mediocre Skyion. As I said before I’m still breaking this GST in, so you will hear from me again on ANY other issues that arise, good or bad. I have to admit so far though; it looks like CEN is heading in the right direction with the GST.

I know this write up was rather lengthy but I really wanted to share my personal experiences with fellow CEN owners and give other people looking to buy a Nemesis/GST a heads up on what they might encounter. Another reason I decided to do this write up is because I sincerely believe the articles that mentioned the CEN Nemesis were HIGHLY biased and gave the truck FAR too much credit than it deserved. The magazine articles seemed like a hotrod show on television where they change a rusty exhaust system for example. In reality, the extremely rusty bolts are completely frozen in their threaded holes and are impossible to get out, but with the magic of television, the show hosts make it look as easy as cutting butter with a hot knife. The same applies for the Nemesis. It just seems like a coincidence that the reviewers ran into virtually no trouble and totally ran the crap out of the truck. I just figured I would voice my honest opinion and possibly help some people out. And of course, there are always two sides to every story so I HIGHLY RECOMMEND other forum members chime in and comment on what I have to say. There are no feelings to be hurt here.

ls7505, Most of your comments are pretty much my experience with both my neme & genesis, However I found that stuff fun to resolve given my passion for tinkering..however some of the things you mentioned kinda annoyed me to read because they are so minor, but you do bring up a good point. I also think CEN factories do need to make sure the settings to get started are accurate. The needles in the carb maybe not, due to the many different climates this truck is shipped to. However I believe the factory should at least start th engine before it leaves the factory just as quality controll. Mind you I have not heard or seen too many bad engines from the factory.

Regarding the reviews the media(magazines) have conducted, you have to keep in mind it does not bode well for them to do much product bashing of a manufacturer that spends alot of money advertizing in their publications, as well as there is a possibility that they are reviewing "prepped" equipement. If anyone bases their purchase solely on a private publications review I feel sorry for them, but too bad if they find they are unhappy with their purchase. thats what places like this forum, your local hobby shop and the neighborhood track are for...Asking Opinions of people who have owned the product. or at least had an opportunity to use it.

My point is, this kind of write-up is needed for all of those who are trying to make decision on their RC monster truck purchase. One thing you did not mention, and to be perfectly fair and truthful, it needs to mentioned. Their is so much support for this truck(this forum for example), CEN's tech support is one of the best I have had the pleasure to deal with...Also any rc vehicle has its new truck issues, the genesis line is no exception.


Good write-up,

I dont own a nemesis but i do own a matrix and i read alot of different stuff about the car that wasnt good but i have owned one now for 2 months and i havent had a real compliant about the car.not to say you havent encountered the problems you have but it could be manufacturer error or then again it could be owner error i dont know i just know the quality of the matrix in my book is very good.but i havent owned a car i didnt have to put a little tlc into for it to work properly, i would of sent the engine back and any other parts i had trouble with Cen has really good customer service so im sure they would of help you.

Dennis

Cen racing, TQ fuel

Wow, what a first post!! Firstly, I reckon a pat on the back for having the patience to write such a thorough and in-depth review. I also think its commendable that despite highlighting the shortcomings of the trucks, you did it in such a way as to inform, rather than just put the company down. Lastly, I think its cool that your first experience with the Nemesis didn't put you off getting a second truck. Welcome to the forum by the way!!

I would tend to agree with you on the point you made about the magazine articles. I surely wasn't expecting the magazines to badmouth the Nemesis, but I really thought the articles lacked truth. After awhile you have to ask yourself "What's the point of me reading this article if I'm not going to get anything of integrity out of it?" But like you said, radio control magazines really aren't the best place to look for a lot of downsides to a product.

And yes you're absolutely correct about the customer service. CEN tech support and Traxxas tech support are the best in the industry.

Thanks for the warm welcome. You pinpointed exactly what I was trying to do in not starting a flame-war or anything like that. I tried to present my points as fair as I possibly could without going on a temper-filled rage. I definitely purchased the GST looking for an improvement over the Nemesis and like I said, from what I'm seeing so far, CEN is heading in the right direction.

i have a nemesis very good review, even though i havent had some of the issue you have had. maybe except the engine at times gave my hands a beating. never had the shock issue and i run a 4 shock setup with a .28 engine. as far as clutch setup the nova aluminum shoes are well worth getting. the other things like needle setting and throttle settings thats miner and coman on most rc trucks since there mas produced. another thing like the servos there decent but well worth up grading i dont think there a true 144 oz of torque. i replaced my throttle servo with a hitec 645 rated at 140 oz of torque and it pulled and braked way better than stock. but i must say i have a lst2, revo, mgt, and my nemesis is by far the best built quality and toughness. the things they give you on this truck you would be buying to upgrade on the others to make them as tough as the nemesi.

heres a pic of my truck with a hot mod nova .28 just to show you that your not limited to what you can do with this truck

I have nothing bad to say about the stock clutch shoes. They didn't wear very much and stood up great to the immense heat produced from all the friction between the shoes and clutch bell. The problem I had was in relation to the clutch springs. I'm now on my third set so hopefully the third time's a charm. I will agree that the Traxxas Revo was really nothing special compared to the huge Nemesis and GST. I had a 2.5R Revo and it was somewhat fast and decent handling-wise but didn't impress me all that much. Now the 3.3 Revo I can't say anything about but the 3.3 engine itself is awesome. I will have to respectfully disagree where you say the Nemesis is "by far the best built quality and toughness" in comparison to the Team Losi LST2. I think the LST2 is without a shadow of a doubt one of the most technically refined monster trucks on the market. Quality-wise, it overshadows the Nemesis with flying colors. Both trucks are equally as tough and I definitely wouldn't say the Nemesis is tougher than the LST2 nor would I say the LST2 is more rugged than the Nemesis. YES, the LST2 is smaller with less horsepower but it's basically just as fast as a Nemesis (given the Nemesis still has a 2-speed), the acceleration is phenomenal and the handling is unmatched by ANY monster truck I've ever driven. This is due mostly to the LST2 being designed more as a race truck, so I really can't complain of the Nemesis not handling as good as the nimbler LST2.

Nice truck by the way. What problems did you have with the stock Nemesis engine that drove you to put a .28 in?

when i spoke of quality and toughness i was speaking on the thicknes of parts like arms and drive shafts. the fact they give you metal diff cups and diff cases front and rear steel breaks. these are things you would have to spend extra money on to get on other rtr trucks. as far as stock engine goes i didnt have much luck with it. even though i gave up on it early mainly because i wanted to race this big boy so i went to a .28 i use to run a lrp spec 2 in it until the engine died. wich ran very well in the nemesis as far as the lst handling better i dont know because i was only comparing parts visualy and my lst is a roller still. but if you compare part for part the nemesis has it in every way plus it was built to handle a much more powerful engine.

this is my lst2 will be up and running by christmas i want to make shore it get the best servos and a lrp spec 3 i like to buy once and buy right

i hope it drives as sweet as you say looking forward to getting it running i must say next to the nemesis its the only other truck that gives you good quality stuff right out of the box. as far as the revo goes i do love mine but it has cost me money in hopups. every time you turn around there selling you something different for it some good some bad mine is highley modded and wicked fast. but to me theres nothing like a big monster with huge power

If you like the Nemesis, I can't see you disliking the LST2 in any way. Like you said, unlike other RTR trucks, the LST2 comes with aluminum gearboxes, beefy outdrives, and good brakes. In my opinion, it's a great truck.

i defenetly will be making my lst2 a full racer like my nemesis. i defenetly prefer the nemesis with a .28 on it. i think when the gst 4.6 come out they will sell a lot more truck due to the fact there are more choices of engines in the .28 - .32 size

Only in RC are people allowed to come on someone else's message board and DESTROY a companies name and product like you have...FORE SHAME.

I had all the same problems you have described with my revo, savage and the LST2. What I have figured out is that a mass produced truck or car is put together by NON RC dudes who could give a **** less about what you do with your car or truck. Most of the time they have no idea what RC even is...

If CEN were to start every engine like you have asked, they couldn't sell the car as new anymore. Think about it. Also I am pretty sure you can't ship these massive boxes with nitro methanol in them. Just my observation.

I would love to know where you work so I can go to your website and complain about your products or services. Sorry you have to feel my wrath but I am tired of people posting only negative responses to a companies products. I'm not just talking about cens area here either, I see it in the HPI, and Traxxass, Losi, etc.

I like what dogman said about "tinkering" with his truck. You are entiled to your opinion like the rest of us, but IMO yours smells like ass.

hey racing dude!!!What crawled up your butt...I think my CEN trucks are the best thing since sliced bread!!!! Of course any Rc vehicle is going to have thier issues, and this forum is for write-ups like this...Dont be so dramatic with your comments. This is only a forum after all....Check your bloodpressure and relax..

I really do understand your passion for CEN, Really I do. I also understand that opinions are like _$$holes-everyone has one and they all stink- Even you have one..But damn..Relax

I work at Sierra Woodworks here in Tucson Wanna come on down for lunch and good complaint session..I will even buy lunch...But you have to be sure to complain loud an clear....To be sure your heard...I fyou want the telephone number to make an appointment with me I will PM it you, OK.

The only thing this forum is destroying is your calm!!! Damn

I wasn't trying to DESTROY CEN's company name or product. My comments were highly negative, I agree, but I did give credit where credit was due. It's my belief to comment on things how I see them and give people something else to look at, besides overly positive magazine write-ups, before buying a truck that requires more experience to operate and maintain.

Also, it was not my idea for CEN to start every engine before it leaves the factory, it was [email protected]'s idea.

I have absolutely no problem with tinkering. I've been in the R/C hobby for about five years now and find tinkering with my cars to be just as fun as driving them. In the past tinkering has always brought a change for the better to my cars. If you read my write up closely, I've done a lot of tinkering to no prevail.

Like I said, I didn't post ONLY negative comments. Wherever I saw a good quality to the Nemesis or GST I mentioned it.

WAS THAT GUY scary OR WHAT is it halloween already